Flagship Games Pirates 3rd edition?

[Skrapwelder]

Some old Flagship Games postings courtesy of the wayback:

http://web.archive.org/web/19990508210219/www.flagshipgames.com/Pacificon96.htm

http://web.archive.org/web/19991023053427/www.flagshipgames.com/dickey-moe.htm

http://web.archive.org/web/20000122112344/www.flagshipgames.com/maracaibo.htm

Its been a while since I've actually played but if you do end up with the rules and have any questions I'm sure I can get you to the right place.

[Doc Twilight]

I don't mean to impune the rules - plenty of people like them. But I felt it was important to share a different perspective. I often purchased rules based upon overwhelmingly positive responses in the past, and ended up disappointed. I try to find less positive views now, so that I can have a rough idea about what I might be in for as per weaknesses in the system.

I don't supose there is a nice actual play write-up with pictures anywhwere?

Skrap beat me to the punch on that, Grub, but those posts will at least give you a starting point.

"The rules as originally written were for fantasy naval gaming.  They decided to add the historical stuff later on and it works just fine.  You don't have to use the Mediterranean ship types and crews to play the game.  You can just stick to the Carribean ship types and crews and have a fine game with that.  The fact that they present a broad historical option is actually quite nice, since one hardly ever sees any game address Middle Eastern pirate games.

And since Grubman did write that realism and historical accuracy take a back seat to fun, I think he should check out these rules.  They really are the only rules out there that have good "skirmish" ship to ship encounters."

I must have struck a personal never. Not sure why this seems to have been taken personally. Of course, I may have read the multiple responses from the same author out of context, and I apologize if this was the case.

As for the actual period covered - whether or not they actually cover the Middle Eastern stuff (and it's good that they did) that's beside the point. I don't recall mincing words over accuracy or lack thereof.

The problem is that the ships reflected are -not- the ships that you would see in a "Golden Age of Piracy" theme. They cover Armada era ships, which are not really appropriate if you're going for the "Errol Flynn" type pirate movie. The Caribbean type ships are fairly limited. There is a sloop and a gunboat, and one might be able to make the small galleon represented work. The others (the Hulk and Galley, for instance, I think there's at least one other, a Galleas,  but it's been a few weeks since last I looked at them) aren't actually Caribbean designs. So it's about 50/50, truth be told.

As for the 10:1 scale, the rules don't explicitly state that anywhere, as far as I can tell. But I could have missed something in the fine print.

-Doc

[Skrapwelder]

Doc, I certainly didn't see anything in your posts to take personally. You offered a concise, well written opinion that ran counter what had been offered. Several of the first responders, myself included, have been playing Pirates since Day 1 and have know some of the Flagship Games people since they were in short pants. (until recently I did all their print work.)  And I'm really sorry you got the response you did from Flagship.

The rules play very fast and loose with everything from scale to period. They are actually kind of secondary to having a good time with boats and figures.

I do remember some off hand statement about a 10 to one scale at some time or another.

I've also played the melee portion of Legends of the High Seas and found it very enjoyable. The rules work a lot better for Pirates than they do for Cowboys in my opinion. I have not played the ship combat rules. In fact they only other sail rules I've played was a heavily house ruled "Don't Give Up the Ship" a long time ago.

[grubman]

Some old Flagship Games postings courtesy of the wayback:

  OH my, that looks like fun!  I was primarily interested in classic pirates at this time, but the fantasy stuff certainly tickles my fancy as well.

[Luckyjoe]

The reference to the 10:1 scale of the game is on page 2 of the 3rd ed. rulebook in the third paragraph under the heading "Introduction". It says "The ships depicted here are (very) roughly 10:1 scale to their historical counterparts in as far as crew sizes, firepower and tonnage are concerned. Ship crews range from 8 (representing about 80 crew) to 40 (about 400 crew). The largest ships can fire 3-5 cannons on a broadside (30 to 50 cannons firing 10-20 pound balls)." I didn't find any other mention of the 10:1 scale convention on a quick check of the rules.

Luckyjoe

[n815e]

I must have struck a personal never. Not sure why this seems to have been taken personally.

I didn't take it personally, it's nice to see a different point of view, but your review of the game seems so off and inaccurate to me.  In particular, your representation of the Flagship guys has never been close to my experience with them regarding any of their games.  Any emails with questions I've sent to them have been responded to with very helpful and friendly answers.