The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread

[horridperson]

@ red kop

I'm the same.  Those last few models will fill out the range and give it the best looking army out of the box award in my opinion.  I may never finish that black Coach reno that's been stalled for the past year .

[JamesValentine]

Well pictures of the London 40k GT have been floating around.

http://boards.4chan.org/tg/thread/59828864/london-grand-tournament

Do 40k players have absolutely no self respect to actually pay to play on this garbage?
And from what I hear it's always like this.

[Sbloom141]

Well pictures of the London 40k GT have been floating around.

http://boards.4chan.org/tg/thread/59828864/london-grand-tournament

Do 40k players have absolutely no self respect to actually pay to play on this garbage?
And from what I hear it's always like this.

I think the majority of 40k players will play on semi-decent tables. Its not really a matter of self respect, I feel, but rather a focus on competition rather than narrative / scenario / fun. These people exist in every game; there are scores of people who play X-Wing with power gaming in mind and don’t give a hoot about the ‘names’ of the pilots on the table. It’s symptomatic of having a ‘tournament scene’ in any game or genre.

[Cait Sidhe]

It’s symptomatic of having a ‘tournament scene’ in any game or genre.

Yeah I keep hearing since I last played Warmachine in 1st Ed everyone uses 2D terrain these days to remove any ambiguity with line of sight and stuff, kinda makes me sad to be honest. I guess at some point it just becomes about crunching numbers and building lists.

[Belligerentparrot]

I guess at some point it just becomes about crunching numbers and building lists.

Exactly this. I've often wondered if this is an influence from Magic the Gathering, a game I actually really enjoy but which takes list(deck)-breaking and number-crunching to a really technical extreme (without losing what aesthetic value the game has, too).

[pixelgeek]

Yeah I keep hearing since I last played Warmachine in 1st Ed everyone uses 2D terrain these days to remove any ambiguity with line of sight and stuff, kinda makes me sad to be honest. I guess at some point it just becomes about crunching numbers and building lists.

Most of the players left playing Warmachine locally are tournament players.

[FionaWhite]

Exactly this. I've often wondered if this is an influence from Magic the Gathering, a game I actually really enjoy but which takes list(deck)-breaking and number-crunching to a really technical extreme (without losing what aesthetic value the game has, too).

A bit off-topic but I quit MtG because it became a game of checking the current set's most effective decks on the net, then buying the cards needed for that deck and playing that till the next set comes out.
After that I tried one of the videogame versions but it turns out not even that allows free deckbuilding anymore so I assume that's the way the game's supposed to be played now? *shrug*

As I've understood it that's the kind of thing going on in miniature tournament gaming too, at least 40k. Can't say if it's spread there from Magic or from there to Magic though.

[Belligerentparrot]

I always assumed GW was copying WotC when it came to the tournament stuff. I don't really know what I'm talking about, but bear with me if you feel like it.
I don't remember WD in the late 90s pushing the tournament scene, or anyone at that time naming army list archetypes - both kinds of thing (from company and from GW gamers) seemed to come after the MtG pro-tour really took off and made massive, massive, massive amounts of money for WotC.

Sure, power-gamers in GW games have always been hugely annoying bellends for the most part, but that kind of hardcore number crunching and gaming the meta-game and naming list archetypes... I'm sure these are all things were popularised by MtG. But one's precious meta-gaming calculations about list match-ups will be thrown out of whack if the scenery favours one side of the table 

Can't really blame the MtG guys, "win at all costs" means something different when the chance of turning pro is available.
 

[pixelgeek]

Can't really blame the MtG guys, "win at all costs" means something different when the chance of turning pro is available.

The internet and the ability to build up a wider tournament scene outside your city is probably what helped enable the 40K tourney scene.

[AWu]

Tournaments sell models.. That is one of the marketing strategies that pays up..

When tournaments were organized privately they allowed proxies and such.making tournament scene was only sensible option for GW..

Problem was that Magic, X wing, Warmachine were games created with that in mind. And GW were hobby gaming games.. So rules were written without certain tournament mindset. Wordings are unclear and subject to interpretation.. and armies weren't properly playtested or not updated for 10 or more years..
Polish tourney scene is very competitive and stats from making Polish rules clarifications and similar documents IMHO GW games arent good tourney games, Shadespire is. But as long as people want to be competitive.. there is money in it for GW..

[Kommando_J]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/05/21/21st-may-warhammer-adventures-tales-for-younger-readersgw-homepage-post-1/

Gw books for young kids...seriously GW get your house in order first ffs, also kinda get aos but 40!? This kinda puts me off GW tbh.

[pixelgeek]

Problem was that Magic, X wing, Warmachine were games created with that in mind.

None of them were. They adapted to a tournament scene after a few years and it seems as if X-Wing is updating itself to version 2 based on a fairly significant focus on tournament play. Aside from CCGs like Spoils there aren't a lot of games that have been designed with tournament play in mind

[pixelgeek]

Gw books for young kids...seriously GW get your house in order first ffs, also kinda get aos but 40!? This kinda puts me off GW tbh.

The 40K book fills me with dread.

[Kommando_J]

Apparently one of the characters is a weapons hating pacifist, one is a deserter and the tech priest has withered arm in an exoskeleton(any decent tech priest would just remove the arm)

[commissarmoody]

Just think of them as the sanitized version of the bible stories that they teach kids in Sunday school. Or the old Grim folk tells that got the happy ending Disney treatment. Pretty much as the propaganda that the kids in those fantasy worlds are fed on "Civilized" Imperial worlds.... Before the realty of being drafted into the work force or military crushes them.