"Conference Call" Wargaming

[armchairgeneral]

I find myself going to more and more meetings where many of the participants "dial in" and appear on a big screen. I just wondered about the wargaming possibilities of this? Either someone hosting a game or even both participants dialling in to game hosted by an umpire.

I know it is not as good as actually being there but if like me you are struggling for opponents it is worth considering. In addition if would be fun to be gaming against people from different parts of the country or the world if you can get the time differences to work.

Just wondered if anyone has tried this? It might even be a commercial opportunity for someone particularly if you are lucky enough to have your own gaming room/permanent table.

[Elbows]

I played several games of Blood on the Sands (gladiators) with a buddy via Skype.  We simply placed our webcams looking down on a matching hex grid we both had...and would roll our dice on the camera etc.  It was perfectly fine.  However that's almost a board game.  I don't think you could do it with a tabletop wargame.  But a role-playing game or a board game is very doable.

Haven't done a full-on conference call though.  There are also websites (like RollD20 -- I think) etc. which are set up for replicating a variety of games online in a chatroom style.

[manic _miner]

 I think the hard part would be for the person hosting the game to have the right miniatures for the game.Then you would need a way of showing how to move the miniatures around the table.It could be done but might take a few tries to get it right.Having a board done in a grid might help things.

[armchairgeneral]

Well I thought it would be quite realistic to just have a generals eye view.

[Cherno]

Being honest I think one would be better off playing computer based wargames/strategy games online rather than going to the reasonably large amount of effort traditional wargaming via cam online would involve.

I agree. Seems to be much more effective to just play a "real" computer game in multiplayer instead.

[FramFramson]

I agree. Seems to be much more effective to just play a "real" computer game in multiplayer instead.

I feel like this is especially true since the strategy genre was essentially a digital evolution of old tabletop model wargaming in the first place.

[traveller]

Being honest I think one would be better off playing computer based wargames/strategy games online rather than going to the reasonably large amount of effort traditional wargaming via cam online would involve.

Pike and Shot being one example of what is essentially a table top game on the computer

  

Looks interesting. It is a recommended game I assume? As good as the Total War series?

[fred]

I think there is plenty of opportunity for using things like Skype or FaceTime for wargaming. It will be different to a face to face game, but it opens up all sorts of other options outside your local gaming group.

Several years ago one of the guys on the BKC board frequently did web cam games. I can't remember if he played one side, or umpired them.

In some ways having two remote players with a local umpire would allow lots of fog of war.

[DS615]

My brother and I have played miniatures games using Skype and a webcam before.
Since I have the figures/terrain, it isn't much different for me.  He said it was fun, and we've done it a few times so I guess it must be.

We've also played "miniatures" games using Roll20.net which works well.  A lot of up front set-up (pictures, etc), but it plays well. 

[Elbows]

Looks interesting. It is a recommended game I assume? As good as the Total War series?

Not even in the same league as Total War (the good ones at least).  It's by Slytherine I believe.  They make supremely mediocre games which are really just board games with loads and loads of "stats" which they translate into game results (not unlike dice).

I've owned a few of their games and while very dry, they accomplish the goal.  Pike and Shotte is definitely one of the better ones, and has a wealth of replayability.  But it's nothing like the Total War games.

[FramFramson]

I do know that running RPG sessions with online friends has apparently become semi-popular to do in this way, but I think that works a little easier.

[Connectamabob]

I agree. Seems to be much more effective to just play a "real" computer game in multiplayer instead.

I'd agree too. Though if one wants to get a little ambitious, there's lots of things one can to to make the experience more like a tabletop game.

What I'd do is DL one of the free hobby/indie versions of a game engine dev kit (like Unity, or Unreal 4), and build a super-simple "game" that's basically just a terrain map with static-posed "minis" that can be moved around by click-dragging (or press-swiping, if on a tablet). No actual mechanics: just a virtual simulation of just the physical tabletop by itself. Then set it up as a private MO game with my PC as a server host.

That way all my buddies could just log into the "tabletop" remotely, allowing them to view the "tabletop", move pieces, etc.. Do that with Skype in the background, and you've got a virtual conference tabletop. Rules and dice rolls and such would be done the old fashioned way: less dev work, and lets the "tabletop" be used for any kind of game or rule system just by swapping the map and mini assets.

Only problem with this approach would be you'd need at least one person in your group who's software savvy (and willing) enough to do the work. None of it is any more work than you'd go through to build a table, build physical terrain out of foam or whatnot, and build and paint physical minis, but that doesn't matter when you're comparing an unfamiliar skillset to a familiar one.

[Major_Gilbear]

You might consider checking out Vassal as well.

Absolutely tons of games listed under the "Modules" tab, and is essentially exactly what you're asking about.

[Connectamabob]

You might consider checking out Vassal as well.

Absolutely tons of games listed under the "Modules" tab, and is essentially exactly what you're asking about.

It is on a conceptual level nearly exactly what I was thinking of. Three major differences/issues:

1) Very, VERY dry 2D map representation. Who actually wants to play a tabletop game on a metro guide map using post-it notes for minis? There's a reason people build physical terrain and paint minis (even gamers who don't enjoy doing those things typically still prefer playing with those things). I was thinking of a 3D virtual tabletop players could pan and zoom around. More Total War or XCOM, less Stratego.

2) I wasn't thinking of programming modules for game mechanics. That lends itself well to aggressively crunchy rule systems, but is stifling for games that rely on creative flexibility (stuff like CoC or Frostgrave, for example).

3) Java. Ew, no. I'll not have that exploit factory on my home desktop.

This is much closer to what I was imaging, though still too 2D-limited. I'd at least want options to use height-mapped terrain and user-imported 3d brush assets, and ideally 3D "minis" as well.

[Major_Gilbear]

@ Connectamabob:

Well, the representation tends to be a bit "dry" as you say because it's easy to make the graphics that way, and the icon representations of units and such are nice and clear. However, there is no reason you couldn't use photos of painted models or terrain as the basis of the representation instead.

As for the games like Frostgrave, they work perfectly well - players still need to have a rulebook/know the rules, still have to build a warband, and still have to roll dice. It's one of things with Vassal though - it works best when two players trust each other to be honest and fair with things like rolling dice. I think there is a dice-rolling feature, but most people I know prefer to use either real dice and just tell each other the results rolled, or have a Skype window set up so that you can communicate more easily when playing.

All this does go to provide a decent simulation of a wargame experience for players who may not be able to meet up in person, but is obviously not as nice as having a "real" table and models to enjoy as you play.

I won't get into the merits of what's a more "fun" or "better" wargame experience though, as that is skirting a sensitive issue that didn't end especially well last time it was discussed on LAF. Suffice to say that we all enjoy different things, and that software like Vassal is useful tool for those who really want to play a game with somebody but can't be there physically.