NWF Turbans and flags

[Oldboy]

Dear all
I have two questions if I may. They relate to the NWF covering from say 1879 to Chitral/Malakand -
1. Is there a source (whether internet or book) for the turban designs covering each of the Indian regiments. Mainly cavalry I guess. I have the Osprey and they are ok I also have the Mollo book, but whilst there is lots of nice artwork, the pictures are too small to get exact detail and in some cases do not attribute each figure to a regiment. I am aware that in some cases it is not know what certain regiments wore.
2. Is there a source for 28mm Indian flags.
Thank you in advance Frank

[Oldboy]

A quick search indicates that Flag Dude have some Indian flags for specific regiments. Also the Empress IM flags may be of use (although a little early)

[Umra Khan]

For the turbans regiments of Indian Army you could look at.:
Carman Indian Army
Carman Indian Cavalry
for bengal lancers regiments there is a little book by A. H. Bowling Indian Calary regiments with lot of nice drawings all in color, published by Almark publications

[Oldboy]

Mr Khan
Thank you. That is really helpful. I will explore. F

[Mad Guru]

Oldboy,

Umra Khan has already given you great advice, and he is a wonderful fellow, not only generous but also a devoted follower of the True Path when it comes to colonial wargaming rules!  Nonetheless, I'll expand a bit on his excellent guidance...

Re: Anglo-Indian army turbans, in addition to the regimental color and/or pattern, there is the more basic question of the type of turban itself.  As miniature gamers choosing figures we often don't get much choice in this matter, but in the past half decade or so more variations have appeared for sale from companies like Perry Miniatures and Artizan, so it may be worth taking note of this handy chart:



Moving on to regimental color patterns, the closest thing to a single dependable source is the pair of volumes Umra Khan mentioned above: C.Y. Carman's "Indian Army Uniforms, from the 18th Century to 1947, Vol. I: Cavalry" and "Vol. II: Artillery, Engineers and Infantry."

These are very useful reference books and have entries with uniform information for every regiment, but it isn't focused on the appearance of units in action during particular campaigns.  You will find specifics on some regiments during some wars, but little or none on others during the same or different wars.  Still, at present it remains the closest thing to a single authoritative source.

I own both volumes and never regret having bought them, but there are some other, less expensive books that can also be useful.  At the top of this list for me are 2 Osprey Men-At-Arms titles, both first published in 1979 but still in print and easily available: "Bengal Cavalry Regiments, 1857-1914" (MAA 91); and "Indian Infantry Regiments 1860-1914" (MAA 92).  Again, when it comes to uniforms and equipment of every regiment in every campaign of the time-periods in their titles, neither of these are all-inclusive, but they do have a lot of useful information, including turban patterns for many regiments.

Another less expensive book is, "An Assemblage of Indian Army Soldiers & Uniforms by the late Chater Paul Chater," published in 1973.  Chater was a talented artist who did color paintings of Indian soldiers from a variety of different regiments.  Again, this is nowhere near comprehensive, but virtually every page features a full color painting of a different uniform for a different Indian regiment, turbans included.

Umra Khan also mentioned a great little book by A.H. Bowling, published by Almark in 1971, called "Indian Cavalry Regiments 1880-1914," which in addition to contemporary photos, includes one small color illustration of virtually every regiment of Indian cavalry pictured at some point during the late 19th or early 20th Century, turban patterns included.

Almark published another great book in 1979, written & illustrated by Christopher Rothero, called "Skinner's Horse," which has tons of visual detail on different uniforms and turban patterns worn by the 1st and 3rd Skinner's Horse throughout their long histories, including weapons and lance pennon patterns.

Helion recently published a large format book including many color uniform plates, called "The Regiments of the British Indian Army 1895-1947." Based on the title you can see it's mostly focused on a later era but it does include some late 19th Century uniforms and turbans, and is easily available here:

https://www.helion.co.uk/military-history-books/the-regiments-of-the-british-indian-army-1895-1947-the-indian-army-of-the-crown-in-colour-paintings.php?sid=f8a66ba8c8f6ec84adc372469e1e3477

The two most famous illustrators of the Anglo-Indian Army are probably A.C. Lovett (who was a serving officer in the British Army) and Richard Simkin (who some say was a part-time soldier in the Artist's Rifles).  Lovett's "The Armies of India" (1911) includes tons of uniforms and turban patterns, some of which fall within our period.  If you can get a copy, fantastic, but if not, you can Google around and find some of the images from its pages:

https://www.google.com/search?q=lovett+the+armies+of+india&client=safari&rls=en&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjHhIupmOHyAhVGwZ4KHTGHDg0Q_AUoAXoECAEQAw&biw=1552&bih=898

The same goes for Simkin.  Like Lovett, some of his illustrations post-date our period, but others can be useful.  Here's a LINK to a page featuring 21 of Simkin's Indian uniform prints:

https://www.military-prints.com/indian_regiments.htm

Re: Anglo-Indian regimental flags... I may be wrong -- in fact I hope I'm wrong! -- but unfortunately I don't know of any book devoted to the subject.  If you Google around online you can find some contemporary photos and color illustrations featuring flags of a few different Indian regiments from this period -- including 1st Bengal light Infantry, 8th Bengal Native Infantry, 15th Ludhiana Sikhs, 16th Punjabis, 29th Bengal Native Infantry, 30th Punjabis, 62nd Punjabis, and 80th Carnatic Infantry -- but in my experience that's about it.  Rick O'Brien The Flag Dude does indeed have awesome miniature flags for some Anglo-Indian regiments, including the 1st Bombay Grenadiers and 30th Bombay Native Infantry Jacob's Rifles, both of whom fought at the 1880 Battle of Maiwand.

[Oldboy]

Mr Guru
Thank you so much for taking the time to send such a comprehensive reply. As I said I am interested in Chitral and Malakand predominately. But whether I stick to a true OOB or use regiments I prefer I have not decided.  Either way, I would like them to be as accurate as possible or my brush allows.
I am waiting for my first orders so its very much research time.
Thanks once again
Frank

[giorgio]

Mad Guru and Umra have given a comprehensive answer and, unless you speak about rules where they follow the evil dark side, they are both fully reliable. What you'll discover is that sometime there is incongruousness among different sources, so at the very end you have to decide by yourself also according your aesthetic taste . The advantage for above fellows is that their heretic troops are quickly wiped out wargame tables so that the uniform colors mistakes, if any, stand only few turns.
Please post your unit progress when you start to color them

[Oldboy]

Giorgio
Thank you.
I will post progress. Unfortunately living in Italy now, everything takes much longer. Even orders from Italian stockists take ten days. In UK you can get Perry orders by return post.
So far I have discovered a really nicely painted (by me) Lord Roberts from Giants in Miniature. Not sure how long I have had him. He will rightly command. I also have three figures who I think are Warlord Chindit characters. Their rifles are clearly wrong. But otherwise not too bad. a splendid figure with a tam-o-shanter and a monacle. He will be sir Hector MacDonald, my favorite Victorian hero. Just cleaned and primed them. May also press some Empress Afghans into service. Again wrong weapons but lovely sculps. If nothing else I can pracice colours until my plastic afghans and Indian troops turn up.

[Umra Khan]

Oldboy,
Considering that your period is about 1897 almost all the turbans of the Indian infantry regiments are khaki colored.  You will only have to color the Kullah (conical part under the turban of the Muslim regiments) and the Pug (small triangle of the Sikhs under the turban) . for this reason the table that Mad Guru has provided you is excellent, I attach a photo of a Sikh miniature for the Pug.


Pugs are normally red or yellow, for references the Mollo book gives you the facing colors of the Sikhs regiments.

For the Indian Cavalry the reasoning is the same, almost all the turbans were khaki colored in that period , although there was still the use of using khaki uniforms with the turban in regimental colors.

Last but not least... do not take for good what the Malicious Wazir says, he's also called the Viper of Waziristan ... when he rants about rules 

[Umra Khan]

Giorgio
.... Unfortunately living in Italy now,

why unfortunately ?
you are living in a beautiful country 
just joking of course, where do you live in Italy ?

[giorgio]

Giorgio
Thank you.
I will post progress. Unfortunately living in Italy now, everything takes much longer. Even orders from Italian stockists take ten days. In UK you can get Perry orders by return post.
So far I have discovered a really nicely painted (by me) Lord Roberts from Giants in Miniature. Not sure how long I have had him. He will rightly command. I also have three figures who I think are Warlord Chindit characters. Their rifles are clearly wrong. But otherwise not too bad. a splendid figure with a tam-o-shanter and a monacle. He will be sir Hector MacDonald, my favorite Victorian hero. Just cleaned and primed them. May also press some Empress Afghans into service. Again wrong weapons but lovely sculps. If nothing else I can pracice colours until my plastic afghans and Indian troops turn up.

Old boy with brexit is a great problem. I have discovered (input by Umra) willie miniatures which are very beautiful and come from Stockholm. Link: https://traditionoflondonshop.com/30mm_War_game_Willie/Colonial_War_Dolly_Gray_1899-1902?page=3&osCsid=kibbbqgbskm9mu97bs75lot8r4 When u have prepared your units you may want to join our saga, that u can find in a dedicated topic in this forum. Actually there are 5 active players both side of the pond; In order to give more spice to the war, and to not offend real religious feelings, we have invented a fight between the faithful of different rules as if they are real religion (of course only TMWWBK is...). So anyone is free to enter in this topic and post his Khan name and religion/rule preference. If one or two  buddies wants to be more helpful, we can provide them the scenario and involved units (according also to what you have available) and the battle results with pictures and description will be included in the campaign which could also enlarge covering more area.
But be careful and think that on one side there are empious Umra, Mad of Traitors, Sgt Guinness heretic and on the other side with Mighty pious Mulehead there is Cpt Shawn  faithful devoted blessed pilgrims. At you the choice between Good and evil...
SO when and if you like please enter the topic with your name, such as Ibrahim Khan of xxx in yyy area, devote faithful of the Only Rule (xxx) . Optional: I'd like to participate to campaign with my army/armies as solo or with my friend R.Kypling. I include some pictures of available units. Battles request RAJ/English and Pathans. The main story is full of specific characters adventures to fill the gaps among battles, but sometime very funny and interesting in themselves.
Don't be shy and fight for True Rule!!! It needs YOU!
link at: https://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=131610.225

[Umra Khan]

Giorgio you are incorrectly enlisting new players 

Oldboy ,it depends on which Faith you want to follow, here there is only one Faith and it is TSATF , if you were an unbeliever unfortunately all the places in the campaign are sold out...

[Oldboy]

Thank you both
I was thinking of TMWWBK to start with. Fairly few figures and playable solo. After I have built figures for that I will look to expand. F