Men Of Bronze

[AndrewD]

Yes, Chariot Wars does sound interesting!

[Szary]

Personally, I would be way more interested in a chariot wars game than a late roman one, but I am also acutely aware that the second one is immensely more probable to sell well and garner interest. It would be immensely popular among all seven people playing in the period, through! 

The great value of MoB is that it's centred on a specific era of history and delivers some flavour on its particularities through events and Arete. Your special rules for Etruscans or Indians are already more involved than what you get in any DBA/WMA list, which would be just differently proportioned and arranged same elements. I would hardly commit to another project centred around the Egyptian New Kingdom if it would play just as Hittites, Parthians or Gauls. Most of the ancients systems are very generic and kind of soulless.

Viking wargames are so abundant after Saga exploded that segment, that at this point I am afraid to open my refrigerator in fear of finding there another Viking-centric system. But maybe I am jaded because of my limited interest in that particular subject - it would probably sell even better than either of the other two.

[Easy E]

The chariot wars in particular. Is this for a big kadesh type game or something smaller scale?

Well, to be 100% clear, I say Chariot Wars but it is really focused on Assyrian and Neo-Assyria and her enemies.  Therefore, no Minoans, Sumerians, and Myceneans for the most part. 

The game itself is 100% scale and model agnostic so you can scale it up as big or as small as you want.  Since it is a unit-on-unit game it depends on how you define a unit for yourself and all measurements are generic Measurement Units.  Therefore, if you use 6mm models on 60mm x 60mm bases and each base is a unit.... well, it can get to be a very big battle if you wish!  However, typically a game is 5-8 units per side, which translates to any number of models depending on what scale models you want to use!   

The key feature of such a game in my mind is the following:
1. How do you make Chariots the premier weapon system, and how do you differentiate light from Heavy!
2. The Bow (and firepower) played a much larger role in Chariot Warfare than traditional Western Warfare, so how do you do that?
3. This is a transitional period!  Iron weapons, Cavalry, Chariots, bows, standing armies, and even battle formations are evolving and/or new.  How do you capture these changes?
4. Finally, the details on this period can be scant and hard to come by.  That itself makes it very interesting and challenging at the same time. 

I have started playtesting and editing these rules.  However, in prep for them I do need to find some good models.  I was actually hoping to go 6mm so if you have suggestions I am all for them!   

[Easy E]

Back to Men of Bronze for a moment.....

I added Army Lists now for....

Carthage
Magna Graecia
Thessaly
Thracians
Pre-Reform Macedonians
and
Etruscans

Who else do you think would be suitable to add a list to for Men of Bronze. I was toying with the idea of Argos but I am not sure I have enough "there" there to make it work. They can be pretty much a standard City-State list.

Lydians, Aetolians, Carians? I am not sure there is enough detail to differentiate them from a standard list?

Your thoughts?

[Szary]

Whilst all three would be interesting (but indeed it's hard to know whether there is enough detail to warrant an army list for Aetolia or Lydia without further research) I have two other propositions:

1) Crete enters a time of political turmoil of warring, weak and exhaused states. While much of it falls under the time covered in HtE, mechanically it seems to be more akin to MoB mechanisms of warfare than bigger, more advanced and more flexible armies of Hellenistic Empires.

2) I would love to see you take a second, closer look on Persian Empire. Maybe differentiate between satrapal armies and forces of invading monarchs? Persians in a way got a shorter end of a stick here and they were a powerful and diverse fighting force that gave Greeks a hard run for their money.

[Emir of Askaristan]

There were mercenary/allied hoplites serving in Egyptian armies (30th dynasty vs Persia). Greeks in the Crimea and so contact with cimmerians and bosphorans. 

It's been a while since I looked at the rules, so apologies if you've covered these areas or they form parts of other lists.

[Easy E]

Great call outs! 

Revisiting Persia makes sense since they also evolved a lot. 

I know little about Crete and Egypt in this timeframe, so those sound like interesting threads to pull on.  Thanks guys!


Edit:
Re: Egypt- There is a lot of Late Period Egyptian action going on against the Persians and in the Wars of the Delian League, but precious little about the Egyptian forces at all!

The Battle of Pelusium (525 BCE) seems to have a lot of colorful details, just no information on the actual combatants!  I have no idea how the Egyptian forces fought and their Carian, Ionian or later Athenian Greek allies integrated with the Egyptian forces?  Were they Hoplites, Peltasts, skirmishers, slingers/archers, cavalry? 

Who knows?  Anyone got some good sources? I think in this case, I am going to need secondary sources mostly.  The primary sources seem lacking in the details I would want for an army list.

[Easy E]

I spent some time doing initial research on Crete, and it looks like Crete during the time of Men of Bronze fell into the pretty standard model of City-state warfare captured in the main Men of Bronze book. 

In the Hellenistic Period and early Roman Period it became a much more active player as it fell in and out of the orbit of Ptolemaic Egypt, the Romans, the Rhodians, or others.  Therefore, I am not sure there is much "There" to add for Crete to Men of Bronze at the moment.

Next up, I am working on a second look at the Persians as they evolved over time AND I was thinking of putting together a campaign book for the Ionian Revolt......

 

[Easy E]

My most recent Line-of-Battle on the Blood and Spectacles blog was for the Etruscans. 

I spent a bit of time kitbashing together various Victrix models to try and put an Etruscan unit together that had axe men, and hoplites with javelins in hand.  Here is what they came out looking like....



Sadly, I thought I had some left over shield transfers from my Greeks, but I could not find them for these guys. 

Since they are kit bashed from Mercenary Hoplites, Republican Romans, Spartans, Greek Light Cavalry, and Vikings they are probably not 100% "authentic" since I ma using gear and weapons from across a broad expanse of time.  However, I think they will do the job of showing the "Disruption" special rules and look unique enough on the table to make it work. 

Your thoughts?

[VonAkers]

Guys
I love these rules.
Easy to read , play quite well , and are quite elegant.
There is one thing for us that really stands out, and no one else has mentioned .

 That is the "Look "

 We found that even 4 Hoplite units a side , plus a few skirmishers and a cav unit or two , with some nice terrain , and bingo it looks like a Museum quality diorama 
We were quite surprised how few figures (80  each ) could look so good ., without much effort.
It also gives you some use for those nice terrain  pieces you may have that dont really fit in other games .
Cheers

Cheers .

however that everyone has either not talked about

[NurgleHH]

One question from an owner, but not really playing it (maybe it could happen). Is there any good army-Lists for Sumerian and akkadians???

[has.been]

army-Lists for Sumerian and akkadians???

Definitely people, cuz, 'To Ur is human' 

[Easy E]

One question from an owner, but not really playing it (maybe it could happen). Is there any good army-Lists for Sumerian and akkadians???

Nope, not for Men of Bronze...... that is too early for the rule set at the moment. 

Thanks to everyone's help, Thanks to everyone's help, I published a supplement on Wargame Vault for Men of Bronze.  This includes all the new Lines of Battle for areas outside of Greece proper, the FAQ, and Campaign rules for you to play. 

To pick-up the supplement, you can go to the Wargame Vault Here:
https://www.wargamevault.com/product/349063/Hercules-Abroad--Men-of-Bronze-Supplement

[Happy Wanderer]

"One question from an owner, but not really playing it (maybe it could happen). Is there any good army-Lists for Sumerian and akkadians???"

...army lists for battle games but can easily be adapted to MoB...
https://sumer2sargon.wordpress.com/

 

[NurgleHH]

"One question from an owner, but not really playing it (maybe it could happen). Is there any good army-Lists for Sumerian and akkadians???"

...army lists for battle games but can easily be adapted to MoB...
https://sumer2sargon.wordpress.com/

 

Thank you very much, great Website with a lot of information.