Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => VSF Adventures => Topic started by: Doug ex-em4 on November 18, 2008, 01:24:35 PM
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I've never gamed VSF and at my age there's no chance I'll be starting but I find it fascinating. This board is always the first I go to on LAF.
What I'd like would be some suggestions for VSF fiction. I read The Difference Engine some years back and enjoyed it. Apart from that, I guess Flashman may qualify - not much SF in Flashy but certainly Victorian. I've read all Flashman's exploits (indeed, I'm old enough to have been reading them since they first appeared...!). So, leaving aside Flashy and The Difference Engine, what would you all suggest?
Incidentally, I notice on Wikipedia that The Difference Engine is described as Steam Punk. As a subsidiary question, could someone tell me what the difference is between VSF and Steam Punk?
Thanks
Doug
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In it's simplest form (and not entirely accurately)
VSF: Set within the Victorian period, or based on writings from the period. (For example: HG Wells - War of the Worlds)
Steampunk: A distopian setting which uses steam to power it's technology/magic. (The Webcomic - Freakangels, possibly the game Warmachine)
Things can be both VSF and Steampunk, but rarely are. (The Manga film Steamboy or the comic series Steampunk) Distopian and Victorian rarely go together.
As for books to read, I'm a fan of the Peshawar Lancers as a good setting book. It's set in the 21st century but after a disaster which means the Victorian period never ends.
Another good source is HG Wells, particularly his short stories.
Then of course there is Burroughs, his Mars and Venus books are the basis for much of what we do.
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Another interesting (and less expensive) should be:
http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=7990.0
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Good point, I should also point out that most of the Burroughs and Wells collections can be downloaded for free from ebook sites.
A short story I really like is "The Lord of the Dynamo's"
http://www.readbookonline.net/readOnLine/2158/
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I would recommend the League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, volumes 1 & 2. They are however graphic novels, but full of VSF goodness! (Not the dreadful film, it bears no resemblance to the novels)
Com on Doug, you start VSf gaming at any age... ;)
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Com on Doug, you start VSf gaming at any age... ;)
funds permitting !!!!
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Com on Doug, you start VSf gaming at any age... ;)
I'm almost submerged in the accumulated stuff of 38 years of wargaming and I'm now thinking that it'll be up to some other poor sod to heave it all down to the tip at some point - it doesn't seem fair to add more to it :D.
Also the standard of painting exhibited here is way above my 1970's level efforts - it's so good it's off-putting.
Getting back to the steam-punk thing, I notice a lot of steam-powered vehicles in VSF battles (such as the wonderful contrivances in the recently reported unpleasantness at Kew) so it's the dystopian aspect of steam-punk which doesn't cross over to VSF, not the steam-power. Correct?
Doug
Doug
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Correct. Advanced steam engines, Cavorite, Lift-wood, Aliens etc all fit in with the SF part of VSF (even if some of it is a bit far-stretched :) )
For Steampunk - the Punk part has to be evident, and it can be in any time/genre, it just has to use steam as it's focus.
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Also the standard of painting exhibited here is way above my 1970's level efforts - it's so good it's off-putting.
Doug
Don't let that put you off. I've got a friend who only ever paints with single flat colours layers: no shading; no highlighting. Individually they look fairly plain, but a squad on a table still looks very nice indeed!! :)
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If you would like to read really nice VSF/Steampunk stuff with both whimsy and humorous elements included, I would suggest to start with James Blaylock's "Narbondo" trilogy "The Digging Leviathan", "Homunculus" and "Lord Kelvin's Machine". If that suit's you, then over to Tim Powers "The Anubis Gates" followed up by K.W. Jeter's "Infernal Devices". 8)
These are my all-time favourites, and you could look up for more info here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_P._Blaylock (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_P._Blaylock)
Hope that helps. :)
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Buy this:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Tale-Great-1871-1914-Still-Come/dp/0815603584/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1224507710&sr=8-2
'What if' invasion stories, written in, and just after, the Victorian era.
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I would also recommend STEAMPUNK the comic book series by Cliffhanger, there are some gread illustrations in this series.
Then there is the 200AD comic book Nemisis, which allthough SF has a VSF tendancy.
There is also a Michael Moorcock book called The Warlord of the Air which I also enjoyed reading.
One more comic book - Luther Arkwight by Bryan Talbot.
Tony
http://dampfpanzerwagon.blogspot.com/
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Sorry about the spelling mistakes - I didn't read it before posting.
Tony
http://dampfpanzerwagon.blogspot.com/
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There is also a Michael Moorcock book called The Warlord of the Air which I also enjoyed reading.
I was going to suggest the Oswald Bastable books by Moorcock myself. The Land Leviathan??? Think there are at least three.
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Airborn by Kenneth Oppel
Tony
http://dampfpanzerwagon.blogspot.com/
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The Peshawar Lancers by SM Stirling.
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The Peshawar Lancers by SM Stirling.
I keep wishing he'd come out with a continuation of that book. :(
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There is also a Michael Moorcock book called The Warlord of the Air which I also enjoyed reading.
I was going to suggest the Oswald Bastable books by Moorcock myself. The Land Leviathan??? Think there are at least three.
The Steel Tsar is the other one.
A good VSF graphic novel is "Scarlet Traces," which is a sequel to "War of the Worlds."
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A good VSF graphic novel is "Scarlet Traces," which is a sequel to "War of the Worlds."
Ahh yes, I had forgotten that one, its a great read.
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Thanks for the ideas everyone. A quick on-line scan of Herefordshire libraries doesn't give much hope for finding any of the recommendations there (although I haven't searched for them all yet) so I've dropped a little money on Amazon to gt me started.
Doug
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Thanks for the ideas everyone. A quick on-line scan of Herefordshire libraries doesn't give much hope for finding any of the recommendations there (although I haven't searched for them all yet) so I've dropped a little money on Amazon to gt me started.
Doug
What have you purchased?
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[/quote]
What have you purchased?
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Just Peshawar Lancers and Digging Leviathan to start off.
Doug
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One more!
STARCROSS by Philip Reeve, a childrens story - but just full of fantastic illustrations. At 49 years old, I really enjoyed the humour!
Tony
http://dampfpanzerwagon.blogspot.com/
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I blame the kids books I read a few years ago for getting me into VSF - Phillip Reeves 'Mortal engines' series has a fairbit of steampunk insperation, even if the setting is more dieselpunk-post apocalypse... another good source are Phillip Pullman's 'Dark Materials' series, as these do have some good steampunk elements in a couple of the settings. (As kids... sorry, 'Young adults'... books, they should both be in the library :))
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Well, I'm jumping in late on this thread (as usual) but I just noticed that no one has suggested "The Strictest School in the World", by our very own Howard Whitehouse (sometimes known as Mexican Jack Squint)!
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The basic principle of Victorian Sci Fi (VSF) is that any technology that the writers of the era thought would work in fact does. Burroughs and Wells of course are the two main authors of the era.
The other idea is to read books about the actual time period and then sort of take off from there. Howard Whitehouses "Wars in Africa" is great. Byron Farwell did several books on the period, "Eminent Victorian Soldiers," "Mr. Kipling's Army", and best of all, "Queen Victoria's Little Wars." Don't confuse the latter for HG Wells' "Little Wars," which is essentiall the first set of war game rules. You might also read "War on the Nile" by Michael Barthorp, "Great Zulu Battles" by Ian Knight or "The Washing of the Spears" by Donald R. Morris. Neal Ascherson's "The King incorporated" is about the Belgain Congo. You might also pick up any book on the history of Canada, South America, Asia etc.
VSF has several rules sets for gaming, my favorite is Rampant Colonialism.
There is lots of modern alternate history set in this period, especially based around the idea of the Confederacy not being defeated in the Civil War (thereby becoming the Second American Revolution) The best is the book "How few remain" by Harry Turtledove, which then leads to a series of 9 more books that take the theme up to the end of WWII.
My game group here in Sacramento likes to take historical events and twist them into our VSF games. So we have had battles not only in Africa or Asia but lots of battles in Mexico and Canada. Mexico was occupied by British, Austrian and French troops in 1866. The Fenians (Irish American war veterans) invaded Canada in 1866 and again in 1870. The Meti rebelled in Canada twice and had armed attempts to secceed. All of these actual events make for great "what if "places to start a battle. Just add a few steam powered tanks and a gatling gun or two and you are off in your own little VSF world.
Please look at my recently posted VSF photos in the Tanks section of the Gallery
Good Luck
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Thanks for the ideas everyone. A quick on-line scan of Herefordshire libraries doesn't give much hope for finding any of the recommendations there (although I haven't searched for them all yet) so I've dropped a little money on Amazon to gt me started.
Doug
Can you not bring out an Em-4 VSF range and then claim your books as R&D expenditure ?
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leadfool -
Your VSF sounds very attractive and so are your photos - thanks. I've actually read several of the books you mention , The Washing of the Spears many times, but my quest to find source material as in my original post on this thread was not too successful. I ordered 2 books from Amazon; one was never delivered and the sellers had no other copies so that wasn't very useful and the other, the much recommended Peshawar Lancers, did arrive but it has failed to grip me. Altogether too many words in italics for one thing. I'll try and struggle through it but as an inspiration to VSF gaming it's a failure. Any randomly selected posts from this forum are far more inspirational.
Can you not bring out an Em-4 VSF range and then claim your books as R&D expenditure ?
:D :D :D
Doug
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A couple of late suggestions to the list:
"Mainspring" and "Escapement" both by Jay Lake. It's a fantasy quasi-Victorian world where the heavens literally are clockwork and the British Empire's greatest enemy is the Chinese Empire. Steam-powered gasbags of the Royal Navy, giant boring machines, Chinese coal-powered submarines, and other fun stuff. For the VSF feel, Escapement has more toys and there is a strong fantasy element to both.
Also Jesse Nevins is posting the text of a period "penny blood" on his blog. The story is "On the Queen's Service" and can be found here.
http://queenservice.blogspot.com/2008/12/blood-and-its-author.html
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You could also try The Space machine by Christopher Priest which combines The Time Machine with War Of The Worlds. There is also The Time Ships by Stephen Baxter, the authorised sequel to The Time Machine.
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Just to add to this rather large list which should empty your bank account nicely look out for The Rivals of H G Wells, you can usually find it on Amazon. Lots of short stories written during the late 19th early 20th century which will give you some good ideas for games/scenarios. One of the stories is a disaster yarn called the Thames Valley Catastrophe which makes for a good read.
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Not sure if this helps, but there is a fantastic listing of free books from this Australian site:
http://gutenberg.net.au/plusfifty-a-m.html#letterH
There are some excellent authors on there like the aforementioned Burroughs (who I'll be sure to check out after reading this thread) and R. E. Howard. Well, there's just heaps on there... so take a look!
Also thanks for the Turtledove mention, leadfool: my dad has a tonne of his books somewhere and I'll be sure to check them out now.
What a great thread!
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How about-Space Captain Smith by Toby Frost,Plenty of stiff upper lip.
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A late post to this thread, Firstly I would like to second the recomendation of "Anubis Gate" by Tim Powers, one of my all time favourite books.
Also should try "Affinity Bridge" George Mann
and why has no one mentioned "Space 1889" RPG and its Supplements, or the "Forgotten Futures" which is available as a free download here:
http://www.forgottenfutures.com/game/index.htm
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For VSF inspiration, of course Wells and Verne and Rice Burroughs from the classics. The film Steamboy is perfect VSF set around the Great Expedition in London with steam powered suits, tanks and massive battle fortresses.
The Mortal Engines series (Phillip Reeve) is good inspiration with zeppelins etc, but more diesel than steam powered.
I am reading a more recent book called Fitzpatricks War (Theodore Judson). This is a post apolcalyptic novel set in 2400. Electronics/electricity has become unusable and everything is now steam powered and the current Super power is very reminiscent of Victorian England. The story starts off a bit slow but seems to be picking up now that I'm halfway through.
Doing a quick websearch Theodore has also written a book called The Martian General's Daugther which I think is along similar dystopian lines.
Cheers
Fuzzy.
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Also should try "Affinity Bridge" George Mann
I'm glad you mentioned this one. I saw it in the bookstore the other day and almost picked it up. Now I'll have to go back and get it.
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Also should try "Affinity Bridge" George Mann
I'm glad you mentioned this one. I saw it in the bookstore the other day and almost picked it up. Now I'll have to go back and get it.
I just gave a quickie review of this in the "Newest Book" thread.
Say DFlynSqrl, forgive me if I've asked this before, but what part of Texas are you in? I'm in El Paso.
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I just gave a quickie review of this in the "Newest Book" thread.
Say DFlynSqrl, forgive me if I've asked this before, but what part of Texas are you in? I'm in El Paso.
I guess I missed this. I'll go check it out now. :)
I'm just 10 minutes north of Fort Worth in a teeny tiny town called Haslet.