So, where is all the later 15th century horse bard?

[puster]

Some bards appear to be be obviously plain steel with gilted ornamentation. The coloured ones could be fabric (or coloured leather?) over armour

The Regesta Imperii contain a list of equipment that Maximilian ordered around 1504 for one of his campaigns, and it includes 100 sets of horse barding from buffalo leather (Büffelleder, bardae de bufalo) ordered in Milano ( in addition to some 50 sets of armour)  and 20 sets from Linz, at a cost of 10fl per barding. Not sure what animal this "buffalo"-leather is exactly made from, though - it could be just a name for a specific treatment.

http://www.regesta-imperii.de/regesten/suche/result/nr/1504-02-28_4_0_14_4_0_2572_18296.html?tx_hisodat_sources[searchMode]=10&cHash=581b3083fbb83571ceaabd2b1662fe67#rinav
http://www.regesta-imperii.de/regesten/suche/result/nr/1504-03-30_6_0_14_4_0_2757_18481.html?tx_hisodat_sources[searchMode]=10&cHash=0b28cf7661cfc553532114b661f1d151#rinav

[painterman]

Some WIP attempts at wielding the Green Stuff and creating bard for my Burgundians, using some of the visual references I found.





more in progress and bit more on the blog.
Thanks, Simon.

[Codsticker]

Nice work. Is that the leather (or "buffalo") barding mentioned earlier?

[Arlequín]

Some WIP attempts at wielding the Green Stuff and creating bard for my Burgundians, using some of the visual references I found.

Someone is becoming very good at this 'Green Stuff' thing. 

The Regesta Imperii contain a list of equipment that Maximilian ordered around 1504 for one of his campaigns, and it includes 100 sets of horse barding from buffalo leather (Büffelleder, bardae de bufalo) ordered in Milano ( in addition to some 50 sets of armour)  and 20 sets from Linz, at a cost of 10fl per barding. Not sure what animal this "buffalo"-leather is exactly made from, though - it could be just a name for a specific treatment.

I would presume, like Buffalo Mozzarella, it was made from Italian Buffalos. 

That aside, that is a great piece of information you presented. Thanks! 

[painterman]

Hi Codsticker
The plan is for all the bard on these mounts to be steel armour - perhaps with plenty of gilding, to reflect their high status.
Cheers, Simon.

[dragonwagon]

I read online that the Gendarmes for Phillip the Whatever number. in his Italian campaign had enough horse barded knights to only fill the front rank of his Gendarmes de Elite in the Italian wars.

[wrgmr1]

Hello Simon,

Pintrest has some interesting images of horse barding, you just have to sign in.

https://www.pinterest.com/search/pins/?q=horse%20burgundian&rs=remove&term_meta[]=horse%7Ctyped&term_meta[]=burgundian%7Ctyped&remove_refine=barding%7Ctyped

One of those images lead me to these:

http://book-graphics.blogspot.ca/2014/02/louis-xi-aquarelles-de-job.html

https://www.pinterest.com/pin/522628731740222852/

Bethsabee tapestry:

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7323/11641681223_c8763a3b08_z.jpg

https://www.pinterest.com/pin/522628731739847277/

I used the Front Rank WOR figures for my Burgundians, some of the knights have horse barding.

[painterman]

Thanks Wrgmr1
I use Pintrest too and collate a number of boards there myself.
I'm trying to use only references which I can date with certainty for the later 15th century - for my Charles the Bold army - so the images you've referenced are too late for me I'm afraid. It does seem to reinforce my assumption that horse bard, with steel plates, comes into use from c1500 - based on remaining pieces and imagery - I believe linked to an increase in gunpowder weapons and so need to protect mounts for the upper classes at war.
Cheers, Simon.

[AdamPHayes]

I very much doubt if gendarmes expected their barding to be proof against even early firearms.  The cost and additional weight would be ruinous on the finances and the stamina of the horses. If there is an increase in the use of plate steel bard after  1500 it is likely to be due to improvements in the manufacturing process and design of the armours that allowed them to  replace cloth, mail and composite horse barding.

[painterman]

Adam - I agree that developments in the manufacturing process for large sheets of steel helped, but of they were too expensive or too heavy for the horses, then they'd not have existed? The introduction of bard appears to follow a period of circa 1425 - 1495, where the horses are unarmoured, apart from chamfron and crinnet, so it's not a lateral development of replacing mail/cloth - these appears redundant by c 1425, based on all images and remaining pieces IMHO.

Anyway, we can continue to discuss and speculate, it's fun.

In meantime, heres the completed conversions for my next Burgundian men at arms unit - this are my best efforts with the Kneadatite.



More pics are on my blog: http://je-lay-emprins.blogspot.co.uk/
Cheers, Simon.

[Steel fist]

It's a great project, I'm looking forward to seeing how this unit comes out as it seems it's going to be your show stopper unit. Will you be using that mounted knight you got from me in this unit?

[painterman]

Oliver
That mounted knight is in there - saved him for this unit!! (...and many thanks).
In the picture he's inconveniently obscured by plumes on the horse - have a look at the blog and you should find him (with added plumes - I took the big risk of drilling a hole into your handiwork!)
All the best, Simon

[Jericho]

Threads like this are very bad for me 

I try to focus on my Late Romans and everytime I keep getting sucked back to the Swiss-Burgundian Wars...

Can't wait to see this finished. I need the inspiration for my own household gendarmes.

[wrgmr1]

Those look great Simon!

I found this today, it has some Burgundian illustrations in the 15th century section.

http://www.warfare.altervista.org/index.htm

Cheers,
Thomas

[painterman]

Anthony of Burgundy - one of the converted figures with horse bard.
The other chaps in his contingent are coming along too...
Pics to follow when they're all done.



Cheers
Simon.