The germ of a project: unconventional Middle-earth armies (a switch to 15mm!)

[LordOdo]

Rohan as late Roman empire and Gondor as Byzantine is an interesting idea! Makes me think that it's quite obvious the Harad is Cathage..

[Porsenna]

Wouldn't Rohan work better if modeled as dark age Anglo Saxons? Gondor has always been fantasy version of Rome/Eastern Rome (Though Tolkien in his letters considered Gondor to be Italy, though its' cities Byzantine in look), but Rohirrim have always been even more obviously modeled after the Anglo-Saxons.

If wanting to avoid those models, however, Goths might be a good take as well.

[astrobouncer]

In the Hobbit, when the group is traveling through Mirkwood, Tolkien makes vivid descriptions of the 'glowing eyes' seen at night and around them. He does mention they are possibly insect like but that might be something that is worth extrapolating on. 

[jetengine]

In the Hobbit, when the group is traveling through Mirkwood, Tolkien makes vivid descriptions of the 'glowing eyes' seen at night and around them. He does mention they are possibly insect like but that might be something that is worth extrapolating on.

Could that not be the Giant Spiders?

[robh]

But doesn't looking at all the standard dark age historical stereotypes lose the peculiarity of the images you show. Yes that is the basis that Tolkien stated for his background, but that is not where the majority of those images are.

In the coloured image you have a very high Medieval style and the one of the clashing warriors has horn helmet Vikings riding wolves on one side against full plate armour "Excalibur Arthurian" style infantry on the other.
The first image (which I think is great) has bipedal wolves and almost Neanderthal looking goblins and "Noggin the Nog" style Dwarves up trees.

Your stated 3 criteria are not matched by the illustrations you chose. Are you actually looking for "unconventional" or just slightly different from the norm?

[Sunjester]

This is going to be an interesting project to follow, I am intrigued to see where you take it.

[FramFramson]

Another illustrator to look up would be Cor Blok, who really went all-in on a medieval manuscript style which works really well.

[Hobgoblin]

Your stated 3 criteria are not matched by the illustrations you chose. Are you actually looking for "unconventional" or just slightly different from the norm?

I'm not sure I quite follow you here. I mean, a burly, bearded Gollum, bearded or shaggy Orcs, and wolf/bear-like trolls are all quite different from the conventions of most contemporary Tolkien illustrators, surely? As is a six-legged Smaug!

And Severian's suggestion of winged hussars for the swan knights is a great example of how one could deviate a long way from the Dark Ages. That's exactly what I'd like to do - have something that fits the textual prescription (rule 1) but is far removed from the conventions of the past couple of decades at least (rule 3).

I mean, an Orc army in which the figures resembled those hirsute wolfriders with their horned helmets would at least be a bit different from the norm, no?

I'm also thinking about how paint schemes could be used to shift things away from the ordinary. For example, there's a risk that even heavily kit-bashed Orcs might still end up looking fairly conventional (not least because there's a fair bit of rule-2 description of the Orcs). But striking uniform and armour schemes (e.g. bright red helmets for officers) might offset that a bit.

Another illustrator to look up would be Cor Blok, who really went all-in on a medieval manuscript style which works really well.

Yes! His snouted Gollum is a great example!

[Hobgoblin]

Actually, the New Line movies provide a good example of the sort of thing I'm looking for in the way they treat the mumakil. Using a prehistoric elephant-type beast is a great innovation; if the films hadn't done that already, it would be a perfect fit with my "Dogme rules".

Conversely, the hyaenadon wargs don't really fit because the wargs are explicitly described as wolves (and the word warg means "wolf").

[Captain Blood]

Interesting ideas.
I’m waiting for the Victrix Norman cavalry to come out, and will be using those for Gondor. A mainly mail based world is what Tolkien describes in The Lord of The Rings. All the fanciful baroque / gothic plate armour beloved of generations of Tolkien illustrators and interpreters is a vast accretion of barnacles on the hull of Tolkien’s plain and simple vessel 

[tikitang]

All the fanciful baroque / gothic plate armour beloved of generations of Tolkien illustrators and interpreters is a vast accretion of barnacles on the hull of Tolkien’s plain and simple vessel 

Nicely put!

[Hobgoblin]

A mainly mail based world is what Tolkien describes in The Lord of The Rings. All the fanciful baroque / gothic plate armour beloved of generations of Tolkien illustrators and interpreters is a vast accretion of barnacles on the hull of Tolkien’s plain and simple vessel 

Yes, I think you're dead right.

With this project, I'm not aiming for what Tolkien had in mind (pretty much straight-up Bayeux Tapestry by his own account) so much as what can be squeezed between his lines.

So, while I think your brilliant kitbashed Orcs are pretty much bang on (maybe with a slight quibble about height! ), I'm going to try to go for something a bit weirder that will certainly be less like what Tolkien intended but could be quite fun in any case.

Here are a couple of examples of a potential Uruk kitbash - a Mantic goblin with an Oathmark dwarf head and/or Frostgrave gnoll arms (to lean into that "long arms hanging almost to the ground" thing. I might add a spiky nasal piece to the helmet to give it a more goblinish look. I'm also thinking about using some GW beastman heads without the horns (not an original idea but one worth stealing).

As I don't need dwarves for the Pelennor (aside, maybe, from Gimli with the Rangers off the Corsair ships), I think dwarf bits can be a fertile source of Orc parts. For various reasons that I won't get into now, I have an inkling that Tolkien's Uruks were more dwarf-like than most illustrators tend to suggest.

[area23]

Lovely illustrations. I've been of the opinion that orcs and goblins could have beards.
Probably wrote it before in other similar discussions:
Beards in LotR are described when noteworthy, like dwarfs, or when it adds to the character. It doesn't mean that unless described people or creatures have no beard.

Just like the old sagas; most men probably had beards. There was no reason to add it to the description of a person.

[Vanvlak]

Tove Jansson illustrated LOTR?! That, I never knew. Cool - bet the first illustration in the list is hers.
Whose is the second one? The first two and the last, colour medieval style one are my favourites.
EDIT the second one is hers too! Cooler still! 
LATER EDIT she only illustrated The Hobbit - and the license is for Swedish and Finnish editions only. Still, I liked them so much I ordered a Finnish language Hobbiti 

[jon_1066]

There is a huge difference in tone between The Hobbit and LOTR.  The first 2 illustrations are wonderful and suit The Hobbit beautifully.  I don’t think that style would suit LOTR though.  Again I agree the high medieval style illustration is great.

What about Gondor as Byzantium, Easterlings as Turks, Harad are Barbary pirates, Rohan as crusaders, and Orcs are Mongols with wolves instead of ponies.