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Author Topic: How Dense Are Your Lost World Jungles?  (Read 7831 times)

Offline Cacique Caribe

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How Dense Are Your Lost World Jungles?
« on: August 18, 2019, 04:41:46 PM »
Do your preferred rules favor or discourage the use of very thick jungle growth?

Are your ruins easy to spot on your table, or are they hidden and grown over with all manner the jungle vegetation?

What percentage of your table would you say is covered by jungle trees, vines and bushes?  And why?  Does thick growth work for or against your overall goals in your games?

Inquiring minds want to know.  Well, at least this one.  :)

PS.  Also, I really like how these gents found excellent ways to “tone down” the colors of their lush assortments of plastic vegetation:

http://1000footgeneral.blogspot.com/2017/06/making-jungle-terrain.html

https://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=115696.msg1449327#msg1449327
« Last Edit: August 20, 2019, 06:32:49 PM by Cacique Caribe »

Offline has.been

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Re: How Dense Are Your Lost World Jungles?
« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2019, 05:18:54 PM »
It depends on the game.
I have used the following:-
1) Dense clumps with pathways in-between, & if anyone enters the dense clumps
    they disappear from the game. They may/may not reappear. I feel free to
    Kreigspeil this, e.g. exit table pursued by a tiger or reenter game at a point of
    my choosing when I feel like it/ they get the right dice score, minus something
    (weapon, ammo, water, arm or leg etc.
2) Outlines (to show limits of jungle) then move clumps around as troops move
     (slowly) through the jungle.
3) Several clumps together to make a total barrier, which makes a limit on table of
    what players  can see & where they can not go.
4) Clumps are great for ambush games, e.g. Viet Nam when a US patrol does not
    know where the attack will come from, or even if it will come. Heavy on the nerves.
 

Offline Dr DeAth

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Re: How Dense Are Your Lost World Jungles?
« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2019, 05:42:41 PM »
Do your preferred rules favor or discourage the use of very thick jungle growth?

Are your ruins easy to spot on your table, or are they hidden and grown over with all manner the jungle vegetation?

What percentage of your table would you say is covered by jungle trees, vines and bushes?  And why?  Does thick growth work for or against your overall goals in your games?

Inquiring minds want to know.  Well, at least this one.  :)

PS.  Also, I really like how these gents found excellent ways to “tone down” the colors of their lush assortments of plastic vegetation:

http://1000footgeneral.blogspot.com/2017/06/making-jungle-terrain.html

https://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=115696.msg1449327#msg1449327

Coverage depends on hills, if I have hills on the table that are over 3" high I use 50-70% coverage, lower than 3" 30-50% and -10% from those figures if there is a coastline in play.  Rivers up to 3" wide add 15%, 3-12" wide add 25%.

So depending on hills and rivers and coasts, between 20 and 95%

This is based on annualised rain fall in the tropics and (obviously) assumes there are no active logging industries in the area.

Also, don't forget we're talking Jungles here and not rainforests, I use different calculations for each  http://www.differencebetween.net/science/nature/difference-between-jungle-and-rainforest/
« Last Edit: August 18, 2019, 05:47:35 PM by Dr De'Ath »
Photos of my recent efforts are at www.littleleadmen.com and https://beaverlickfalls.blogspot.com

Offline Thunderchicken

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Re: How Dense Are Your Lost World Jungles?
« Reply #3 on: August 18, 2019, 07:06:51 PM »
Coverage depends on hills, if I have hills on the table that are over 3" high I use 50-70% coverage, lower than 3" 30-50% and -10% from those figures if there is a coastline in play.  Rivers up to 3" wide add 15%, 3-12" wide add 25%.

So depending on hills and rivers and coasts, between 20 and 95%

This is based on annualised rain fall in the tropics and (obviously) assumes there are no active logging industries in the area.

Also, don't forget we're talking Jungles here and not rainforests, I use different calculations for each  http://www.differencebetween.net/science/nature/difference-between-jungle-and-rainforest/


           

Dr De'Ath, as you know we agree on most things but I feel you are presenting slightly misleading facts. Have you considered the standard conventions regarding forest density as drawn up in the treaty of 1925? They state, and I am paraphrasing here, that density cannot be to the detriment of any person or persons exploring the forests. Examples being getting hopelessly lost with no chance of survival or getting stuck between two trunks recklessly placed too close together. Such reckless actions could lead to litigation against the individual or individuals in legal possession of the said forest. In this case I am of course assuming The Lost World is owned by Messers A C Doyle.


We're good friends but in this instance I must send a shot across your bow and warn you against half baked advice regarding density above 75%.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2019, 07:08:26 PM by Thunderchicken »
Don't!

Offline marianas_gamer

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Re: How Dense Are Your Lost World Jungles?
« Reply #4 on: August 18, 2019, 07:54:59 PM »
I have to agree with the good Doctor. There was a reason that "lost cities" went undiscovered by Europeans for hundreds of years. I have spent a good deal of time in jungles in the Pacific. They can be unbelievably difficult to move through and limit sight to a couple of feet. God help you if you get into false rattan. It will restrict movement to a couple of feet per minute, exhaust you, and may eventually totally entangle you. Once I chopped one with a machete and the strand parted with a twang. Like a snapped cable it ripped my glasses off my face and left a welt. I spent 45 minutes looking for my glasses, never found them and had to navigate out half blind on compass headings.  Now imagine having to get a column with baggage through that.
Got to kick at the darkness till it bleeds daylight.

Offline tin shed gamer

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Re: How Dense Are Your Lost World Jungles?
« Reply #5 on: August 18, 2019, 08:17:14 PM »
I have to agree with Marianas ,Jungle is hareful stuff .The ground doesn't stay where it's supposed to . The green bits try to eat you.and not matter what you hit it with, it doesn't scare easily.  wildlife regardless of its size sees you as lunch
Long before anyone tries to give you lead poisoning.

Personally I've been musing over how to represent jungle warfare. For me the closest representation is something between a very green space hulk and a dungeon crawl where the walls and the floor can do you a mischief everytime you move.Only to walk into a room with no visible exits.

Offline Cacique Caribe

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Re: How Dense Are Your Lost World Jungles?
« Reply #6 on: August 19, 2019, 02:22:31 AM »
Before I forget ...

I conducted a little experiment this afternoon/evening, following a little advice from my wife.  After soaking a stack of plastic foliage in detergent water for a while, and then thoroughly rinsing and drying, I wanted to brush on a light brown wash on the leaves.  However, as a test, I sprayed half of them with Krylon Matte Varnish BEFORE brushing on the brown wash.  The results were much, MUCH better than if I had simply put the wash on by itself.

I will still do a final spray of the Krylon at the end, to protect and seal everything in place of course.

Thoughts?

Dan
« Last Edit: August 20, 2019, 06:32:19 PM by Cacique Caribe »

Offline Sinewgrab

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Re: How Dense Are Your Lost World Jungles?
« Reply #7 on: August 19, 2019, 05:21:49 AM »
Let them sit for about a week - I have had them go sticky, like Reaper's Bones, but not consistently, so watch for that.
"There is no known cure for the wargaming virus, only treatments with ever increasing doses of metal."

Offline Dr DeAth

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Re: How Dense Are Your Lost World Jungles?
« Reply #8 on: August 19, 2019, 07:42:34 AM »
Dr De'Ath, as you know we agree on most things but I feel you are presenting slightly misleading facts. Have you considered the standard conventions regarding forest density as drawn up in the treaty of 1925? They state, and I am paraphrasing here, that density cannot be to the detriment of any person or persons exploring the forests. Examples being getting hopelessly lost with no chance of survival or getting stuck between two trunks recklessly placed too close together. Such reckless actions could lead to litigation against the individual or individuals in legal possession of the said forest. In this case I am of course assuming The Lost World is owned by Messers A C Doyle.


We're good friends but in this instance I must send a shot across your bow and warn you against half baked advice regarding density above 75%.

My Dear Thunderchicken,

The treaty of 1925 doesn't apply in this instance as it relates to Forests, not Jungles.   If the OP had asked about Forest Density then of course we'd refer to the 1925 Treaty and I'd agree with your 75% position, but they didn't.

Consider the shot across the bows re 'half baked adviced' returned with double the density (pun intended  lol) for such a schoolboy error.

Dr De'Ath

« Last Edit: August 19, 2019, 10:45:15 AM by Dr De'Ath »

Offline War Monkey

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Re: How Dense Are Your Lost World Jungles?
« Reply #9 on: August 20, 2019, 02:40:49 PM »
Going with my own experiences with jungles in Central  and South America, ì agree depending on the amount of annual  rainfall can make a difference of how heavy  or lite the jungle can be, but terrain has an effect as well. I found that in the low grounds and valleys it was thick and heavily  dense, and along the rivers as well, on the hill and mountain  sides it was lighter and on the ridge line it was very light very much easier  to travel as long as it was running along the direction you were traveling. Traveling the low ground the jungle was so heavy at times it was almost as dark as night under it's canopy then you come out into an opening of a huge field of 8 feet or taller grass of sorts that would take three men working together with their own body weight to lay it down to make a path. If you hit a bamboo  forest just go around it, sure they look all small and easy to cut, then after a couple of yards they get bigger and thicker and now it takes a minute or so to cut one down and you have to pull it out of your way just so you can get to the next one yeah just go around. Don't go around big hills and such you make better traveling time going up and over them.

Anyway  that's  been my experience  with jungles, hope it helps.

Doug
Just remember "If the Enemy is in range, so are YOU!

http://silo1313.blogspot.com/

Offline Cacique Caribe

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Re: How Dense Are Your Lost World Jungles?
« Reply #10 on: August 20, 2019, 06:31:25 PM »
Doug

Growing up in the Caribbean, where there are no large mammals to make trails that people can then exploit and widen for generations after generations, my brother and I used to go “exploring” out deep in the hills and through some decent woods.  Sometimes the woods were so thick that we were force to instead head down to streams and wade along, just until we bypassed some of the denser clumps trees and vines, specially if the vines had long sharp needles.

We once came across a very wide but relatively narrow thicket of bamboo that we had spotted from above earlier.  We could could have gone around it, but we didn’t want to lose time walking so much. Our machetes were extremely sharp when we started cutting (at 8 and 13-years of age we were very accustomed to carrying and using very sharp machetes), but these quickly dulled.  And we quickly tired, exhausted actually. Yes, best to bypass those bamboo spots.

Dan
« Last Edit: August 20, 2019, 06:40:25 PM by Cacique Caribe »

Offline War Monkey

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Re: How Dense Are Your Lost World Jungles?
« Reply #11 on: August 21, 2019, 03:32:18 AM »
For most part good times I had in the jungles down there, tried to stay out of the streams, to many things in the water, depending where I was at, I much rather deal with  the critters on dry land, then those under the surface of the water.

One of my best memories was breaking  through  the jungle traversing a steep hill side and coming across a waterfall, that poured half way down into a large pool which then poured the rest of the way to the bottom to a larger pool, then run on down to the rest of the jungle it was picture perfect, like a postcard or something  out of a traveling ad, and the thought  that I  and those whom I was with were most likely the only to have been there in decades, for I did see any signs of anyone else ever being there.

Offline War Monkey

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Re: How Dense Are Your Lost World Jungles?
« Reply #12 on: August 21, 2019, 04:11:15 AM »
By the way Dan you should share your mangrove project here!

Offline Hammers

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Re: How Dense Are Your Lost World Jungles?
« Reply #13 on: August 21, 2019, 08:00:21 AM »
I am old school, I like a dense bush.

Offline has.been

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Re: How Dense Are Your Lost World Jungles?
« Reply #14 on: August 21, 2019, 08:54:58 AM »
Oooohh Matron!