28mm U.S. Dragoons, 1830s - anything out there?

[Westfalia Chris]

Hi all,

looking for some input for a project roughly themed around "The West in the Earlies".

I did a bunch of Foundry Mountain Men and Indians earlier this year and am currently drifting back to finish off the project. I'd really like to add a small patrol (4-10) of U.S. Cavalry to the mix, ideally in the 1830s uniform style.

That said, I wouldn't be too picky regarding uniform details - I'm taking a "Hollywood Approach" anyway since it is intended to be an adventure skirmish thingie, so I wouldn't mind using Mexican-American-War figures with some conversions (e.g. the forage caps) as long as the uniform is reasonably similar.

Now, from what I found so far, available ranges include:

• Old Glory 25mm Second Seminole War and Mexican American War
• Warrior Miniatures 25mm Mexican-American War
• 1st Corps Mexican-American War, somewhere between 25mm and 28mm

Sadly, the glorious Gringo40s MexAm figures are out, since they are 40mm and from what I see there is only a single pose. I'm not too fond of Old Glory for various reasons and don't know the Warrior stuff first-hand but suspect it to be on the small side from the pics I've seen. The Boot Hill range seems to be limited to irregular cavalry on the Americano side, for obvious reasons - those would be perfect in style (I've got some of the Presidiales), but alas, no figures.

Next, the tricky restrictions.

• I would like the figures' style to be *roughly* compatible with the Foundry Mountain Men figures (Mike Owen sculpts, if I am not mistaken?), but that is not a must since I've added other suitable figures before. As long as they look similar from arm's length, I'd consider them. That would ideally mean somewhat hefty 28mm ones.
• Poses aren't that important (I don't mind sedate or action-posed), but should be somewhat reasonable and not too far off the chart, anatomically-speaking.
• If there are mounted AND dismounted versions available, that's a definite plus.

Personally, I am leaning towards the 1st Corps figures, with some modifications to the forage caps to better represent the earlier ones - the MexAm ones look to be more "balloony" to my eye. There's only four trooper poses plus a handful of command figures, and no dismounted versions.

That said, I also wouldn't mind converting existing figures from other ranges (e.g. late Napoleonics, Carlists etc.) if the overall uniform is suitable and the main effort might be weapons and headwear. Generally, I am looking for something in the image of "the dashing cavalryman".

In any case, I would greatly appreciate any assistance in sourcing something suitable. I am quite sure there must be ranges out there I don't know of.

[traveller]

Unfortunately the existing ranges are quite poor for todays standards. You have not considered doing some conversions? Personally I find Perry making the best cavalry sculpts. For example the BIF range have suitable bodies with crossbelts if you can find some US like heads

[bulldogger2000]

I would suggest giving the Old Glory figures a look.  Normally Old Glory can be a tad "odd" looking, but I recently painted up Seminoles and US troops and they are very nice.  They are compatible in size to the Foundry mountain men, and they have the added bonus of separate heads so it's one less step you need to take in the head swapping process.

[Malamute]

I would suggest giving the Old Glory figures a look.  Normally Old Glory can be a tad "odd" looking, but I recently painted up Seminoles and US troops and they are very nice.  They are compatible in size to the Foundry mountain men, and they have the added bonus of separate heads so it's one less step you need to take in the head swapping process.

He's right, a friend of mine has the dragons from the Seminoles range and the separate heads are a bonus as you can position them realistically, not the 'Hey Jo' pose common in the OG stuff. I reckon they are better sculpts than the 1st Corps stuff.

[Westfalia Chris]

You have not considered doing some conversions?  For example the BIF range have suitable bodies with crossbelts if you can find some US like heads.

Well, I would, as I wrote:

That said, I also wouldn't mind converting existing figures from other ranges (e.g. late Napoleonics, Carlists etc.) if the overall uniform is suitable and the main effort might be weapons and headwear. Generally, I am looking for something in the image of "the dashing cavalryman".

The thing is, I'd be interested to know what options are out there. Having recently built a couple of their HYW plastics, I'm more inclined to the Perrys than I used to be, so using some of their stuff wouldn't be out of the question. Their BIF range looks VERY British to my untrained eye, though, and maybe a bit too modern, but I agree that they are nice-looking figs in their own right.

I would suggest giving the Old Glory figures a look.  Normally Old Glory can be a tad "odd" looking, but I recently painted up Seminoles and US troops and they are very nice.  They are compatible in size to the Foundry mountain men, and they have the added bonus of separate heads so it's one less step you need to take in the head swapping process.

He's right, a friend of mine has the dragons from the Seminoles range and the separate heads are a bonus as you can position them realistically, not the 'Hey Jo' pose common in the OG stuff. I reckon they are better sculpts than the 1st Corps stuff.

Well, I wouldn't have suspected that. I had seen a section of the dismounted ones somewhere else on the OW board, but they seemed to suffer from that certain OG lankyness I am not too fond of. That said, I do have a couple of their Woodland Indians from days of yore, so I'd better double-check - would save me a lot of work.

[Frontiersman]

I've done quite a lot of research on U.S. Dragoons from 1833 to 1861 as I am also a dragoon re-enactor in Stephen Watts Kearney's "Army of the West", circa 1846. Here's a few nuggets of knowledge I'd like to pass along:

1. When it comes to dragoon headgear in the 1830's, your best bet is to go with the M1833 leather forage cap, aka the "brain boiler". The M1839 forage cap, which is sometimes mistakenly referred to as a "wheel hat" probably wasn't issued until 1842.

2. Several dragoons recorded in the journals that a good part of the 1st Regiment did not have the issue uniform for the better part of 1833. Most wore what civilian clothes they had upon enlistment or as members of the Mounted Ranger Battalion which preceded the 1st Dragoons. During Colonel Henry Dodge's 1835 tour of the prairie's, most men had only bits and pieces of issued uniform and equipment. So, IMHO, it's perfectly fine to have dragoons in hunting frocks, civilian hats, and trousers.

3. I've been eyeing 1st Corps dragoons for quite awhile now and really want to build a command stand with Brigadier General Kearney and famed mountain man Kit Carson. But for the 1830's, I'd stick with Old Glory. Hope this helps.

I portray an armed escorts for these guys. They have a first rate historical impression: http://www.topogs.org/

[Westfalia Chris]

Frontiersman,

Thank you very much. Puts an interesting perspective to things - I'm leaning more towards the uniformed variety (although they'll be quite too late for the fur trade proper, if we go for historical accuracy). Still, a careful mid of rag-tag and regulations could make for interesting visuals.