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Author Topic: Return to the (sort of ) HYW! Plans and Ideas etc  (Read 1099 times)

Offline Atheling

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Return to the (sort of ) HYW! Plans and Ideas etc
« on: August 26, 2021, 08:43:13 AM »
Over the past few years, with the release and expansion of the Claymore Castings and Antediluvian Miniatures ranges I have been procrastinating about what sort of a time period to settle upon.

I have settled on that of Dupplin Moor 1332 and arguably one of the first time the Warbow was used strategically to great effect. There was of course Falkirk but as I' am going to be using both the Claymore Castings and Antediluvian Miniatures ranges, Dupplin moor is more appropriate. I am looking at using the Claymore HYW Period rules which ought to hit the spot as they are designed with the period as a firm focus.



What follows is a loose outline of what my plans are and where I would like the project to go.

As mentioned in the above I am going to use the Claymore HYW Period Rules as soon as they are available. Claymore HYW Period Rules are solidly based around the time of the Hundred Years War which could very well be the answer to a 30 year quest for me- a journey in which I have sought after meaningful rules with the right period feel for the HYW.

The Battle of Dupplin Moor 1332 CE was the one of the first times in which the value of quality archers working hand in hand with men at arms was brought to the fore as a successful military tactic. Falkirk being another stand out earlier battle. The effect of the Warbow was going to be felt again and again not only during the Scottish Wars of Independence, (not always successfully) and throughout the HYW and beyond onto the Battle of Montlhery 1465, into The Burgundian Wars and into the lengthy reign of Henry VIII where the importance of the Warbow would slowly decline until eventually to be viewed as an archaic weapon, especially in the eyes of England's European neighbours.

I am going to be working on armies for both sides at Dupplin Moor. I will be taking a detour from my normal working mode of working; painting the bulk of one side before moving onto the other and paint one unit for the Scots, one for the English etc. I'm starting with the first Scottish Schiltron. There has been much discussion and debate over the years about what it meant by the word Schillton, so often is conjures up fantastical Braveheart type images but this is only a small part of the story. Within the rules, they can be set up as offensive and defensive as seen in the diagrams below. I asked one of the authors for permission to show two basic diagrams  below:

Offensive


Defensive


I'm going to go with six miniatures per base; so slightly packed on a 60mm frontage by 50mm deep base. This should give the required look but if not I am open to try out different arrangements.

Obviously, as in any set of wargames rules a mechanic is an abstraction. What has got me very excited about the Claymore HYW Rules is that the rules cater for both types of formation of the Schiltron, which most wargames rules seem to simplify too much for my liking and leave as "Long Spear" or allow a small advantage such as the equivalent as "Shieldwall". I am going to keep referring the formation as a Schiltron out of convenience as opposed to a concrete fixed formation. It is arguable that it was not only the Scots who used such formations but the English too. Densely packed men in units  with spears/polearms/double handed weapons etc were used by many nations as a defensive and offensive tactic. The Battle of Courtrai/Battle of the Golden Spurs 1302 springs to mind; where large bodies of tightly packed men defeated the flower of French Chivalry.

I am currently waiting upon my first delivery of Antediluvian Miniatures which I will be mixing with Claymore Castings in order to create the armies of the time. This is going to be a fairly long term project with regular updates. Hopefully those interested in Late Medieval warfare will find some value in my mutterings and interest in the painted units etc.

The long term aim to to put on The Battles of Dupplin Moore 1332 as a display game at a show or two. I am going to be concentrating on the Second War of Independence, 1332-1357 largely because the stand out battles of Dupplin Moore 1332, Halidon Hill and Neville's Cross are often viewed as the "little brothers" when compared to the battles of The First War of Independence.

Offline Johnp4000

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Re: Return to the (sort of ) HYW! Plans and Ideas etc
« Reply #1 on: August 26, 2021, 11:54:27 AM »
It is funny but I have been building an Agincourt period army based on the Perries plastics but find them rather bland. I have been really tempted by this Claymore castings range as the quality of the figures is excellent and they look full of character. I heard about the Claymore rules, but no real details, from your comments, are these going to be a battle scale set rather than skirmish level? It will be interesting watching you develop this project, not sure I would want to be on the Scottish side at Dupplin moor!

Offline Atheling

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Re: Return to the (sort of ) HYW! Plans and Ideas etc
« Reply #2 on: August 26, 2021, 01:12:29 PM »
It is funny but I have been building an Agincourt period army based on the Perries plastics but find them rather bland. I have been really tempted by this Claymore castings range as the quality of the figures is excellent and they look full of character.

I much prefer the Perry metals from the Agincourt to Orleans range to their plastics. They just have more character than the plastics IMHO. More believable dynamic poses etc. Don't get me wrong, the Perry Plastic HYW range are excellent- just not as good as the metals :)

I heard about the Claymore rules, but no real details, from your comments, are these going to be a battle scale set rather than skirmish level?

Yes, battle level. Not skirmish level, though the number of miniatures you have on a base is really up to you (from what I have gathered). I don't have a copy of the rules as of yet but have had some communication with some of the authors. I don't really want to expand upon what I have already said in case I break their confidence.


It will be interesting watching you develop this project, not sure I would want to be on the Scottish side at Dupplin moor!

I'm really looking forward to getting stuck in- at the moment I'm waiting for some miniatures to arrive. I'll be starting with the Scots as indicated by my original post. This is going to be a "long term" project as it will no doubt expand beyond Dupplin Moor. How far? We shall have to see :)
« Last Edit: August 26, 2021, 01:14:42 PM by Atheling »

Offline Tonhel

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Re: Return to the (sort of ) HYW! Plans and Ideas etc
« Reply #3 on: August 26, 2021, 04:49:50 PM »
This is perfect. I also have the Claymore Castings and Antediluvian miniatures and I had the exact same plan from the moment David announced his rules and created a facebook group.

I am really looking forward to what you are going to do. It will be a very inspirational guide for me :-*
« Last Edit: August 26, 2021, 04:52:10 PM by Tonhel »

Offline Atheling

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Re: Return to the (sort of ) HYW! Plans and Ideas etc
« Reply #4 on: August 26, 2021, 05:34:45 PM »
This is perfect. I also have the Claymore Castings and Antediluvian miniatures and I had the exact same plan from the moment David announced his rules and created a facebook group.

I am really looking forward to what you are going to do. It will be a very inspirational guide for me :-*

Thanks Tonhel. It will be interesting for me too as I have yet to discover what I am going to be doing  lol

I have a pretty good idea of how I'm going to base the miniatures. Same with the painting.

What I will have to do is to paint a series of heraldic banners as there simply aren't any out there available commercially- that I know of- I would love to stand to be corrected  :)

So, how to paint the banners? I am in two minds as to cut them out to 28mm scale and paint them or to do them (as a square) on an A4 sheet of paper and reduce them to size. The latter technique would be mean i would be able to share them but it would mean a lot more work and quite a bit of trial and error.

Offline Iain R

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Re: Return to the (sort of ) HYW! Plans and Ideas etc
« Reply #5 on: August 26, 2021, 08:41:14 PM »
Looking forward to seeing this!

To be fair, on the subject of banners, probably wouldn't take too much persuading to get Iain at Flags of War to do some for the second WoI, to complement his existing Bannockburn designs...
Proudly not painting Wars of The Roses since... ever


Offline Atheling

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Re: Return to the (sort of ) HYW! Plans and Ideas etc
« Reply #6 on: August 26, 2021, 08:49:23 PM »
Looking forward to seeing this!

To be fair, on the subject of banners, probably wouldn't take too much persuading to get Iain at Flags of War to do some for the second WoI, to complement his existing Bannockburn designs...

Thanks Iain :)

I was going to have a chat wit Iain from Flags of War on that very subject as I used to know him from shows in Scotland. We did a Steve Dean Forum Miniature Painting Swap back in the day! :) On the other hand, I quite fancy painting some up- maybe even releasing my own range that are at least initially hand painted like Pete's Flags- it's all up in the air for now so we shall have to see. Gotta put that degree to some use at some point other then painting toy soldiers  lol

Offline OB

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Re: Return to the (sort of ) HYW! Plans and Ideas etc
« Reply #7 on: August 27, 2021, 12:29:29 PM »
This all sounds very interesting.  One to watch I think.

Offline Atheling

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Re: Return to the (sort of ) HYW! Plans and Ideas etc
« Reply #8 on: August 27, 2021, 01:19:00 PM »
This all sounds very interesting.  One to watch I think.

Thanks. There's a lot of research ahead and much painting to be done too.

The more I think about having a go at producing a range of (initially) had painted/designed banners for the battle the more appealing it becomes :)

 

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