caricature, proportion, & style

[secharles]

from observation, most 28 mm miniatures have physical caricature. I understand the original sculptor is responsible for this, and there are as many styles as sculptors.

but coming from 55 years of rivet counting scale modeling, how do I begin to produce sympathetic surroundings (general term I see is "terrain" although a great deal isn't). you know, "loosen-up" as Maynard G. Krebs* would say.

 I mean, even a oddly proportioned figure needs to fit through a door or in a vehicle. I know there's wealth of manufactured pieces, but modifying and building is where the fun is at for me.

I just need a gentle direction to begin the journey. thanks

*  https://images.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.trend-chaser.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2Fsites%2F7%2F2016%2F11%2Fdobie-gillis-12.jpg&f=1

[matakishi]

This is an interesting predicament and there's no quick answer.

The thing is to decide what you're trying to achieve, what are you making your scenery and terrain for?
Wargame scales are not consistent along all three axis. Even for a skirmish game length and width are compressed in order to fit a building/town/trench system/whatever on to a table top but height is usually scaled to the figures (roughly, often it's also undersized but not so much).
The only way to construct things for such a skewed world is to find what you're comfortable with. Personally I go with doors. I make my doors small enough/big enough so a miniature could probably fit through one. Then I build a compressed, shrunken building around that- again small enough to be usable but big enough so the doors 'could' realistically be part of it.

If you're making a display piece and you want it to scale exactly with your models then height seems to be the deciding factor. Ignore the squished plumpness of the miniature and concentrate on how tall it is. This is a peculiar approach as far as I'm concerned as the height of the miniatures is distorted by the angle at which they're typically viewed but it's what most people (including me) do nevertheless.

This changes with vehicles where the bulk of the miniature is considered so oversized cars are happily used because they 'look right' (they don't to me and this is a bugbear of mine which I'll not go into here). Oversized tanks are frowned upon though, go figure.

If you're a long time scale modeller you'll probably hate this. I imagine it looks like we're all messing about with play dough or something to create random shapes to your practised eyes.

[FramFramson]

(they don't to me and this is a bugbear of mine which I'll not go into here).

Oh, amen to that. There are so many small giveaway that drive me batty, that it took me ages and no small amount of treasure to assemble a fleet I was happy with.

[nic-e]

scale is off from the get go with wargaming. The typical wargaming table for a 28mm is no bigger than the floorplan of most office buildings or small warehouses and yet we'll put 4 or 5 buildings on it and call it a city fight, Or a dangerous desert. (This is my major scale bugbear.companies will sell "city" scenery that looks like the average Yorkshire village, complete with chinese restaurant. It's all abstraction of course, and suspension of disbelief is crucial, but come on, why not have your 6x4 table be the inside of some off world art gallery or depot station, then your terrain can be justifiably scaled .)

[Hobgoblin]

Lots of good points above. One "instant" fix I've found, scale-wise, is to use 15mm figures with 28mm floorplans, etc. In playing 15mm D&D with my kids and their friends, I've used 28mm floorplans throughout. There hasn't been a moment when things have seemed out of scale - yet.

[Cubs]

I made a Napoleonic inn once and I recall making the front door 25mm high, to fit with 1:72 scale (20mm) models. It seemed about right, but oddly it also worked for 25/28mm models too. But then it was only ever a scenery piece, not something for models to actually go inside, so no-one ever had to physically go through the door.

I did also make some Rohan huts for LOTR models and made the front doors on those 35mm tall, and they worked just fine as gaming pieces where models went inside.

I suppose my rule of thumb seems to be to make the door 25% taller than your 'scale to eyes' in mm, which seemed about right for my use.

[Elbows]

Simply put, some is necessity, and some is the stage makeup aspect of wargaming.  Making models properly scaled would put them beyond the painting skill of 80% of modelers/painters/gamers, and produce models with insanely small details and weapons/fingers/etc. which will snap if you look wrong at them.

Also, a properly painted and subdued/camo figure would disappear when on the table...but this is about spectacle (more or less).  When was the last time you saw a proper action movie which wasn't Hollywood as heck?  This is about entertaining people and producing something which photographs easily, and paints easier.

Also, a lot of it came from the fact that digital sculpting is a new thing and you can only sculpt so small with normal tools.

The stage makeup I mentioned earlier is a simple theatre thing.  If you ever see a stage actor up close you'll notice their make-up, hair, etc. is all wildly exaggerated - why?  So you can actually see it from 90-120' away, etc.

There are a few (very few) options in 28mm for more "correctly" proportioned miniatures, but most of that occurs in model lines at 1/48 or 1/35th scale etc.  Just a fact of life I guess.

[secharles]

lots of good points to consider, and some I hadn't. I do understand the practicality of lack of  and overbuilt details for gaming where the pieces will be constantly handled and toted about from venue to home and back again.

maybe I wasn't clear, or maybe the responses have provoked me to think more about what I am trying to accomplish. but I know this early in the sport that, too, will change!

not a gamer, but would enjoy a model railroad built to gaming standards. maybe a loco with Tin Tin & Snowy as engineer and fire-dog, being chased to the next station by Mata Hari in her long sleek roadster. it wouldn't have to make sense to anyone but me. why else would a Japanese submarine be surfacing off the coast with Sherlock Homes peeling the horizon for sight of survivors?

just trying to incorporate some new ideas, materials, & techniques into my modelbuilding as a way to alleviate stress - and stagnation, which sometimes comes from spending too much time and research getting a model built.

thanks for the good ideas.

[Daeothar]

For the longest time, I've had this idea to create a modern day zombie survival game/table, featuring my own house and surroundings, at 1/50 scale.

Why this scale? Because it's easy to calculate for one, but also, it's slightly bigger than the universally accepted 1/56 which should be 28mm. 1/48 vehicles would fit in pretty well (with 1/43 really stretching it), and architectural model stores carry a lot of furniture and other useful item to populate the building, in exactly that scale.

The thing I ran into first was, you guessed it; height. Not because of the minis themselves, but because of the bases.
Solved by using thinner bases, right?

Well then we get to the size of the bases; 25mm round bases in 28mm occupy a sizable area in real life; about 140cm in diameter. Which would prevent miniatures from moving through doors, as most common doors are about 80 to 90cm wide!

So now we'll need bases with smaller diameter (15mm?), but then we are digging into the practicality of bases, as too small a base will leave the miniature prone to toppling over.

And since part of the plan was to have miniatures of my regular gaming group start the game in my miniature game room, standing around a miniature wargaming table (obviously representing the same scene, in miniature miniature ), you can see where things get complicated and crowded really fast!

So whilst the plan of using a 1/50 scale is still sound, and making a true to life model of my own house is still enticing and cool, actually gaming in and around it would certainly pose challenges.

It would not be impossible, but your bog standard Space Marine would not be very practical to use on such a table. Then again; a brute like that probably would not need doors (as he'd make them by running through walls anyway ).

[Michi]

would enjoy a model railroad built to gaming standards. maybe a loco with Tin Tin & Snowy as engineer and fire-dog, being chased to the next station by Mata Hari in her long sleek roadster. it wouldn't have to make sense to anyone but me. 

That is something I could precisely advise you! 

I have done it and can now display a couple of periods and areas simply by deploying different trains and buildings like these (samples):

American Models "S" scale (1/64) freight train converted to run on H0/0n30 tracks of 16.5mm gauge instead of 22mm S gauge.

Bachmann 0n30 Mogul and coach

After 2 years of doing nothing on it I finally managed to finish it within two weeks and can show the photos.

This shows the board sanded and soaked in white glue:


Complete board, dried and ready for painting:


Painted in basic chocolate brown (three steps of highlighting drybrushes to follow after drying):


Finished board (drybrushed, the occasional static grass added and rails cleaned):








Switches to cut currency on the loops for marshalling more than one train on the layout:




Power intake:


And this is what it looks like when folded:

Wild West set-up on that table:


Victorian setup of that table:


Pulp setup of that table:



Read the complete AAR here: http://tableterror.blogspot.de/2014/05/trouble-at-area-51.html
(In case you like these teaser photos of course...)

[secharles]

anyone finish their figures - for show only - by eliminating the base and drilling a leg for a piece of wire which is inserted into the display surface?

that would be my method to get around base bulk (remember, they're not gamed). seems some fellows search out the elusive discontinued figure and I assume it would not be combined with "gen-pop".

weapons, at least in the provided overscale, would most likely go, too. although I have no objection to the occasional Webley or sap.

no dragons or Orwellian space monsters, but a gargoyle here or there would be fine. I do so like the idea of a train passing through a cemetery. there's one in my home town. well, it's the bike path built on an abandoned railroad roadbed, and the cemetery is only on one side, but it's the wrought iron gates and sculpted headstones pushed over by overgrown trees which make it interesting. and the river bordering its other three sides .... anyway, I appreciate the perspectives and input. thanks

[secharles]

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-2JWkF9RX2PE/Uzf2WHU_vRI/AAAAAAAAHCc/AhnUhnTcDiU/s1600/Bricklane+001.JPG

that's fantastic; thank you for the encouragement!

off to the link you provided for a good read. will most likely have many questions - thanks again.


..... and it even folds ...

[fred]

Great setup there Michi, very clever how you have been able to keep the railway terrain boards generic enough to work across a number of gaming genres / periods.

[FramFramson]

anyone finish their figures - for show only - by eliminating the base and drilling a leg for a piece of wire which is inserted into the display surface?

that would be my method to get around base bulk (remember, they're not gamed). seems some fellows search out the elusive discontinued figure and I assume it would not be combined with "gen-pop".

weapons, at least in the provided overscale, would most likely go, too. although I have no objection to the occasional Webley or sap.

no dragons or Orwellian space monsters, but a gargoyle here or there would be fine. I do so like the idea of a train passing through a cemetery. there's one in my home town. well, it's the bike path built on an abandoned railroad roadbed, and the cemetery is only on one side, but it's the wrought iron gates and sculpted headstones pushed over by overgrown trees which make it interesting. and the river bordering its other three sides .... anyway, I appreciate the perspectives and input. thanks

I've seen that done with trees or other scenery, and also with dogfighting aircraft miniatures, but never people. You really have to be willing to remake your terrain boards somewhat frequently if you go this route.

[Connectamabob]

I could see it working with a cloth mat over foam boards. Especially a cloth with a large open weave, like the teddy bear fur stuff. That would minimize the stuff that'd need to be rebuilt with use, as you'd just be replacing foam boards or cuotout shapes instead of fully built and painted stuff. Trouble would be with solid terrain pieces on top of the mat, or parts of a mat that were spackled/rubberized to look like dirt or concrete or whatever.