The Thaw of '46

[Rich H]

Interesting idea.
I'd suggest using left over Pz-1 turrets perhaps? 
Put a fighting compartment in fornt of the engine with the bow MG in the glacis and turret above. So the vehicle crew is together.  Then put the engine bay in the middle and the troop compartment in the rear, possible open topped with Hanomag style MG rear AA mount.  Maybe two pintle MGs?

[horridperson]

This is an awesome thread.  You're selling me Konflikt '47 better than Warlord is .  Love the conceptualized AFVs!

[Rich H]

There is a bit of a project rumbling on in the background in a dark corner of facebook - alternative World War 2.
Basically Weird War without the weird. 

Lots of us were moaning about the fantasy vampires and occullt nonsense so we are slowly gathering stuff for a fan made Bolt Action addition.

The main premise is change a few dubious Strategic decisions, extend the war and see what happens.
Deviates in winter 1942/1943

It also means we can make use of the late war prototypes and paper panzers

[Wyrmalla]

This whole thread came about from me seeing Konflikt -47 then going "god damn they just had to add zombies again!". I then say A Kill in the Morning at Waterstones, read that and spun off from the idea that Hess' crackjob of a plan may have worked.

With much of the war ending, or not even starting, particularly the non-stop RAF bombing of the industry, that'd mean Germany would be in a much better position in this fictional 1946. Men with Stg-44s wouldn't have been limited to firing 30 rounds a day for one. The wonder weapons would've still been their, because Hitler's Hitler, but I'd like to have though that more practical minds prevailed after the ongoing attrition, and we'd have still seen stuff like the E-series and a reoganization of certain army elements.

So when people puzzle how the world had advanced so far in such a small space of time we're not using the same circumstances that Berlin was somehow saved and then the Nazis had a million Maus being produced out of nowhere. I can't ponder myself how they would have ever managed anything like that with the Americans or the British involved. ...Even if the Germans got the bomb early; though that'd just resulted in the Allies nuking Dresden or something.

Anyhow...

With the Tiger II APC thing I was thinking of giving it the same treatment as the Panther APC. Move the engine to the front right, add a compartment with a raised roof to the back and then stick a turret on it. Being that it'd be a much more specialized vehicle than the conventional AFVs I already have it may be worth it to imply NBC protection, or stick some spaced armour all over it (the whole concept would be for it to be the best protected APC available, regardless of production time and quantity available- seeing as its for transporting an off the wall wonder weapon).

Turret wise its up in the air. I have a Panzer II Luchs one saved for an Sd.Kfz-251 conversion for some of my SS, but I suppose I could downgrade that to a Panzer I. The problem's sourcing a loose turret at all, though possible Warlord could handle that?

Having blithered a bit there, for practicality's sake I'd again point out that whilst something like this may be feasible as a one off, a Tiger II APC's just there for rule of cool only. The IDF Achzarit, one of the if not the heaviest production AFV in the world, comes in at around 44 tons (being based on the 36 ton T-55. I'd mention at this point a Panther's 45 tons). A Tiger II is 70 tons. Now remove the turret, but add the renovations and then let's say 6-ish Power Armoured soldiers and we now have a vehicle which'll definitely crippling the poor infrastructure of the Eastern Front...

But, well, let's just not tell that to any wargamers who're reading this thread. Maybe the Soviets will just think its a fancy engineering vehicle and not immediately blow it up with artillery.

[Wyrmalla]

More junk.

Armoured Opel Blitz Truck.





With the acquisition of the European territories and Soviet assets, Germany had the resources to build (and fuel) the vehicles it needed to compete its enemy's. Even as the Katzchen took over as the Heer's "standard" personnel carrier, most of the military were still using horse drawn carts, trucks or civilian vehicles. Teniable at best for actual combat use, the proliferation of automatic-weaponary made un-armoured transports obsolete. For those forced to use vehicles though, field modifications were common; till full scale re-armament came in the late forties.

A Rubicon Opel Blitz with platicard slapped onto it. Its based on a flak variant of that truck which saw some use, however I haven't seen any German armoured trucks in this particular configuration (though similar looking vehicles appeared on the Soviet side). Another example of trying to keep my models in a state where they can be used against WWII armies instead of Cold War ones (hmn, though having a Cold War Nazi German army is a cool idea...). That and this thing's a lot cheaper than a Katzchen for game use (not that I really use transports anyway).

A full enclosed one (as an amulance or radio vehicle for artillery) might be an idea if I ever pick up the Rubicon tracked version.

Heer Infantry with Rifles



The advent of the StG-44 and its later derivaties marked a change in infantry warfare doctrine which would influence armies worldwide. Production of arms and ammunition were sufficient, but never adequate to outfit every unit. Rather new equipment was issued on a division level, with whole units being upgraded, as others continued to use older gear. In an effort to keep the later competative in the new battlefield Germany fell back on an earlier idea to increase an individual soldier's lethality by issueing scoped G-43s where available. However these had their own supply (and training) problems, and would never see deployment on any scale copared to the StG-44.

Another excuse to use WWII-era stuff. Assault Rifles are expensive in Bolt Action... Hitler was opposed to the StG-44 and saw it as just an upgraded sub-machine gun for quite a while. His plan was for semi-auto scoped rifles to become the standard for the army. In practice one of those sounds a hell of a lot more practical (just how many replacement scopes did they think they'd be going through in a month from breakages?).

A mix of Wargames Factory Germans, Warlord plastic Soviet and Warlord Winter Germans, with the odd West Wind or Warlord head + greenstuff. I went with more greys and browns with this lot just to offset them from the mostly-white armoured guys; and well, guys wore what they could get as long as it was warm (but no, I didn't represent the practice of painting your clothes white for camo...).

Oh, and besides all the other gammut of side projects, I started on a bit of terrain. I already have my Eastern European stuff for modern games which will be useful, but I've had a load of these Mars Attacks ruins sitting idle for yonks. Still lots to do with this.

[Predatorpt]

Great work with all the conversions (as usual) but a special appreciation must be made for the Mars Attacks! terrain usage! How did you made all those ruined bricks laying around?

[Wyrmalla]

The loose bricks are just out of a bag of plaster cast ones I bought from a model shop here. No idea who the manufacturer is, but you can buy that type of stuff online (IIRC Secret Weapon Miniatures does them, but they're probably more expensive than what I paid). If that isn't an option then just buy a length of balsa and cut that into rectangles, same effect.

[Predatorpt]

Yeah, not an option to buy them, I'll just cast some myself, . 

[Wyrmalla]

Seeing as it takes me ages to actually finish anything, bar flippant side projects I'll never use, here's another snippet.



And then nobody knows what the hell that's actually supposed to be... Well it ain't German. I'll need to raid my spare sprues for some more gubbins and add a bit more greenstuff (hinges mostly), then its off to be painted. ...Followed by sitting on a shelf unused for a good while. Meh, it'll do as scenery.

[Wyrmalla]

Soviet BTR-30 APC









Following encounters with the various models of German tracked armoured personnel carriers the Soviets were quick to put their own into development. At the time there had been little traction to create such a vehicle, the Red Army finding regular trucks sufficient for their purposes. With no end to the war in sight, and just coming out of a major restructuring, resources were put into providing the military a tracked carrier on a limited basis.

The tested T-34 chassis was chosen as a basis for this vehicle (already being superseded by newer tank variants). It was decided to create a transport with a similar purpose to the German Griffon (based on the Panther chassis), though mounting a pintle MMG (a turreted version being planned, but shelved for an entirely different vehicle with the same function). It was found that the single rear door hatch and small roof hatches made exiting difficult (later NBC protected vehicles omitting the roof hatches altogether) even if the rather heavy armour was seen as a compromise. The BTR-30 was primarily issued to Guard units and proved invaluable, but never in sufficient numbers as tank production was a higher priority.

Well I had a T-34 sitting there with nothing to do with it, so...

A Rubicon kit, reversed so the engine's at the front (taken from IDF conversions of T-54/55s) and a plasticard upper hull. As far as I'm aware there weren't any T-34 APCs, even as field conversions, so I was winging it with this. The design started off as a Type-63 crossed with a Azovette and bits of a BMP-1, which is probably obvious. It looks a little too high-tech for the period (especially when compared against my German stuff), but oh well, I'll pull the usual "its a specialised vehicle/ prototype/ from the "late 40s"" bull.

Oh, and comparisons with my Panther APC and a BMP ...because. It is rather tall.

[Predatorpt]

Great work, you're really the king of Weird war conversions

[Rich H]

We were pondering what would the soviets do if Lend Lease had been stopped.

Lend lease trucks kept the red army mobile but cut that off then they had to produce their own which would have impacted other production.

I was pondering either copies of the US half tracks or perhaps early BTR40 style armoured trucks.

But a fully tracks option is also possible - I was pondering how to covert a T-34 with minimal tooling change.  The fighting compartment isn't very large on a T-34 but it's not that hard to cut the hull roof out and add an armoured box extend that over the back deck and you get a heated seating area and then in Russian style stretch a tarp over the top.

Might get a T-34 now and have a go...

[wolivant]

Awesome work, please keep the images coming.

Wolt

[Wyrmalla]

The first hit on Google images for T-34 APC gives you this:



I went for the Achzarit style though as that design doesn't accommodate for a rear door. In order to don that they'd either need to lay the engine flat, or sideways and decrease the size of the troop compartment. Just reversing the hull and then either leaving the engine where it is (and raising the driver's area so he can see over it) or mounting it sideways and eliminating the gunner's position seems a better way to go. That does eliminate the distinctive T-34 front glacis look however.

Alternatively there's putting the compartment at the front using the existing engine layout. That seems especially cramped to me though.



It just seemed easier to me to go with something based on real world solutions to that particular problem. Even with you did leave the engine at the rear and mount it sideways to maintain the front glacis, I'd still suggest that it be modified so as the slopes weren't so drastic. ...Though that's perhaps moot. I like how the Type-63 has the raised front, as opposed to the drastic slope needed on the Azovette.



From an alt-history standpoint the concept's up in the air. I just slapped on the new top because it was easier and looked cool. If the military are already transitioning over to new vehicles like the T-54 then a lot of the T-34 tooling would be junk anyway (IIRC they were still making T-34s for years into the T-54 production though). APCs may not have been seen as a high priority, so any major re-tooling on an obsolete chassis may not have seen as warranted. I suppose it depends on what state the Soviets are in, and whether they have the resources to spare.

In the timeline I'm using Lend Lease never started and neither the US or Britain committed any resources to the Soviets. Were I to make a proper Soviet army then I'd need to be modifying a load of stuff from scratch because of this... Given though that the Germans have their own tracked APC projects in the works then I'm using that as a the basic for this Soviet one (my BTR-30 isn't intended as their first project, but the successor to multiple prototypes and takes it look from the German's - just with harsher slopes). However, I also have a wheeled 251 sitting there as well, so there's a possibility that an early BTR-40 to show up (but that didn't seem so practical to me as they didn't have great off road performance and with the war lasting longer the Soviets wouldn't be dealing with paved roads so much, but still be stuck out on sticks).

If I could be bothered I'd buy one of Rubicon's Soviet trucks and turn that into a cross between an M3 half track and a 251 (...I have a thing for sloped armour). ...Which as I type that may come about now.

Heh, anyway, I'm going off on one.

I think I'll go back to my Panther tonight. Looking at that turret it looks a bit snubbed at the back, I wonder if it'll look better if I extended it so it looked more Tiger II like...

[Wyrmalla]

Because unpainted pictures may be interesting, here's what's next on the painting table. Its only taken me a few months and tearing the thing apart a couple of times.



I did eventually go for the Tiger II tracks (partially after seeing the results of a bare Panther trying to go up hill and breaking its from bar).

Its still in need of a tidy and some greenstuff (rivets, maybe a few extra tarps, etc). I'm not sure if to go with a straight white paintjob. Maybe a late war (or post war) green camouflage beneath a partially worn off white wash?

Anything else which I should add? I think I've covered a lot of the proposed Panther upgrades wishlist there right?