*
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
October 07, 2022, 05:07:46 AM

Login with username, password and session length

Donate

We Appreciate Your Support

Members
Stats
  • Total Posts: 1596698
  • Total Topics: 111770
  • Online Today: 183
  • Online Ever: 1675
  • (December 28, 2020, 04:48:59 PM)
Users Online

Recent

Author Topic: New from Battlefront: TEAM YANKEE  (Read 14623 times)

Offline julesav

  • Scientist
  • Posts: 468
Re: New from Battlefront: TEAM YANKEE
« Reply #30 on: August 08, 2015, 09:38:03 AM »
For what it's worth in the book Team Yankee is composed as follows:

CHQ: 2x M1 Abrams and a 'command track' - not clear whether this is an M113 or an M577.

2x Tank platoons: each with 4x M1 Abrams.
1x Mech Infantry platoon: 4x M113s, each dismounts a team of 4-5 blokes with an M60, and a team of 2 blokes with a Dragon ATGW system.
1x Anti-tank section: 2x M901 ITOW missile launchers.

In the course of the book they lose the ITOW attachment, gain an artillery observer in the FISTV variant of M901, have elements of the 'scout platoon' attached in M3 Cavalry fighting vehicles, are supported by 155mm artillery (presumably M109s) and a single M163 Vulcan air defence vehicle. They receive air support from AH-1 Cobra gunships and A-10 aircraft.

Scout platoon TO&E appears to be: 1x M3CFV platoon hq vehicle. 2 or 3 sections each with 2x M3 CFVs. In the book the PHQ vehicle has become a casualty before they are briefly attached to the team.

The book is set in 1985 in the middle of the US Army's transition into the Div'86 TO&Es. M2 Bradleys are in slow production so the Mech platoon is still in M113s. Scout platoon got M3 cavalry variant of Bradley as a 'priority'. Missing from a typical 'Team' TO&E are SP mortars of either M125 81mm type and M106 4.2" type.

Russian kit is limited to T-72s, BMPs (variants not specified), BTR60s and T-62s. MilMi-24 Hinds make a brief appearance netting one Abrams for loss of one Hind! The only air to air combat mentioned is when the afore-mentioned Hind is 'splashed' by a Cobra! Historically speaking 'Russians' in Group of Soviet Forces West Germany would have T-64s or possibly T-80s, probably BTR70 variants and both BMP-1 and BMP-2s. Polish T-55s also appear briefly as targets for the team. West Germans appear briefly, but with so little detail mentioned that you cannot identify a unit type from which they come.

To be honest in the book the Soviet kit only exists to be destroyed in relatively vast numbers by our heroes. Although interestingly the major character's M1 is ko'd by T62s! Spoiler alert - he survives!

From Battlefront's point of view this force requires only two new AFV kits, the M1 and the M2/3. They already make M113s so they could add two new turret variants to make assembly of M163 and M901s possible. They already make AH-1 Cobras, so would only need to make a set of TOW weapon pods to update them for post 'Nam Central Front. They'd need to make US infantry but only a platoon pack if they keep to the 'Team Yankee' TO&E from the book.

Models for the 'Russians' are a different matter entirely as currently only T-55s exist in Battlefront's catalogue.
"Some scientists say that humans exhibit a behavior called neophilia, which is a preference for new objects. It’s why we like shiny new things."

Offline Arrigo

  • Mastermind
  • Posts: 1064
  • errare humanum est, perseverare diabolicum est
    • Forward HQ my new blog where you can laugh at my crappy photos!
Re: New from Battlefront: TEAM YANKEE
« Reply #31 on: August 08, 2015, 11:40:46 AM »
Well, the T-72 thing is interesting. At the time we were quite confused about the reason why of it. It was before cookie Sewell and Steve Zaloga published their research and started to shed light on the whole tank design controversy. It did not help that the three beasts (-64 -72 -80) shared some similarities, the same gun, and for a while we thought they were sharing the same autoloader. If the DDR was receiving -72 someone assumed also soviet units would have (as seen in the Central Group of Forces). It was a quite interesting intelligence conundrum (ehy... just got the idea to use it as an example of why intelligence can be misleading for my first lecture!!!!!  lol).

BMP at the time were often referred as A and B in DoD publications. so some of the error in the book were understandable. Also it is interesting to look at this old thing:

https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/8833/firefight

Firefight was a late 70s' design by Jim Dunningan for the army and has a quite interesting view on what the Soviet had at the time.

It is fascinating to look at how distorted was our picture.


Well, what I hope they do is:

T-62, 64, 72. Not overly interested in the -72, I have plenty, but look plastic kits are nice and they promised plastic. BMP in both version. 

From the US side I strongly hope in the basic studd, M60A3, M1 and M1A1, M113 I am sure will be recycled, maybe with the external tanks, I owuld like to see BF doing an aeraly mark Bradley, but on the other hand I have aplenty, and already painted. Curious to see their US infantry too. I think the initial book (wild guess based on skimpy intelligence) will have at least US tank and mech infantry companies and probably Tank and MR for the soviets with variations on a theme. considering it is BF... expect M109 and SO-122 in the least... Probably Hinds, possibly Apache...

Arrigo




"Put Grant straight in"

for pretty tanks and troops: http://forwardhq.blogspot.com

Offline von Lucky

  • Galactic Brain
  • Posts: 8796
  • Melbourne, Australia
    • Donner und Blitzen Wargaming
Re: New from Battlefront: TEAM YANKEE
« Reply #32 on: August 08, 2015, 11:01:47 PM »
I'm looking forward to this, as others have said it will increase the interest in Cold War wargaming. Will most likely use both my 3 & 6mm collections.
- Karsten

"Imagination is the only weapon in the war against reality."
- Lewis Carroll, Alice in Wonderland

Blog: Donner und Blitzen

Offline CptJake

  • Mastermind
  • Posts: 1418
  • Hooah!
Re: New from Battlefront: TEAM YANKEE
« Reply #33 on: August 09, 2015, 01:19:33 PM »
Missing from a typical 'Team' TO&E are SP mortars of either M125 81mm type and M106 4.2" type.

Not really.  The Team is based on a tank company (and is a tank heavy team).  The organic tank company did not have mortars.   In this team the company traded a tank platoon and got a mech infantry platoon.   A team based on an infantry company would have had them.  Even then it would have been the 81mm, the 4.2" were in a BN mortar platoon (Tank BNs had them too).  The BN (or more likely TF) commander would keep those mortars as his only indirect asset he could rely on having/control.   Depending on the TF mission they would likely support a counter-recon screen and then the overall TF defense, or be placed to support his main effort in the attack.   Often the mortar platoon would split into two sections (each with a FDC) and the sections would 'leap frog' with one moving to a new firing position as the other was set and providing fire support.   
Every time a bad person dies, a Paratrooper gets his wings.

Offline Big Drunk

  • Schoolboy
  • Posts: 9
Re: New from Battlefront: TEAM YANKEE
« Reply #34 on: August 21, 2015, 05:07:28 PM »
Does anyone know of a good post-cold war analysis  of actual soviet planning and capabilties versus western beliefs? I (barely) remember  some of the discussion  when the Abrams was upgraded  to the 120mm, people were arguing that it wasn't needed in Western Europe, now I'm seeing that the 105 wouldn't penetrate frontal armour on the Soviet  tanks. (Reading on the internet, so I'm trying to find something substantial. )

Offline Arrigo

  • Mastermind
  • Posts: 1064
  • errare humanum est, perseverare diabolicum est
    • Forward HQ my new blog where you can laugh at my crappy photos!
Re: New from Battlefront: TEAM YANKEE
« Reply #35 on: August 21, 2015, 06:45:57 PM »
Does anyone know of a good post-cold war analysis  of actual soviet planning and capabilties versus western beliefs? I (barely) remember  some of the discussion  when the Abrams was upgraded  to the 120mm, people were arguing that it wasn't needed in Western Europe, now I'm seeing that the 105 wouldn't penetrate frontal armour on the Soviet  tanks. (Reading on the internet, so I'm trying to find something substantial. )


There was a test made in the late nineties that was as rigorous as bogus. I can dig the details. Anyway the claimed to have tested Cold War capabilities but then you discovered that used post cold-war rounds and ERA (Kontakt 5) armour. I think Jane's was involved but for all its scientific approach it was kinda skewered. Yes the 105mm would not have penetrated Kontakt 5 but Kontakt 5 was not even around. USMC 105,, had no problem in penetrating T-72G and M1 in Iraqi inventory, and these had better frontal protection than vanilla T-72 and T-72A. On the other hand the frontal armour on the B was better. There is quite a lot of discussion on that on Zaloga M1 vs T-72.  At wors I can fire some questions directly to Steve. He usually replies!

Arrigo

 

Related Topics

  Subject / Started by Replies Last post
3 Replies
2328 Views
Last post August 14, 2015, 02:32:02 AM
by fluffy05
4 Replies
2933 Views
Last post August 17, 2015, 12:36:43 PM
by Redmao
7 Replies
2232 Views
Last post August 25, 2015, 03:15:17 PM
by Ulu Elsomalien
7 Replies
2000 Views
Last post September 01, 2015, 08:57:23 AM
by Arlequín
14 Replies
3667 Views
Last post September 17, 2015, 06:20:03 PM
by Iain R