Polish artillery in Pinsk 1920

[ts]

Can anyone here tell, what model the gun is?
It seems not to be Russian.
Austrian or German?

[Westfalia Chris]

The pic is not terribly clear, and I am no expert, but it does bear some similarity to a French 75mm M1897 field gun.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canon_de_75_mod%C3%A8le_1897

Would make sense as the Polish army got a lot of surplus French equipment after the end of WW1, AFAIK.

[ts]

Sorry for the picture quality, but it is copied from the book "White Eagle - Red Star".
It is not the French 75mm, the ending of the barrel is different.
My best guess is an Austrian gun, but I have no knowledge of Austrian guns.
The Poles used German, Austrian, Russian, French and even Italian guns.

[Poliorketes]

Sorry for the picture quality, but it is copied from the book "White Eagle - Red Star".

Sure? I can't find it there.
It might be a Putilov 7,62 mm M1900, though the barrel seems to be short. AFAIK the germans shortened some captured russian guns for use as IG. Perhabs one of those?

[Anatoli]

Could be a wz. 02/26 3-inch Putilov gun. Produced in 1902 but rechambered to 75mm in 1926.
That was the artillery used by the Polish cavalry.

[David]

not sure
but it is a horse artillery unit.
http://www.britishpathe.com/record.php?id=81062
show a battery firing ? it might help.
http://www.passioncompassion1418.com/Canons/english_CanonsIndex_Nation.html#ReichIILegere
the artillery regements list on equipment for 1918 to 1921 might show you the way

other bits?
http://vendheaume.fighters.pagesperso-orange.fr/russpole.html
http://www.militaryheadgear.com/items/7047
http://nethelper.com/article/Polish%E2%80%93Lithuanian_War
http://www.polishforums.com/history-poland-34/august-battle-poland-red-army-45798/
http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?163126-Battle-of-Warsaw-1920-and-Polish-Army-day

[David]

This is all i can find to send you in the right direction, since you will probley have better information in polish on the internet
Battle of the Niemen River show the 4th Army 16th Pomeranian Division Polish artillery in Pinsk 1920 ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Niemen_River
hope this helps

[Anatoli]

That was a nice lineup by the Poles, Pilsudski, Sikorski and Rydz-Smigly all in one place 

Btw does anyone know if there has been any interwar Polish soldier models release? I think Siberia Miniatures had a interwar line in the works?

[ts]

Polish figures are being worked on.
See for instance
http://frothersunite.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=711061#711061
Yes, David, I have some informations on the Polish artillery, but it does not goes into details on the more "strange" guns used by the Poles.
The most used are wellknown, but only 25% of the used ones 1918-19-20are mentioned as "modern", so a lot of different models have been in use.
I have not yet found a source or book, which give some details on all that.
The gun on the picture looks as a light gun with some horse artillery, being part of a cavalry unit, which can be seen in the background. The limber looks like it is made for 2 men, so rather small.
To Poliorketes, you is right I am not sure, the picture is from "White Eagle - Red Star". But I assume it is from its caption. I found the picture on an Ukrainian military history forum showing pictures with Poles 1920. Most of the other pictures with same letter typings were copied from an English version of "White Eagle - Red Star".

[Anatoli]

Thanks for the link TS, those Poles are just  !   

[David]

I will be getting a 28mm Schneider-Canet 75mm field gun M. 1904 with limber cast soon for my WW2 greek army since they had 20 of them.
did the polish army have any in 1919 to 1920 war ?
http://www.bulgarianartillery.it/Bulgarian%20Artillery%201/Schneider-Canet%2075mm%201904.htm
Thanks
David

[ts]

Certainly the Poles had 75 mm guns, that became their main gun, I will find some figures on it, at the end they had more than 2.000. Some came with Haller's Blue Corps, but many were acquired further.

[Mark Plant]

The photo is not in my copy of White Eagle Red Star. There is one in Zamoyski's Warsaw 1920 though.

I assumed it was horse artillery because all the men are mounted. If they are cavalry in the background, then I would normally expect them to have lances. (They could be mounted scouts from an infantry unit, I suppose, but why would they parade with the artillery?)

[ts]

You is correct, the photo is from Zamoyski.
The crew to the gun is holding in front of the gun, so I doubt the mounted men in the background are artillerymen.
Artillery will always have some kind of protective unit in its nearness. The batteries - normally with 4 guns - themselves seem to have had only 2 machine guns for close protection, and such teams would not demand so many further cavalrymen.

[Mark Plant]

Mamontov's book shows the typical horse artillery battery in the AFSR.

It had four guns: each of six horses of which three were ridden and eight mounted crew. That's more or less what we see here in the front, which is why I think they are horse artillery.

There were also two tachankas, and a wagon train (to the right in the photo, I suspect). But the unit also had a small unit of mounted scouts and there must have been other support men: officer's batmen, messengers. They don't have to be artillerymen to be in an artillery unit. The block of mounted men on the right appear to have dark collars, which makes me wonder if they aren't the unit's officers.

If they are cavalry at the back, then they are a very odd unit. Why would  forty men, without lances, be watching artillery?