Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => VSF Adventures => Topic started by: Christian on October 12, 2010, 12:20:28 PM
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Just saw this on another forum. Basically a 1/1200th wargame set in 1870 with vehicles like this:
(http://i638.photobucket.com/albums/uu103/phoenixforge/Random/DW04.jpg)
The full topic is below, and it is the only reference I can find on the net at the moment!
http://www.wargamerau.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=104531&st=0&gopid=1456142&#entry1456142
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Well I like that model!
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Looks interesting. The Land Ironclad with what looks like the dome of St. Pauls on top of it is nice. Its all abit 'punky'er than the Verne and Wells that I tend towards. Spartian Games always makes nice things though.
I'll be watching this.
Marx
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I'm finding the command HQ a bit 'Capitol Imperialis' over the top; not sure I can get behind it even with the cupola replaced. Now, the ships look like something I might wrangle as LI's, even more than as seagoing.
After the whole Catalyst disappointment, I'm heavy in to the wait-and-see.
As for exactly which niche it is, I've already admitted to mixing and matching as I please. They can dress it up as 'punk as they like; it'll be what we decide we make it. ;)
Doug
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I dunno, I really like the St Paul's style dome. It'd look silly on a small vehicle but that tank is supposed to be a vast behemoth of a thing, I can get behind that :)
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All a little too steampunk for me, but I'll keep my eye on it. The ships look the most promising.
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WAY too "punk" for my tastes. I don't hang with the "take an Iowa class battleship and add rivits and it's Victorian" crowd. And the flight deck on top of the dig is just stupid.
I prefer my VSF to be V first, SF second.
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I prefer my VSF to be V first, SF second.
Very well put!
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I think it looks very interesting but I would hardly call it VSF...
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I went into a right froth at first but have calmed down now. I like the dirigible thingy above but at nearly 6" long should be more interesting and is too big for me. The ships look like GW Man O War after a quick glance and are not for me either.
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Well, it is Sci Fi, and set in the Victorian era.
Where else would you put this game? o_o
It's not quite VSF, I know... even the the way its marketed is a bit too mainstream for me.
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See, this is a great example for those people who don't get the distinction between Steampunk and VSF. This game is without doubt Steampunk, technically it's also VSF as it's set within the Victorian period, however it's not going to apeal to most of the VSF types around here due to the heavy steampunk aspect. Personally I like it and may well give it a go, however it's unlikely to influence my VSF games in any way and would remain a totally seperate game.
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For those wanting a little more V and little less SF, you might take a look at some of Spartan's other offerings in their Uncharted Seas line. The Ralgard War Balloon looks quite suitable for a Verne-style airship.
All 1/600 scale
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Very Steampunk unfortunately, which is a real shame, the ironclads and pre-dreadnoughts of the Victorian era were interesting enough without being turned into floating versions of the Crystal Palace. Still it'll be nice to see the actual models, there may well be some conversion potential.
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Hey Beast,
"After the whole Catalyst disappointment, I'm heavy in to the wait-and-see."
What is this "Catalyst disappointment" you speak of?
I assume you are speaking of Leviathans. I have been looking forward to that release, what problem do you have with that. The 3D model they showed looked great!
Cheers
Fuzzy.
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See, this is a great example for those people who don't get the distinction between Steampunk and VSF. This game is without doubt Steampunk, technically it's also VSF as it's set within the Victorian period, however it's not going to apeal to most of the VSF types around here due to the heavy steampunk aspect. Personally I like it and may well give it a go, however it's unlikely to influence my VSF games in any way and would remain a totally seperate game.
I agree, I think a main distinction between the two is that Steampunk tends to largely operate on the "rule of cool" whereas VSF is instead rooted in the actual SF of the age.
That being said, a steampunk game going on the rule of cool does grab my attention for sure!
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Those look wonderful to me.
I'm much more of a Steam/Tech Fantasy guy, I have no interest at all in the Victorian era. I love the mixed up/weird technology, but prefer it being free to roam into any area rather than being stuck with empire building and the often over the top focus on victorian elegance and the upper classes rather than the regular people of the era.
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Hey Beast,
"After the whole Catalyst disappointment, I'm heavy in to the wait-and-see."
What is this "Catalyst disappointment" you speak of?
I assume you are speaking of Leviathans. I have been looking forward to that release, what problem do you have with that. The 3D model they showed looked great!
Cheers
Fuzzy.
I just went to RPGNOW, and see there are a number of alpha test downloads. It'd been so long since I heard anything new I thought it'd dropped off the map.
It's been a LONG development process, with the fairly developed demos I saw GenCon before last, and a splash-and-go,dogger-repeat cycle makes keeping enthusiasm going difficult.
I'm just a narrow minded jade... :D
Mind you, I was excited when I heard first blurbs about the reissue of Lensmen... lol
Back on topic, I enjoy the V in VSF, though less the buffoonery we sometime see, and slick 'modern' sensibilities can ruin the veneer, but that won't stop me from throwing in vampires, dwarves(sic), towering behemoths, global conspiracies, etc., on occasion. The bounds of your terminology do not apply to me.
Will you call me the Moriarty of Gaming?
Wait, where the heck did that come from?
Doug
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There are several trial games of Leviathans to download and play. Some of the mechanics look good. The 3D models look awesome!
Downsides are that the game is really Edwardian rather than VSF which doesn't bother me too much. The game is also hex based which is a pain but no doubt someone will come up with a mod to enable tabletop play. I think the miniatures may be sold pre painted which I don't like.
Cheers
Fuzzy.
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There are several trial games of Leviathans to download and play. Some of the mechanics look good. The 3D models look awesome!
The basic, quickstart, short demo rules are in the Lieutenant's manual, right? That costs $3US, but there are a number of pieces, alpha test, thank you, which are free if you are registered, also free, with RPGNOW.
Downsides are that the game is really Edwardian rather than VSF which doesn't bother me too much. The game is also hex based which is a pain but no doubt someone will come up with a mod to enable tabletop play. I think the miniatures may be sold pre painted which I don't like.
As with Dystopian, the models look a bit advanced, but close enough to cut some slack. Again, if I'm moving the ships, and say they are advanced tech Victorian, well, they are. ;->=
If I'm involved with a mod, I'd probably just try to map to Full Thrust and it's fan-derived variations. I tend not to like the hex-to-template translations I've seen of other things.
RE: The Dig
I waffle about it being too silly to even consider, though I try not to look at it for TOO long. Maybe if it had some rotors to the side...
However, the craft on deck are RIGHT OUT!
Doug
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I like it, regardless of the gnnnghhh *it's not VSF - It's steampunk* argument.
Looks VERY promising, and I like things steampunk, but I also *yes, ALSO* like things VSF. :)
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This might get me into VSF. I like the idea of combining land, air & sea battles.
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This might get me into VSF. I like the idea of combining land, air & sea battles.
Land Ironclads does this, if you use Aeronef wih it. And, as already said, this isn't really VSF...
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VSF,Steampunk,Victorian,Edwardian.... :'( I thought you guys were more relaxed than the Nappy crowd lol
Isn't VSF "Do whatever you want"?
I just don't like the scale :)
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VSF,Steampunk,Victorian,Edwardian.... :'( I thought you guys were more relaxed than the Nappy crowd lol
Isn't VSF "Do whatever you want"?
I just don't like the scale :)
We are war gamers. ::) More than the Nappy :o crowd? Sure, :) doesn't take much to more relaxed then Napoleonic/Lace War though. ;)
Nice models anyway. 8)
Gracias,
Glenn
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VSF,Steampunk,Victorian,Edwardian.... :'( I thought you guys were more relaxed than the Nappy crowd lol
Isn't VSF "Do whatever you want"?
Well, no, otherwise it would be called 'Do whatever you want' rather than Victorian Science Fiction. For me, VSF is not Science Fiction in the Victorian era, but rather the Science Fiction of the Victorian era. See the difference?
Warmachine is Steampunk, Land Ironclads is VSF. This is somewhere in between.
Edit; Sorry, this is more violent than I intended. It seems we can be just as bad (good?) as the Napoleonic gamers...
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For me, VSF is not Science Fiction in the Victorian era, but rather the Science Fiction of the Victorian era. See the difference?
That would require one to be literate in the SF of the V though.
Gracias,
Glenn
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That would require one to be literate in the SF of the V though.
Gracias,
Glenn
Its not a bad thing to do.
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That would require one to be literate in the SF of the V though.
Gracias,
Glenn
To build an army for any historical period, one needs to have a working knowledge of that period. Why should VSF be any different? Would you start a new period without doing any research at all?
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Hey I play both Napoleonics and SYW so no real offense intended(hence the laughy face).My Victorian is fantasy not sci fi but I think it close enough related for me to ask questions/post on the VSF boards.
It just seems rather strange to see people arguing about Steampunk/VSF.Kinda like having a debate on the eating habits of woodelves lol
There are a lot of grey areas with VSF to me.Some carry it into the WW1 era,cool by me.
Same with Weird WW2.Some go anywhere from Pre war to the fiftties.It also gets mixed up with the Pulp genre too.
Anyway a little debate is healthy .
VSF is not a historical period,hence the F is for fiction ;)
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Its not a bad thing to do.
Hear, hear!
I think the problem with the whole "VSF vs Steampunk" discussion is that there is a LOT of grey area and bleed-over between (and within) the two.
To me VSF is distinctively British, somewhat whimsical, and rooted in the mood and style of Victorian fantastical fiction. If the answer to the question "Could Verne have written about it?" is Yes, it's probably VSF. VSF is about atmosphere and style/elegance.
Steampunk is to me: Pulp/modern tech/ sci-fi "but powered by steam". Though these days it seems to have been diluted to "whatever with goggles and cogs tossed on". Steampunk is about big and brassy and "rule of cool".
Warmachine is weird... Many steampunks, as well as the game's creators, don't classify it as steampunk. It's basically fantasy "but powered by steam".
Oh yes, Distopian Wars... To put up a facade of relevance: Hmmm, the game's style strikes me as a bit of "Warhammer 1870".... Especially the character art and the tendency to turn military machines into monumental architecture. A bit too "grimdark" and ubergothic for my palate.
I could use the ships as Dwarves in Man O'War, by the looks of them.
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Theres only the St pauls cathedral miniature which has gothic overtures, but it is a mobile command, so needs to be impressive!!!....and the only conection the art has with warhammer is its produced by an ex-GW artist ;) but all the same its shaping up to be a jolly good game.
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I think the problem with the whole "VSF vs Steampunk" discussion is that there is a LOT of grey area and bleed-over between (and within) the two.
To me VSF is distinctively British, somewhat whimsical, and rooted in the mood and style of Victorian fantastical fiction. If the answer to the question "Could Verne have written about it?" is Yes, it's probably VSF. VSF is about atmosphere and style/elegance.
Well, there were plenty of Empires (and plenty of players with armies) in the era besides British. :o I chose to work on 8) Spain (duh, ya' think? lol ) but America, France, Germany, Belgium, and Portugal come immediately to mind. Edit: Left out Japan!
Otherwise I think this is a great description of VSF and this game just seems (with just the information I read) to be a shade beyond the pale to be VSF.
Gracias,
Glenn
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VSF is distinctively British? I fancy Monsieur Jules Verne might have a thing or two to say about that. :)
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Hehe, touché. ;)
How about instead of "British" you read "refined and colonial/imperial in mindset" then? (Note that I'm in no way saying the British had a monopoly on being refined and colonial, mind you, nor that ALL British of the era were such... Just trying broaden the range as it were.)
It's an easy trap to fall into though, what with the era being called the "Victorian Era".... Not the Leopoldian era, or the Christianic, or Umbertan, or Victor Emmanuellian, or Battenbergian or Taisho or..... era. :D
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I can't believe the amount of griping over the fact that the models don't fit in with people's preconceived notions of what the genre should be. I have no experience at all with VSF, which probably gives me some objectivity, and I think these models look imaginative, professionally and thoughtfully designed, and that the whole concept looks like a lot of fun.
This is the first thing I have ever seen for the genre that could get me to spend my money, and that's got to be a success for Spartan on some level (despite the grumblings from the VSF grognards.)
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I have to say I am going to buy some models for this, probably two starter sets if they are going to be like the other beginner fleets they do.
If you look at the pictures on the site (there are some more now) I have to say this is far more gothic-pulp level then VSF and I DON'T CARE it looks awesome, that's all I need! lol
Also the fact that is looks like it will provide combined lank air and naval action on such a scale with this over the top model, hell yes.
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....the grumblings from the VSF grognards.
I must say it has given me a bit of a laugh to see the VSFers, who so often love to look down on the uptight button-county tendencies of historical wargamers, behaving like... well, historical wargamers. We're not so different after all, are we? ;)
I think it looks quite cool, too. I'd play it if someone brought it to gaming night, but I probably wouldn't start collecting it myself.
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I've only just come across this new game system and miniatures - first saw it over on TMP earlier today!
I'm interested in how it progresses, what figures and vehicles are launches. In addition my first impression of the initial planned releases is that they are very well built and detailed and have a 'unique' character - in that they are not obviously Space 1889 or Aeronef or Leviathans! Which I think is a good thing.
With past releases fro Spartan Games there have been a huge and wide range of support figures and vehicles, so I would expect the same with this. Let's see what the future (on in this case the past) holds!
Tony
http://dampfpanzerwagon.blogspot.com/
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Well, as I said, I like them. They won't be going into my VSF games but I'd happily play and if there is interest around here I'll probably buy some.
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I think the Zep-carrier thingy would look quite at home in a "Crimson Skies" type pulp affair.
Looking at the other models, they look "interesting" but I honestly don't see a VSF feel to them.......
That's from someone who builds steam Titans!!!!! :D
I think it was stated earlier, it has a Warhammer/Gothic feel to it and wouldn't look out of place on a back-water Imperial planet etc.
I think I would be more inclined to see how it plays rather than worry too much about the fluff.
PM
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Are there any pictures of actual models? These are but 3d renders... and we all now how things can change from one media to the other......
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Are there any pictures of actual models? These are but 3d renders... and we all now how things can change from one media to the other......
Take a look at the other models on their site, Spartan Games does deliver very good casts of 3d renders.
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I must say it has given me a bit of a laugh to see the VSFers, who so often love to look down on the uptight button-county tendencies of historical wargamers, behaving like... well, historical wargamers. We're not so different after all, are we? ;)
Ah but no one has said you can't use them. Most have just said that they wouldn't, it's an important distinction :D
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Take a look at the other models on their site, Spartan Games does deliver very good casts of 3d renders.
I've got their Ralgard fleet which I intend to use as Chinese for VSF, and they're great casts indeed. But this seems to be half the scale (meaning 1/8th the size [1/2*1/2*1/2 in 3d]) and the detail seems to be even greater!
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Indeed, this way we can really field masses of ridiculous leviathans!
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That Land Ship looks very nice indeed. A Cathedral on tracks loaded with smoke stacks and cannons. Very cool.
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For those of you who would like to see more, I've just noticed that there are more pictures over on Miniature Review (http://miniaturereview.blogspot.com/), or alternatively at Spartan Games (http://spartangames.co.uk/dystopian_wars.html) by clicking on the flags.
Haarken
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Looks to be heavily influenced by the Philip Reeve Mortal Engines books to me...
Mike
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That was my first thought too Mike, I suppose the St Pauls dome was what got me thinking that.
I expect I will buy into it , the news of its release has got me looking at my aeronef stuff again.
I happily mix 'normal' VSF with victorian elements of steampunk..
Mors
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Isn't it strange, but the ships and land vehicles, and even largest aerocraft, merely seem vaguely wrong to me, but the flyers still seem RIGHT OUT.
To those decrying the product as Steampunk, obviously I haven't the proper perspective to fully understand your pain.
By the way, that part is probably an excellent discussion to be continued elsewhere. May I suggest 'General > Announcements and Forum Stuff > About Forum'? If there's interest, I'll start a thread there, as this seems to cut across several other forums.
Doug
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OK, I like the Sidewheel Aerocaft Carrier. I might get one of those.
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Edit: Left out Japan!
And Egypt too! >:(
;)
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Yeah a lot of what i'd call normal VSF fleets seem to be missing, like most of Europe and normally the US plays a very small aprt in the grand scheme of things..
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Spartan has e tendency of including a few fleets after release of the initial four, they have done this for both their previous games. So they might just do that for these.
Somebody told me this is so they make sure the game mechanics work the way they think and what doesn't before they introduce the fleets with the more exotic effects, not sure if this is true for the released fleets in the other games, tough.
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Pics of the Japanese Battlewagon and Brit Carrier are now up at my blog here:
http://pauljamesog.blogspot.com/2010/10/dystopian-wars-mini-preview.html
courtesy of Mark from "Conflict in Colour"
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If as mentioned on the previous page in this thread the scale is smaller than their other current games(which seems logical if you are to include land,sea and air in the same game)then I have high hopes for this game,genre or whatever other title suits best.
Sounds like it could have GW's Epic Armageddon tendencies although no mention so far of infantry stands or the like.I don't mean to draw direct similarities to this game but merely highlight the potential of the 3 force game...it does of course pose the problem of the game table and it's make up...ie do you have to have a mixed land and sea board?Perhaps it will provide guidance and rules for separate battles which have a direct effect on future ones?
I do love the idea of sea battles leading to land invasions and they have already released coastal fortifications which are particularly beautiful.Throw in the cities and airports(need a better victorian word for this really!) and it could be an amazing game overall.
I have played a few games of Uncharted Seas and have laughed heartily whilst playing..it's a fun set of rules which I think can be played just for laughs or taken a little more seriously depending on your mood...Dystopian wars looks like it might be more involved but that suits me fine.
I'm sure the sculpts will be marvellous so loads to look forward to in my book.
I would say that having a US side might well be a means to please our Stateside friends somewhat but it is a business so sounds like a sound plan...plus they had some pretty good dreadnoughts so it does make sense in many ways
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Pics of the Japanese Battlewagon and Brit Carrier are now up at my blog here:
http://pauljamesog.blogspot.com/2010/10/dystopian-wars-mini-preview.html
courtesy of Mark from "Conflict in Colour"
Thanks for the preview, it gives a good idea how the 3d art relates to actual models!
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Not a huge fan of the British fleet's aesthetics, however I love the idea of a huge airstrip positioned over two ships!
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I think the miniatures are absolutely fantastic, the quality looks incredibly high but I'm still not a fan of the design aesthetic unfortunately. Still there may be a few miniatures amongst the line that'll make it into my collection.
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I think the miniatures are absolutely fantastic, the quality looks incredibly high but I'm still not a fan of the design aesthetic unfortunately. Still there may be a few miniatures amongst the line that'll make it into my collection.
I think Im in the same camp here really. Too gothic.
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I really like these, my girlfriend and I are both quite into steampunk, so these sort of go well with that.
I wouldn't call them VSF, but it doesn't mean I won't get them.
More painted pics online now!
http://pauljamesog.blogspot.com/2010/11/dystopian-wars-more-previews.html (http://pauljamesog.blogspot.com/2010/11/dystopian-wars-more-previews.html)
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Glorious paintjobs...utterly marvellous...I will buy and enjoy in extremis
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The Japanese aircraft carrier is rather cool!
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The Japanese aircraft carrier is rather cool!
Well, as I said early on:
RE: The Dig
I waffle about it being too silly to even consider, though I try not to look at it for TOO long. Maybe if it had some rotors to the side...
However, the craft on deck are RIGHT OUT!
Obviously THAT is what I was talking about, but the rotors are even cooler than I imagined for the dig. ;->=
Still not liking the small flyers...
Doug
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As somebody mentioned, the fliers look quite crimson skies style. I like CS but it still looks a bit out of place.
truth be told tough I feel I will have no problem running with the madness of this game, the extreme scale of it all has its charm to me for sure!
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Hmm. For the first time I think I'm getting interested in this range.
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Have you seen this:
http://www.spartangames.co.uk/dystopian_wars_previews_french_battleship.html
Looks very Leviathanish...
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Oooh, I'm liking the look of that french ship for sure.
I really do like the sort of mixed style of everything, as others have said it's not really VSF...but it's not really "steampunk" either, and I really like the gothic/industrial edge to it all.
Perhaps weird/alternate WW1 with the war starting slightly earlier and being a more every nation for himself conflict.
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Have you seen this:
http://www.spartangames.co.uk/dystopian_wars_previews_french_battleship.html
Looks very Leviathanish...
Okay, even more than most of the big fliers, I imagine it delivering that broadside, and promptly rolling several times as in the old Popeye cartoons. ;->=
That said, it is a lovely thing; I still want to put tracked gear on it, though, and run it amongst LI's.
Doug
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I, for one, am absolutely psyched about this. I love the smaller scale models and the large scale engagements. Spartan's support of their games is very nice and the models look wonderful.
There - I'm a fanboy now. Hope I'm not disappointed!
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(http://www.spartangames.co.uk/images/dystopianwars/blazing_sun_medium_tanks.jpg)
... Orks FTW?
lol
Looks interesting but I struggle to find fellow gamers for Epic/MoW/BFG.
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You know I feel we really need some more recognizable things for this game, not sure if infantry is going to work, but something we the size of to show how huge the rest is.
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Well those tanks are pretty recognisable...to be honest everything has been fairly obviously some kind of ship till these tanks came out, now okay it can be hard to tell if they are sea ships or airships but it's still a ship.
Looks interesting but I struggle to find fellow gamers for Epic/MoW/BFG.
Never know there might be rules for small battles between scout armies could get yourself 2 wee armies if you like the look of two different forces and force someone else to play.
;)