Back of Beyond and Asia... inspiration and moral support needed...

[Arrigo]

Ok,

moved home for the easter break and started too wonder about my next projects... and I have hit a bad mood/lack of inspiration... for years I have wanted to do some Back of Beyond, Boxer or China 1929 project and everything has been sidestepped by other "plans".

At the moment I have a decen collectio of adobe middle eastern buildinf and the paper oriental temple who can be used for china. I have also  WW1 Turks, British and Anzacs,  but I am out of inspiration... so guys and gals.. I need some ideas to expand this stuff in a more varied setting just to have a fall back from striaght on historical gaming... but due to a lot of stuff this year I will not have a lot of money and time  to pour into new projects... soo considering what I have available and what I can reasonably acquire with a limited budhet for a side project... what you suggest me to add to this stuff?

Arrigo

[Arrigo]

Uhm forgot to state that:

1) My turks and commonwealth are a mix of Woodbine and Battle Honours

2) I love international forcee (too much 55 days a Peking)

3) If the stuff to add can be used to firther some other projects the best...

4) stretching on the 30 I have a lot of japanese troops in WW2 uniforms and if someone has a good ranges of Brits in wolsley helmets that I can then use for Ethiopia 1940 and Malay even better... (planning to take at least a squad of Woodbine brits in Wolsley)

[Bullshott]

Welcome to England. There a lot of us over here and we're a friendly bunch. Since you have what sounds to be a good force for BoB and a lot of us already have (or are making) BoB forces, so all you need to do is find some opposition.

How about posting some photos of your Brits and Turks?

[Arrigo]

brits painted and I will take some decent (hopefully) pictures tomorrow, the turks  are only primed and are on the battle plan for this week... (btw the whole load of my force is in Italy and I doubt I will find a way to move it over the channel, especially in my single college student's room 

But as opposing forces what you would suggest?

[argsilverson]

If you go for an earlier setting like 55 days at peking/boxers rebellion you get the forces clad in much colourful fashion. You can have even British redcoats, Russian in white/green, Japanese in blue and so on. If your setting is after WW1 then the colours are more dull but you can play with khakis, brown, greays, green etc. I also love to have various 'international' forces and I am trying to have variations on the hues.

For the opponents you want:
Reds/Bolsheviks obviously -regulars, siberian rifles, irregulars/partizans, sailors etc
Turks of Enver Pasha -who tried to establish a new Turcoman Empire
Chinese Imperial, Kuomitang and/or warlord armies, they could also be engaged in some sort of civil wars
Mongol and various Asian irregulars
Persian types Muslims for the local Sultans or also various regular Afghans /Turcomans types. You can have these local Sultans also to employ Chinese, white Russians/Japanese/Germans as  advisors or even mercnaries.

Foes or Allies:
All the above, almost, plus:
Ungern-Sternberg's asian army
Anarchist bands
Bandits of any sort!

Allies:
Indian regulars
White Russian armies
French or even 
Greeks
US sailors and marines
British/Canadians/US in winter gear and so on

You can also add:
Czechs, Italians or even Spanish!

Figures:
Lots of lines available: Copplestone castings, Tiger Miniatures, Foundry, Brigade Games, Old Glory, Musketeer Miniatures, Anglian Miniatures, Irregular Miniatures, Gripping beast, Scarab Miniatures, Obelisk miniatures, Pulp figures  to name only a few!

I suggest you to check all the threads on BoB topic, lots of inspiration, links, infos and all useful  data.
I particularly advise you to check Ignatieff's reports! His battle/games reports are suberb, while lots others people have contributed magnificent ideas.
Also check for links and general information the WW1 boards!

As for Japanese:
In fact there is a lack of suitable Japanese figures for the era! Apart the sailors and the marines by Pulp infantry the other choices are earlier types or early WW2 ones. I suggest to use some of your Japanese mostly in soft caps (not quite suitable I am afraid) with bayonetted rifles and few automatic rifles. This will save you money. Otherwise is to convert Copplestone's Chinese.

Hoped to give you some ideas!   

[Poliorketes]

Read Corto Maltese: the golden house of Samarkand and you'll have loads of inspiration!

[Aaron]

Also try Peter Hopkirk. Everything he has done is great, but with your troops I think "Like Hidden Fire" might be best. http://www.amazon.com/Like-Hidden-Fire-British-Empire/dp/1568361270/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1239190432&sr=8-6

[argsilverson]

Read Corto Maltese: the golden house of Samarkand and you'll have loads of inspiration!

and see the DVD, too!

Also try Peter Hopkirk. Everything he has done is great, but with your troops I think "Like Hidden Fire" might be best. http://www.amazon.com/Like-Hidden-Fire-British-Empire/dp/1568361270/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1239190432&sr=8-6

Very good suggestions, both!

[Driscoles]

Find inspiration by some battle reports :

http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=3990.0

http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=5810.0

http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=9390.0

http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=8855.0

Cheers
Björn

[Arrigo]

Thanks for the tips, I have some ideas... I will kepp you posted 

[Mark Plant]

For the opponents you want:
Reds/Bolsheviks obviously -regulars, siberian rifles, irregulars/partizans, sailors etc
Turks of Enver Pasha -who tried to establish a new Turcoman Empire
Chinese Imperial, Kuomitang and/or warlord armies, they could also be engaged in some sort of civil wars
Mongol and various Asian irregulars
Persian types Muslims for the local Sultans or also various regular Afghans /Turcomans types. You can have these local Sultans also to employ Chinese, white Russians/Japanese/Germans as  advisors or even mercnaries.

Foes or Allies:
All the above, almost, plus:
Ungern-Sternberg's asian army
Anarchist bands
Bandits of any sort!

Allies:
Indian regulars
White Russian armies
French or even 
Greeks
US sailors and marines
British/Canadians/US in winter gear and so on

You can also add:
Czechs, Italians or even Spanish

Turks and Greeks as allies? Not on planet earth. Not even in BoB. In fact most of the alleged "allies" listed there were bitter enemies of the Turks.

The French and British were occupying Turkey after WWI, it being a defeated power and all. They would make decent enemies though, assuming some incident blew up during the occupation. But in practice that would not differ much from fighting a WWI game.

The Chinese and Ungern-Shternberg concepts involve a very ummm, flexible, attitude to geography if talking about the Turks. From Baku (the actual extent of Turkish penetration) to Ulaan Bator is 4,500 km. And China is a lot further. (If Chinese fighting Japanese, then it is hardly BoB, being WWII.)

The Czechs were long gone by the time the Turks are able to fight after WWI. White Russians were politically opposed to the Turks, so not suitable as allies. Despised the Japanese, so only those in it for themselves would fight with them: Semenov, Kalmykov and Ungern-Shternberg.

Enver Pasha was involved with the Basmachis, but it was too far for Turkish regulars to reach. (In this case a mere 1,000 km of the Soviet Union). He had no actual support from Turkey, nor would get any -- he was a political opponent of the regime of the time, who sought his head. (Hopkirk blows him up out of all proportion to his actual importance, though quite amusingly.)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The actual opponents of the Turks are: Greeks -- since they fought a long and bitter war with them. No issues with finding information on this war.

Armenians -- a short and bitter war. Georgians -- nearly a war. Non-Moslem Azerbaijanis and their British allies -- a couple of scuffles outside Baku. Not easy to find much about really, at least in English, other than the Baku fighting. The Italians briefly considered having Georgia as a condominium IIRC, which could be quite amusing. (Caucasian battlefields : a history of the wars on the Turco-Caucasian border 1828-1921 / W E D Allen & Paul Muratoff has a bit at the end. The struggle for Transcaucasia, 1917 - 1921 / Firuz Kazemzadeh is what you need for this theatre.)

There was an Armenian terrorist organisation inside Turkey prior to WWI. It was removed by the ethnic cleansing of that war (one of the reasons for it, actually) but would give some scope perhaps.

Incidents with Afghan regulars or tribes, and with the Persians were always a possibility. Still are, come to that.

The Bolsheviks were allies of the Turks, but could easily have become enemies. By now just the regular Red Army in the Union itself. They would probably start any fight over Azerbaijan. This would allow all sorts of Azeri cavalry and partisan peasant foot for the Turks, city militia for the Bolsheviks plus local naval troops.

A Bolshevik vs Turk blow up in the Caucasus would give the most promise IMO. Easy to find figures, a different terrain to fight on (oil fields, for example), enough colour to make it not WWI, tying into actual geography and history in some sort of sense. If you want to push realism, you can get things like fanatic Chechen or Daghestani  tribesmen coming to assist the Turks (not that unlikely actually).

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The Bolshevik option has the added bonus of being suitable for fighting Japanese at pretty much any time between 1919 and 1945, so would be opponents for both your current armies. The Japanese can expand to have Chinese, White Russian etc allies.

Any Azeri/Chechen tribesmen are suitable for opponents for Bolsheviks without Turkish support.

[argsilverson]

For the opponents you want:
Reds/Bolsheviks obviously -regulars, siberian rifles, irregulars/partizans, sailors etc
Turks of Enver Pasha -who tried to establish a new Turcoman Empire
Chinese Imperial, Kuomitang and/or warlord armies, they could also be engaged in some sort of civil wars
Mongol and various Asian irregulars
Persian types Muslims for the local Sultans or also various regular Afghans /Turcomans types. You can have these local Sultans also to employ Chinese, white Russians/Japanese/Germans as  advisors or even mercnaries.

Foes or Allies:
All the above, almost, plus:
Ungern-Sternberg's asian army
Anarchist bands
Bandits of any sort!

Allies:
Indian regulars
White Russian armies
French or even 
Greeks
US sailors and marines
British/Canadians/US in winter gear and so on

You can also add:
Czechs, Italians or even Spanish

Turks and Greeks as allies? Not on planet earth. Not even in BoB. In fact most of the alleged "allies" listed there were bitter enemies of the Turks.

The French and British were occupying Turkey after WWI, it being a defeated power and all. They would make decent enemies though, assuming some incident blew up during the occupation. But in practice that would not differ much from fighting a WWI game.

The Chinese and Ungern-Shternberg concepts involve a very ummm, flexible, attitude to geography if talking about the Turks. From Baku (the actual extent of Turkish penetration) to Ulaan Bator is 4,500 km. And China is a lot further. (If Chinese fighting Japanese, then it is hardly BoB, being WWII.)

The Czechs were long gone by the time the Turks are able to fight after WWI. White Russians were politically opposed to the Turks, so not suitable as allies. Despised the Japanese, so only those in it for themselves would fight with them: Semenov, Kalmykov and Ungern-Shternberg.

Enver Pasha was involved with the Basmachis, but it was too far for Turkish regulars to reach. (In this case a mere 1,000 km of the Soviet Union). He had no actual support from Turkey, nor would get any -- he was a political opponent of the regime of the time, who sought his head. (Hopkirk blows him up out of all proportion to his actual importance, though quite amusingly.)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The actual opponents of the Turks are: Greeks -- since they fought a long and bitter war with them. No issues with finding information on this war.

Armenians -- a short and bitter war. Georgians -- nearly a war. Non-Moslem Azerbaijanis and their British allies -- a couple of scuffles outside Baku. Not easy to find much about really, at least in English, other than the Baku fighting. The Italians briefly considered having Georgia as a condominium IIRC, which could be quite amusing. (Caucasian battlefields : a history of the wars on the Turco-Caucasian border 1828-1921 / W E D Allen & Paul Muratoff has a bit at the end. The struggle for Transcaucasia, 1917 - 1921 / Firuz Kazemzadeh is what you need for this theatre.)

There was an Armenian terrorist organisation inside Turkey prior to WWI. It was removed by the ethnic cleansing of that war (one of the reasons for it, actually) but would give some scope perhaps.

Incidents with Afghan regulars or tribes, and with the Persians were always a possibility. Still are, come to that.

The Bolsheviks were allies of the Turks, but could easily have become enemies. By now just the regular Red Army in the Union itself. They would probably start any fight over Azerbaijan. This would allow all sorts of Azeri cavalry and partisan peasant foot for the Turks, city militia for the Bolsheviks plus local naval troops.

A Bolshevik vs Turk blow up in the Caucasus would give the most promise IMO. Easy to find figures, a different terrain to fight on (oil fields, for example), enough colour to make it not WWI, tying into actual geography and history in some sort of sense. If you want to push realism, you can get things like fanatic Chechen or Daghestani  tribesmen coming to assist the Turks (not that unlikely actually).

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The Bolshevik option has the added bonus of being suitable for fighting Japanese at pretty much any time between 1919 and 1945, so would be opponents for both your current armies. The Japanese can expand to have Chinese, White Russian etc allies.

Any Azeri/Chechen tribesmen are suitable for opponents for Bolsheviks without Turkish support.

Sorry if I mislead you:
You are right Greece were never allied to Turkey, before the foundation of NATO ! yes, now we are allies!

My post was to give only few outlines. I noticed what miniatures Arrigo has, but based on the British/commonwealth minis he has , I forgot the Turks. But in BoB some Turk mini can be considered as mercenaries/militias/local raised troops armed with whatever surplus their masters had. Reds fought Ungern Sternberg. There was one plot to combine Enver Pasha with Ungern-Sternberg to raise a new Empire. If not we can invent them.

BoB can accept lots of fantasy/alternative history outlines. 

[sukhe_bator]

Don't forget to check out the Colonial forum - there's considerable crossover i.m.o. and it is a good source of inspiration...

[Doomhippie]

My advice is to start small. Finish a dozen or so minis and then come up with some story for them: enemies, how they came to be where they are, friends, replacement etc.
And once you have some ideas - paint those new guys. At least that helps me gettings things done.

Then again, maybe you like 'em big - I mean the battles. That means a lot more painting first... very frustrating for me.

[Mosstrooper]

Started my BOB gaming about 18 months ago using Triumph & Tragedy and about 24 figs per side and a few personality figures - brilliant games ! . Got over 200 figs now ( and still going !) , starting small works