British uniforms 1879-1885 - same?

[traveller]

I am considering doing a generic British colonial force for 1879-1885, including the 9th Xhosa War 1877, Zulu Wars 1879, Invasion of Egypt 1882 and the Gordon Relief Campaign 1885. Would the cut of the uniforms be the same?  Grateful for any help!

[Plynkes]

Sudan is the odd one out, doesn't match with the others uniform-wise. The cut is the same, but colours totally different, and they have puttees or nothing round their ankles rather than short gaiters.  The others match, pretty much (1881 Transvaal War too).


Of course, if you are looking to create a generic force, you may be prepared to overlook the differences.

[traveller]

Thanks Plynkes!

if doing the 1882 Egypt invasion, still red coats were worn. Would helmet and accountrements be the same as in Zululand?

[answer_is_42]

Thanks Plynkes!

if doing the 1882 Egypt invasion, still red coats were worn. Would helmet and accountrements be the same as in Zululand?

I don't think so, no. The helmet design certainly changed during that time, as did various other bits and pieces. You could get away with it if you don't care about such things, but they are noticeably different.

A quick way of comparing the two would be to look at both Empress’ and Perry’s British;


Note the trousers, boots, cuffs etc.

You should be able to use the Zulu War uniform up to about 1880 ish, but only in South Africa. For Egypt and early Sudan you'll be using the lower image uniforms. Red was worn by units in the Sudan up to 1882ish, so you will be able to get away with it for games you set there. I play Sudan games with redcoats.

[Plynkes]

if doing the 1882 Egypt invasion, still red coats were worn. Would helmet and accountrements be the same as in Zululand?

Not quite. Red coats, yes. Pictures I have seen of the Egypt campaign show the helmets with a puggaree after the Indian fashion, which you don't see in the Zulu War. Getting slightly more picky there was a uniform reorganisation in 1881, which dropped the old regimental facing colours (apart from some exceptions) in favour of national ones (white for English and Welsh, yellow for Scottish, green for Irish). The shape of the cuffs also changed.

Personally I would consider these minor details not worth worrying about if I were creating a generic force for several campaigns, but it is nonetheless good to be armed with the facts (especially if some tool tries to tell you your figures are all wrong, because then you can say "I know, and here's why...")  


Edit: Answer_is_42, the helmet design isn't radically different, they just have puggarees, that's all (which troops in India had been sporting for years). The bottom picture there represents troops in Sudan later on. In Egypt the troops resembled their Zulu War counterparts a little more, wearing the dark blue trousers with a red stripe and gaiters with their boots.

[answer_is_42]

Not quite. Red coats, yes. Pictures I have seen of the Egypt campaign show the helmets with a puggaree after the Indian fashion, which you don't see in the Zulu War. Getting slightly more picky there was a uniform reorganisation in 1881, which dropped the old regimental facing colours (apart from some exceptions) in favour of national ones (white for English and Welsh, yellow for Scottish, green for Irish). The shape of the cuffs also changed.

Personally I would consider these minor details not worth worrying about if I were creating a generic force for several campaigns, but it is nonetheless good to be armed with the facts (especially if some tool tries to tell you your figures are all wrong, because then you can say "I know, and here's why...")  

Ah yes, forgot about the Indian uniforms. Well, you can happily ignore them if you like (I do). They're not very pretty anyway...
On the subject of the 1881 reorganisation, it is unclear how many regiments took this up. Many (the Buffs, for example) continued using their old colours, and the new facings were generally unpopular with regiments wanting to preserve their individuality. By the turn of the century most regiments had reverted to their old colours. I just realised myself that I've forgotten to paint any facings on my figures at all!

Personally I would try not to use 1879 British for the Sudan (I suppose the little differences in details would slowly eat away at me), but I'll only be slightly disappointed with you if you do this...

[answer_is_42]

Edit: Answer_is_42, the helmet design isn't radically different, they just have puggarees, that's all (which troops in India had been sporting for years). The bottom picture there represents troops in Sudan later on. In Egypt the troops resembled their Zulu War counterparts a little more, wearing the dark blue trousers with a red stripe and gaiters with their boots.

Ah, okie dokie then. I' afraid don't know half as much about the Egyptian campaign as I'd like to...

[traveller]

Thanks for your valuable advice! Amazing that there is always expert info available in this forum.

I agree with you, small but annoying differences...

I would like to use the Hicks miniatures from Empress but the damn puggaree mess things up. What would they need this for anyway?

[Plynkes]

afraid don't know half as much about the Egyptian campaign as I'd like to...

Yes, that campaign was fought in Home Service Undress by the vast majority of the troops involved. The only campaign modifications to the uniform were the issue of white sun helmets with puggarees (that were mostly stained brown with tea) and sand goggles.

The much less conspicuous grey serge uniforms seen on many troops in the Sudan campaigns two years later were actually manufactured for the Egyptian campaign but did not arrive until after the fighting was over.

To generalise, in the Sudan you have a mix of troops in the aforementioned grey uniforms and ones from India who were already kitted out in khaki, plus the occasional red coated fellows here and there.

[traveller]

Just a thought, would figures with Glengarry caps be a way to avoid the puggaree problem? As I understand you, the facings and gaiters could fit also Sudan?
I planned actually to do a unit with Marine Light Infantry. Those blue colours look soooo nice 

[Plynkes]

Unfortunately the troops in the Sudan either wore their trousers loose (like in Answer's post above) or had puttees rather than gaiters.  There may have been exceptions, though. Would have to look that up. And the cuffs and facings changed in 1881, except for the ones that didn't. I'm sure they did it just to mess with wargamers! 

The original puggarees were simply scarves or turbans wrapped around a hat, which trailed down the back of the neck to protect it from the sun. On these helmets it is purely military fashion as far as I'm aware - An attempt to make a helmet look more Indian by wrapping a turban around it.

[answer_is_42]

Yes, that campaign was fought in Home Service Undress by the vast majority of the troops involved. The only campaign modifications to the uniform were the issue of white sun helmets with puggarees (that were mostly stained brown with tea) and sand goggles.

I know that helmets were dyed during the Xhosa and Zulu wars, but were they in Egypt and the Sudan? Most photographs I've seen of troops in the Sudan show white helmets. And was it Tea? I've read reports of coffee, or even mud being used! Argh! 

[Plynkes]

The books I have say in Egypt tea was used, apart from the 19th Hussars, who used stewed tobacco juice. Haven't seen much in the way of photos of this campaign, but in the artwork the helmets are usually brown, with a few exceptions.

[carlos marighela]

The short answer is no. Leaving aside various minor changes to cut and detail, the Cardwell reforms bugger you about in terms of facings.

The slightly longer answer is no but does it really matter? Your toys, your table.

[former user]

no expertise with british uniforms here, but as far as photographs of that time go, the light colour of the helmet coverings could have been developed very light to whiteish, first for chemists knowing the white original colour and second for colour reference.

In addition. You do not want to wear a white helmet in desert environment, You can see the colour from miles away, better than the faded and dust stained red - this would be my personal experience from Sudan with white 4x4 and tents - white almost sparkles in the sun...