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Author Topic: Indian Mountain Gun  (Read 14655 times)

Offline Helen

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Indian Mountain Gun
« Reply #30 on: October 28, 2007, 08:53:48 AM »
Hi Poly, Nice work on the gun crew :)

I's also recovering from a week and a half with the flu too :cry:

Get better soon :)
Best wishes,
Helen
Love many things, for therein lies the true strength, and whosoever loves much performs much, and can accomplish much, and what is done in love is done well (V van Gogh)

Offline PeteMurray

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Indian Mountain Gun
« Reply #31 on: October 29, 2007, 12:10:21 AM »
Great work on the guns, Poly. I'm really glad you chose to keep the swords on your gun crews, and the gun shields really do look like the ones in the picture. A nice little modificaiton that makes them a bit more specific to the period.

Offline Helen

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Indian Mountain Gun
« Reply #32 on: February 15, 2008, 04:19:35 AM »
Hi Guys,
continuing with the Indian Mountain Batteries in East Africa my good friends at the Great War Forum have been very helpful with answers and I present the additional information here for all to share who have an interest in Sideshows of the Great War!
 
Please don't forget Lon has some lovely looking 2.75 in Mountain Guns (beautifully designed by Michael Broadbent) available with Indian crew and also with Mules :-)
 
Oh, the Mule with the ammo boxes and a few spare Indian gun crew (as Muleteers) make for an excellent logistical elements in your games.
 
INDIAN PACK BATTERIES

1 KASHMIR Mountain Battery
This was the only Imperial Service Mountain Battery in the East African theatre and was equipped with four 10-pounders (2.75 in). (See pages 338 and 339 of “The Forgotten Fronts” by Maj-Gen Sir Martin Farndale.)
“1 Kashmir Pack Battery was despatched to East Africa in November 1916 under the command of Major Dharam Singh. The battery gave support to the forces operating in the Rufigi River area and, in February 1917, at Mikalinso. The battery was in constant action from March to November 1917 and suffered heavily from malaria and dysentery. Almost all the mules were lost due to illness. The battery returned to Jammu in March 1918.” (From page 107 of “Jammu and Kashmir Arms” by Maj-Gen D.K. Palit.)
“The Kashmir Mountain Battery (which started with 198 rank and file and 172 mules) went with Brigadier-General Beves’ 2nd South African Infantry Brigade . . . Extract from the Battery history: During the time the battery was in Africa, owing to malaria and other sickness, a very large proportion of the personnel had to be replaced from India, most coming from No 2 Kashmir Mountain Battery. Of the animals taken out by the battery only one survived to the end of 1917, all the rest having succumbed to the tsetse fly and horse-sickness. The battery had 24 casualties, all except three being deaths from sickness.” (From “The History of The Indian Mountain Artillery” By Brig-Gen C.A.L. Graham.)

22nd (Derajat) and 24th (Hazara) Mountain Batteries
S.D. Pradhan on page 132 of “Indian Army in East Africa” incorrectly relates these two batteries to Jammu and Kashmir. Both were Indian Army Mountain Batteries.
The 22nd (Derajat) Mountain Battery (Frontier Force) landed at Kilwa on 18th December 1916. It was deployed as a four gun (initially all 10-pounders) unit. At Ankuabe in early 1918 two 3.7-inch howitzers were issued in exchange for 2.75-inch Breech Loading guns (10-pounders). The howitzers were in action for the first time at the capture of Medo Fort , 11th April 1918. (Reference Graham and Farndale.)
 
The 24th (Hazara) Mountain Battery (Frontier Force) disembarked at Dar-es-Salaam on 26th April 1917. During a rail journey to Morogoro on 6th May the train ran off the line whilst crossing a bridge that gave way, killing or drowning 16 men, including the Salutri (farrier or horse-doctor). Most of the dead were in a goods wagon which was stuck in the mud and water and could not be recovered for five days. A great number of men were hurled into the water and carried downstream into the trees below the bridge and were rescued by swimmers. The Battery took over the six 10-pounder guns previously used by 28th (Lahore) Mountain Battery but initially only one section of guns were operational. (Reference Graham and Farndale.)
Unfortunately Pradhan (Author of "Indian Army in East Africa) has confused the issue, and also gunners in their histories often use the post-Great War battery titles (eg: 2nd (Derajat) Mountain Battery (F.F.) instead of the actual 22nd (Derajat)Mountain Battery (F.F.) used in the war. Also the word “Pack” can be used instead of “Mountain”. But you can wind your way through the maze!
 
Additional Information:
 
Order of Battle 01/02/16
4th Indian Mountain Artillery Brigade (under Lieut.-Col C.E. Forestier-Walker) Consisted of
27th Indian Mountain Battery (Major A J T Farfan). Arrived at Mombasa 27/08/14. Embarked for India 02/01/18. Battle Honours "East Africa 1916-18", "Kilimanjaro", "Narungombe" and "Nyangao".
28th Indian Mountain Battery (Major A M Colville). Arrived Mombasa about 30/10/14. Involved at Tanga with guns in action lashed on deck of Transport Bharata. Returned to India in December 1916. Battle Honours "East Africa 1914-18" & "Kilimanjaro".
Both batteries equipped with 6 x 10-pdrs with mule transport, although some MT was used in Tsetse fly areas. New gun shields made of specially hardened steel were fitted at Nairobi.

Two fresh mountain batteries arrived from India.
1st Kashmir Mountain Battery on 05/12/16 (Major Dharam Singh Bahadur, Maj A F Cole as Special Service Officer) Embarked for India 02/02/18. Battle Honour "East Africa 1916-18"
22nd (Derajat) Indian Mountain Battery FF on 18/12/16 (Major S Perry) (FF = Fronter Force, which I would suggest is the North West Frontier Force) Used new 3.7 inch howitzers for the first time on 11/04/18 at Medo. Left for India 11/18. Battle Honours "East Africa 1916-18" and "Narungombe".

24th (Hazara) Indian Mountain Battery left Nowshera 07/03/17. Smallpox broke out on the voyage & delayed disembarkation until 26/04/17. The Battery left Dar-es-Salaam by train 05/05/17. 06/05/17 bridge gave way & part of train plunged into river below. 16 men died.
They took in 28 men, 6 guns, 34 mules 1 British WO and 33 followers from the 28th Indian Mountain Battery [presumably left behind when 28th went back to India in Dec 1916].
Left for India 11/18. Battle Honour "East Africa 1917-18"

2.75 inch guns - Both 1st Kashmir and one section of 27th Indian MB reported in action at Nyangao 16-17/10/17 with this equipment. However reading a little further on, the conclusion to the chapter has "whether the ubiquitous 10-pounders (2.75 inch), the 2.95 inch guns of the West Africans, or the new 3.7 inch....."!!

All the guns used were 2.75-inch but the first ones in theatre were the 10-pounders that had been issued by 1903. Here's Graham's description of them:
"The drawbacks of the 2.5-inch R.M.L. gun had long been known in India, but its failure in South Africa led to a hasty rearmament of all mountain batteries. A 10-pr. jointed B.L. gun was in the experimental stage and its trials were hurried on so that all batteries were rearmed by the end of 1903; but, although far superior to the 2.5-inch gun, it was still behind the times. By this time field artillery carriages had a top cradle to take up the recoil so that the carriage remained steady when the gun was fired; the 10-pr. carriage differed little from that of the 2.5-inch and the recoil was controlled by a similar "check rope" round the trail. The two portions of the gun could be united without noise with a wrench. The breech portion was wire wound.
Weights, etc., of the 10-pr. gun: Weight, 404 lb.; calibre, 2.75 in.; length, 6 ft. 4.5 in.; grooves, 16; wheel track, 2 ft. 10 in.; maximum elevation, 25 degrees; maximum depression, 15 degrees; muzzle velocity, 1,289 f.s.; charge, 6 oz. 14 drs. cordite; ammunition mules, 6 per gun; Range, 6,000 yards, but sights engraved to 4,200 yards only.
The gun was provided with shrapnel and star shell; case shot was originally issued but soon withdrawn; the use of cordite and the breech-loading system made for a more rapid rate of fire than could be got out of the R.M.L. gun, and the range was half as long again. Common shell was provided later."
But another 2.75-inch with a 12.5-pound shell was issued once the Great War started. As Graham says:
"In the ensuing years during the First World War batteries were rearmed, as occasion permitted, with the 2.75-inch B.L. gun. This was the 10-pr. without trunnions, recoiling through a cradle, after firing, to the extent allowed by the piston of a hydraulic buffer, and forced back to the firing position by the energy of springs compressed during the recoil. This equipment was called 2.75-inch converted, Mark I. A later pattern was called 2.75-inch B.L. Mark I: this had a breech ring.
A long trail which made two loads for transport was provided, and a reversible axle which could be used in "high" or "low" position. A steel shield made in four parts hinged together protected the detachment; it weighed 78 lb. and was carried on the same mule as the rear end of the trail. The gun itself was a few pounds lighter than the 10-pr. Other differences were:
Wheel track, 3 feet.
Maximum range, 5,500 yards. Full charge, 7 oz. 12 dr. ballistite, M.V. 1,300 f.s.; Half charge, M.V., 775 f.s.
Height of axis of gun:
High position, 43.5 inches elevation 22°, depression 8°.
Low position, 32.5 inches elevation 15°, depression 15°.
Sighting was up to date, i.e., independent line of sight and a No.7 dialsight were provided.
Projectiles: Shrapnel, weight 12.5 lb.; H.E., weight 12.5 lb.; Star, weight 12.5 lb.
This equipment was approved for issue in 1911, but Indian batteries did not receive it until several years later. Its transport took an extra mule and relief mule.
Each ammunition box weighed 25 lb. more than the 10-pr. box, and the battery carried 714 shrapnel, 42 H.E. and 24 star shell.
The equipment for draught weighed 75 lb. The two-man mekometer was still issued. A fuze indicator was provided with a corrector scale. Fuze T. and P. No. 80 was issued for shrapnel and D.A. No. 44 for H.E. The shrapnel was exceptionally powerful and won good opinions everywhere. There was little difference in the rate of fire compared with the 10-pr. as a single motion breech mechanism was not provided, but this gun had the great merit of not overturning when fired from bad ground.
The handbook was published in 1914."
Thus I interpret the 22nd Derajat Pack Battery entry for 28th August 1917 to mean that four 2.75-inch converted, Mark I (or 2.75-inch B.L. Mark I) guns were issued. To reinforce this interpretation the 29th September 1917 entry reads:
"Orders received to reduce the 10 Pr. Section. Battery to consist of 4 2.75" guns only."
 
ESTABLISHMENTS
Here is 1 JAK Mountain Battery's establishment for East Africa:
Strength: 5 officers, 198 rank and file, 38 followers, 3 private followers, and 172 mules.
Guns: Four 10-pounder B.L. guns
 
ESTABLISHMENT OF FOLLOWERS IN AN INDIAN ARMY MOUNTAIN BATTERY
A six-gun 10-pr. bty. (1913)
1 tindal (Head Follower)
6 cooks
3 syces (Grooms)
1 head smith
3 smiths
1 head carpenter
2 carpenters
1 head saddler
4 saddlers
1munshi (Clerk)
3 sweepers (Cleaners)
1 mutsuddy (Accountantant
1 bhisti (Water Carrier, traditionally using a goatskin bag)
3 hand bhistis (Water distributors, using pakhals which are canvas containers)
Some followers were attested as combatants, some as non-combatants, and others only enrolled.
One mule carried the kits of six fighting men or eight followers.
 
Thankyou :-)

 

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