Tactica Medieval Rules what do you think?

[Mad Guru]

Oh, man, I played NOTHING BUT Tactica Medieval for years, mostly HYW games with some Italian Codottiere City State Wars, Wars of the Roses, and Swiss Burgundian Wars thrown in for good measure.

Agincourt was a great scenario, and the rules -- which as others have already mentioned are more strict and less versatile than many other sets in terms of troop type usage and maneuvre -- worked very well.  It was years ago, and unfortunately the website we created to keep our photos and battle reports on was infected by malware and spambots, and the gamer friend who had created it finally shut it down, so no access to the pics or write-up -- but we also may have added more "Command Cards" as I recall each of several players per side having one for their personal leader figure.  I still have some nicely designed Heraldic unit ID cards for each unit of English and French, which were a bit of a big deal at the time, being printed by me at home in full color on glossy photo paper (this was maybe around 2006 or so).

Anyway, I would join those recommending the rules in general and as a good choice for Agincourt in particular.  I will do as Allen has done and try searching for our old scenario notes and army lists, which may also have expanded from the ones in the rulebook.

[Captain Gideon]

I do find it funny that in the Agincourt Scenario the overall numbers are exactly identical at 216 each.

Now I find that somewhat strange where the French had a large numerical advantage like maybe 5 to 1 or 6 to 1.

What I need to know(if possible)is how large was the French force?

I've said that I have  at least 2 sources one being the Osprey Campaign Series Agincourt.

Now in that book the Forces are the following:

FRENCH
Mounted Men at Arms-8,400(2,400 were in the first line/battle)
Dismounted Men at Arms-14,000
Crossbowmen/Archers-2,000

Total-24,200

ENGLISH
8,000-9,000(at least 5,000 were Archers)

Yet there are other sources which puts the French numbers even higher maybe 30,000 or more.

And then we have newer sources which puts the French at around 12,000 or more with only 1,200 Mounted Men at Arms  and the English with around 9,000.

So the big question is what numbers should I go with?

What I want is a game where it looks good on the table and people will say now that looks pretty good for Agincourt.

For me this is the main concern for the game.

One idea is that I have around 20,000 to 25,000 French and 6,000 to 7,000 for the English so if I go with these numbers then how many of the French will be Mounted?

Also I'm still in the early stages of doing this game so I have plenty of time.

Thanks
Michael

[Antonio J Carrasco]

I do find it funny that in the Agincourt Scenario the overall numbers are exactly identical at 216 each.

Now I find that somewhat strange where the French had a large numerical advantage like maybe 5 to 1 or 6 to 1.

Actually, latest research puts the French advantage at lower ratios: 2 to 1, even a scarce 1.5 to 1. Not everybody agrees, though, but a re-interpretation of the available evidence has suggested that there were a lot less French present at the battle than previously thought.

[Charlie_]

For gaming, I'd go for whatever numbers you feel is right!

Go for 2:1 if you want, or less of a French numerical superiority if you prefer the look / feel / gameability of that. Or more... though I'd argue 5:1 or such seems a bit over the top.

I guess your own research has shown you that there are all sorts of theories so no one 'right answer' right now, so I wouldn't sweat it. Though it does seem that thinking today is that the French didn't have such a massive advantage in numbers as once thought.

However.... It's worth considering that there were large numbers of French who never got to fight. If it was something like 3:1 or 5:1, I'm sure maybe as much as half the French army didn't do anything and played no role in the battle (and so perhaps aren't needed in your game).

What I want is a game where it looks good on the table and people will say now that looks pretty good for Agincourt.

For me this is the main concern for the game.

Then don't worry too much about the numbers! As long as the French look like they outnumber the English, that will meet your criteria.

[Captain Gideon]

Charlie after talking to a few of my friends it looks like I've decided to use a 3-1 advantage for the French at Agincourt so 25,000 French against 7,000 English.

So if I choose to use the Medieval Tactica rules which the figure scale is 1 figure equals 80 real soldiers then the French will have 312 figures against the English 87 figures which is slightly more than 3-1.

As for the mounted portion of the French I've settled with 4,400 or 55 figures.

So this means that I have all the English that I'll need for the game but I'll still need to get some more French since I'm short some Mounted Knights and some Foot troops like dismounted Knights/Men at Arms etc.

This might do the Battle justice on the tabletop but that's what playtests are for.

Michael