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Author Topic: [Commercial] Introducing Bloody Miniatures P.39 - Release 5: Scots now available  (Read 46150 times)

Offline Friends of General Haig

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Great conversions, Richard 👍. The changes do make an extraordinary difference.  I’m also sure the FB ‘outrage’ will be calmed with the blackened armour ;D

Online has.been

  • Galactic Brain
  • Posts: 6382
What about Russeted armour? ???

Offline Captain Blood

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  • Elder God
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Indeed. And blued armour…

A lot of received, um… orthodoxy, on matters of ECW dress, armour and accoutrements comes from the re-enactment community. They do like their blackened armour, and have a tendency to be quite doctrinaire about what they hold to be the One Truth of how things were - even though nobody can say for sure how things were 100% of the time 400 years ago  ::)

If you look at examples of 1640’s armour in museums, for instance, it comes in all sorts of finishes - much of it in plain polished steel. Not de rigeur black, (nor blue nor russeted!) Of course, given that these pieces are all 400 years old, who’s to say what they looked like when new? But then there are a lot of dubious shibboleths bandied about, by enthusiasts for all periods…  :)

Offline Codsticker

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    • Kodsticklerburg: A Mordheim project
LAF's Radar's (blog) visits quite a few places where armour is displayed and it seems to me that quite a bit of it is blackened; however, as you say, it may not have been so 400 years ago, it may have been blackened afterwards to preserve it. I do most of my armour blackened now as I quite like the look. For a slightly blueish tinge I basecoat in something shiny like AP's Platemail and then put a layer of GW's Black Templar contrast paint over it.

Offline Wirelizard

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    • The Warbard
Indeed. And blued armour…

A lot of received, um… orthodoxy, on matters of ECW dress, armour and accoutrements comes from the re-enactment community. They do like their blackened armour, and have a tendency to be quite doctrinaire about what they hold to be the One Truth of how things were - even though nobody can say for sure how things were 100% of the time 400 years ago  ::)

If you look at examples of 1640’s armour in museums, for instance, it comes in all sorts of finishes - much of it in plain polished steel. Not de rigeur black, (nor blue nor russeted!) Of course, given that these pieces are all 400 years old, who’s to say what they looked like when new? But then there are a lot of dubious shibboleths bandied about, by enthusiasts for all periods…  :)

I've heard that lot of the polished-up armour is due to the Victorians wanting all their kniggets in shiny armour, and that a lot of that armour still has traces of blacking/russeting/other surface treatments in the joints and overlaps... but that's firmly in the "duelling anecdotes" camp, although it's always fun and often accurate to blame the Victorians for many historical myths...

I've just bought the four pack of Wave 4 and a couple of select packs from 2 or 3, having finally finished my Wave 1 complete set a couple months ago! Looking forward to finally having some ladies to add to our 17th C/gunpowder fantasy skirmish games.

Offline majorsmith

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Brilliant conversions! Love the darker armour too

Offline Radar

  • Bookworm
  • Posts: 90
    • KeepYourPowderDry
These new lobsters are lovely, but I'm afraid they are much too big - even trying to claim them as 'heroic' 15mm.  ;)

On armour (and thank you for the plug Codsticker) I think there is a contemporary reference to armour preservation in an order, but I can't put my finger on it. Of course I might have dreamt of this reference, so please take with a pinch of salt for the meantime.

I tend to paint blackened armour as I have hit upon paint recipes that I am happy with. I have used Foundry bronze barrel (103A?) for russeted armour which nearly works at 15mm, but I'm not totally happy with. If anyone has a good russet paint recipe please share.

Anecdotally there does seem to be more blackened armour on display in museums and stately homes. With russet probably coming in second. Polished armour on display is strongly suggestive of Victorian reinterpretation - there was a resurgence of interest in the Wars due to the romanticism of Montrose. Victoria was appalled by his underwhelming memorial stone, so his memorial got blinged up, well to do Victorians dressed as cavaliers for fancy dress balls - the Stuart brothers' portrait by Van Dyke being their style guide. There is even evidence of surviving clothing being altered to fit this romantic flouncy cavalier image.

There is one Lancashire armoury display that has been polished within an inch of its life so that it looked knightly (as Wirelizard mentions).

I think I'm correct in saying that the Littlecote armoury has its original finish, but don't have my copy of the RA catalogue to hand to confirm or deny.

Applying Occam's Razor I would imagine that only the great and good would turn up in polished armour due to the labour intensive need to keep polishing. But then looking at contemporaneous portraiture the great and good are mostly shown wearing blackened armour. Of course there are oddities such as the RA's lion armour that crops up in a few portraits - was this just portrait armour rather than fighting PPE?

Of course, thanks to the very many gaps in our knowledge about what actually happened during the ECW/BCw/Wot3K we can do whatever we want paintwise. I field some Covenanter cuirassiers based upon a 'possibly equipped as cuirassiers' reference

Now, where did I see that reference? And the one about Irishmen in Dublin wearing coloured scarves?
« Last Edit: October 02, 2022, 07:58:52 AM by Radar »
www.keepyourpowderdry.co.uk gaming the British Civil Wars in 15mm, and home of the ECW travelogue - dreadful painting, mediocre prose

Online has.been

  • Galactic Brain
  • Posts: 6382
Quote
If anyone has a good russet paint recipe please share.

I do hesitate to mention it, but while I was still in the SK one of our
Pike Block got a lovely russet finish on his 'Tin' (Helmet, Breast & Back plate)
by regularly pissing on it followed by hours of buffing.
Tip, take the armour off BEFORE pissing begins. lol lol lol

Offline Radar

  • Bookworm
  • Posts: 90
    • KeepYourPowderDry
I do hesitate to mention it, but while I was still in the SK one of our
Pike Block got a lovely russet finish on his 'Tin' (Helmet, Breast & Back plate)
by regularly pissing on it followed by hours of buffing.
Tip, take the armour off BEFORE pissing begins. lol lol lol

And I set myself up for that didn't I?  ;D I believe that that method is the 'correct' way to create russeted armour.
 

I'll ask the question again and insert the word 'paint' before 'recipe'  :D

Offline Codsticker

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    • Kodsticklerburg: A Mordheim project
I'm not peeing on my minis. :-[
 :D

Offline Wirelizard

  • Scatterbrained Genius
  • Posts: 3026
  • Needs More Zeppelin!
    • The Warbard
I'll ask the question again and insert the word 'paint' before 'recipe'  :D

The only photo I have is utter crap, but I got a good russetted look on some currassier a couple years ago with silver paint as a base, red ink over, then Nuln Oil dark wash over that to tone the red down.

http://www.warbard.ca/2018/01/18/colourful-cavalry-part-two/

http://www.warbard.ca/2018/01/09/colourful-cavalry-armour-as-well-as-horses/

I'll get those currassier out at some point and try to get a non-crap photo of them, they turned out great and deserve a better photo!

Offline Codsticker

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    • Kodsticklerburg: A Mordheim project
That does look good. I am going to do a little experiment this evening with some contrast paint over Army Painter platemail.

Offline Radar

  • Bookworm
  • Posts: 90
    • KeepYourPowderDry
Thanks for your recipe Wirelizard. Good to have a train of thought confirmed, as Codsticker says some experimentation may ensue.

Agree that some things are very difficult to photograph, my bronze barrel russet armour wearers look better in real life than on the screen. A good brown wash might do the job, but also a red wash might help before the brown.

Offline Radar

  • Bookworm
  • Posts: 90
    • KeepYourPowderDry
Now, where did I see that reference?

"All this armour is to be russet, sanguine, or blacke colour, than white or milled, for it will keep the longer from rust"
Markham,  The Souldiers Accidence (1625)

Offline bigredbat

  • Mad Scientist
  • Posts: 900
    • BigRedBatCave
I was looking at blackened armour in the Musee d'armee in Paris at the weekend- they had some reiter armour that was a blackish/brown colour.  The sort of colour you'd get with multiple peat washes over a dark metallic base, I thought.

 

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