Is Nobody Big Battling Anymore?

[Captain Blood]

I wonder whether over time, as a society we have become more inclined to instant gratification and less inclined to put the hard slog in.

I think it's a racing cert. Many wargamers have been conditioned to crave off-the-shelf systems / rules / figures / packages that involve the minimum of creative effort or original thought on their part, and which give an instant way into a new gaming genre.

[Plynkes]

You say that like it's a bad thing.    I'm not so sure it is entirely pertinent to the big battle discussion, though. Tangentially, yes, but not on the nose of the point.

For you can (and they do) do big battling with an all-encompassing Warhammer-style "spoon fed" system just the same as one where you researched, wrote and self-published the history of the conflict yourself, designed the rules, sculpted and cast all the figures and hand-built all the terrain.*






*I was going to add "started the war yourself by assassinating a passing archduke" but I thought that might be labouring the point a bit. 

[nic-e]

I wonder whether over time, as a society we have become more inclined to instant gratification and less inclined to put the hard slog in. I can put a computer game up and not even read the rule manual to start playing, I just feel my way along and if I like it ect ect....

Not to dismiss this argument, But plato said the same thing about books, claiming that they made people too lazy to remember things.

[Arlequín]

Their payment was super promt. I got £20 a page under Henry Hyde, but that has since dropped to £15 a page under the new editor (not his decision I would imagine).

By value / worth, I was making the comparison with blog writing, for which one is largely taken for granted.  

The NUJ guidelines for a small circulation magazine are £250 per thousand words (apx two pages), with £140 per day for original research (i.e. not plagiarising secondary and tertiary sources). Okay many write for far less than that, but not as low as £30-40 per thousand words.

If the rate is far below what you would need if you did it full-time as your main income, then you are being exploited.

But anyway, this has little to do with big battling.

For you can (and they do) do big battling with an all-encompassing Warhammer-style "spoon fed" system ...

I seem to recall Evil Corp tried that, but only the parsimonius established players, who maybe bought one new mini a year* took it up. The oxygen-bearing new gamers generally found the entry cost of buying an actual 'big battle army' from scratch way too high.

* Okay maybe some bought two a year, but you know what I mean.  

[Gibby]

I think that we tabletop gamers have been getting more lazy (myself included, to be sure) in recent years when it comes to rules as much as with pursuing creative and original thoughts with miniatures. The desire for simplicity in wargame rules has become a bit of a defining standard in many peoples' minds to the point where I sometimes think people are happier creating beautiful dioramas that they can push models around and roll dice for, with only a passing nod to the flavour or feel of the period being depicted (whether historical or fantasy). I think that [small scale] skirmish games by their very nature are way more tolerant of this, whereas "Big Battle" games often require a deeper level of simulation and nuance to provide the correct period flavour to feel "right". That, combined with the more "instant gratification" habits of our culture today, possibly steers people away from "Big Battling" even before considering the work that goes into painting hordes of figures.

For the record, I'm not saying that simplicity automatically robs a game of period flavour or narrative drama. But when some of the most popular rulesets on the market are just reskinned versions of the same basic engine and yet seek to bring forth the right feel with minimum effort on the part of the designer, I have to wonder if Big Battles nowadays just require too much effort on the part of both the creators and the consumers to meaningfully compete with the small scale, skirmishy games that are in ascendency.

[Arlequín]

Agreed and indeed, you could pick up virtually any set of historical big battle rules and some appropriately sized painted wooden blocks and call it whichever period you like.

Figures are more visually attractive of course, but you really could use a pencil to cross out and replace terms to alter a number of 'period-specific' rule sets to another.

[FierceKitty]

I'll just stick in that I've downscaled in the last decade to 10mm, and with the exception of WWI air combat I never play with fewer than 200 figures a side (that's a very small one, mind you). I am far-sighted and arthritic, and manage to paint a lot of detail (better than the Airfix figures I also suffered with in my salad days), producing spectacles which the seven regular gamers we have in my little group (representing four continents, since our token Aussie went home) all find very rewarding.

In short, I nail my colours to the mast as a big battles gamer, and I don't think I'm the last of my species. I'd say larger figure scales are for RPGs, and (given how many armies I have, from NKE to western desert) for millionaires. And good luck to them; the world is big enough for all of our tastes.

[syrinx0]

My gaming group still puts on some big battles in 28mm but they are fewer.  Our largest 28mm collection by far is WWII figures. We often have had large engagements with hundreds of figures a side.

Earlier this year it was around 700 ancient greeks in an all day grinder, followed by a Dacian vs Roman campaign with about 400 figures in several battles. 

Last big GW 40K Armageddon battle was in 2016 and had several hundred IG alone on table (plus tanks) vs over 200 eldar with Titans. To Arlequin's point, I spend quite a bit in terrain as well as on their new books. Being an IG collector there really has not been a lot to get from GW lately as they are obsessed with boring marines of various flavors. I have to admit though most of the others are not adding anything to their GW collections.

Only problem with these big games is the setup and duration of the game.  With fewer people in our club now days and the kids off at college, it is hard to get enough guys who can commit to play large games.