Ratio of Grenadiers in Russian Infantry Battalions during The Crimean War?

[Atheling]

Just a quick question if I may directed at the wise?

I'm trying to reorganise my bare lead Great War Miniatures Russian Battalions, which I'm hoping to do as 40 man units but with it being a long time since I bought the miniatures and I'm waiting on delivery of several books I was hoping someone could answer the question for me so I can make an early start.

So, what was the ratio of Grenadiers in Russian Infantry battalions during The Crimean War?

Or, were the Grenadiers separated and fielded in their own battalions?

[AlyMorrison]

Hi Darrell…

Russian Battalions had four companies…
For infantry battalions it’s three Musketeer and one Grenadier.
For Jäger battalions the equivalent is three Jäger and one Carabiner.

There was also a Grenadier Corps comprising of three divisions, each of two brigades, of two regiments each…

I can recommend Laurence Springs…  ‘Uniforms of the Russian Army During the Crimean War 1854-1856’… which I have found very informative.

All the best.  Aly

[Atheling]

Hi Darrell…

Russian Battalions had four companies…
For infantry battalions it’s three Musketeer and one Grenadier.
For Jäger battalions the equivalent is three Jäger and one Carabiner.

There was also a Grenadier Corps comprising of three divisions, each of two brigades, of two regiments each…

Thanks Ali. That very clear and works out really well as I'm going to be doing 40 miniature units.

I take it that the Grenadier battalion would have been to the fore of the Line units? Leading the way so's to speak. Or did this matter? Was there, in general any qualitative difference in fighting prowess between the Grenadier Battalions and the Line Battalions?

I can recommend Laurence Springs…  ‘Uniforms of the Russian Army During the Crimean War 1854-1856’… which I have found very informative.

I have a coy of the Laurence Springs book on it's way to me. At the mo' I'm just trying ton get ahead of things a little in organising all the unpainted mini's into batches.

Have a good Partizan if you're going to be there 

[AlyMorrison]

Hi Darrell…
I think the grenadiers were positioned differently depending on the formation of the battalion…
Possibly to the right of the standard when in line and I think to the rear…as a reserve I presume… when in column.
As I have four stands to my Russian battalions I can have one of these as my grenadiers…

The grenadier battalions were probably better than line battalions… although like the guards they never saw action in the Crimean… they did however fight in the Balkans…

The guards were held in reserve… probably around St Petersburg…. I’m not sure how good they would have been… they probably thought that they were good though.

All the best.  Aly

[Atheling]

Hi Darrell…
I think the grenadiers were positioned differently depending on the formation of the battalion…
Possibly to the right of the standard when in line and I think to the rear…as a reserve I presume… when in column.
As I have four stands to my Russian battalions I can have one of these as my grenadiers…

Thanks Ali. The literature has arrived so all I need to do is find the time to dig in. The Laurence Springs book on the Russian army arrived too.

The grenadier battalions were probably better than line battalions… although like the guards they never saw action in the Crimean… they did however fight in the Balkans…

So effectively held back? I'm going to be going with either 48 or 40 man Russian battalions so three Musketeer and one Grenadier, so 12 or 10 per company respectively. A lot depends on the "feel" and "look" on the battalions when they are near completion.

The guards were held in reserve… probably around St Petersburg…. I’m not sure how good they would have been… they probably thought that they were good though.

Very interesting, I was corresponding with Barry Hilton about the Crimea and he said something about the British Guards having a similar attitude in terms of elan but maybe not in fighting ability (though still better than most line regiments). I suppose it makes sense as most British regiments would not have been involved in a major war since the Napoleonic Wars! Not so with the Russians so I do wonder if their elites have been underplayed in the literature(?). I suppose I'll be finding out soon with all the books I ordered! 

[carlos marighela]

Leaving aside fighting insurgents in the Caucasus, the only major and vaguely conventional war the Russians had fought since the Napoleonic Wars was the Polish Insurrection.

Large sections of the British Army had been engaged in various small and sometimes quite large wars across the globe, including conventionally drilled and organised armies. The Guards were the exception, seeing no active combat in the period until the Crimea.

[Atheling]

Leaving aside fighting insurgents in the Caucasus, the only major and vaguely conventional war the Russians had fought since the Napoleonic Wars was the Polish Insurrection.

I'm no expert and I'm learning as I go along but  thought the Polish Insurrection was 1863–64 

Large sections of the British Army had been engaged in various small and sometimes quite large wars across the globe, including conventionally drilled and organised armies. The Guards were the exception, seeing no active combat in the period until the Crimea.

I did say major wars as opposed to "Little Wars".

I suppose it makes sense as most British regiments would not have been involved in a major war since the Napoleonic Wars!

[armchairgeneral]

Hi Darrell,

You might want to consider 36 figure battalions for your Russians. 4 companies of 8 figures if you are basing in fours? That’s how I did my Napoleonic Russians.

I have often mused about this period. British guards in bearskins, Russians in pickelhaubes. Such great ranges from Great War Miniatures and Foundry. Looking forward to seeing your pictures 

[carlos marighela]

I'm no expert and I'm learning as I go along but  thought the Polish Insurrection was 1863–64 

I did say major wars as opposed to "Little Wars".

You’re probably thinking of the January Uprising. The Russo-Polish War took place in 1830. Oddly enough there’s a small, dedicated range for it.

In the decade prior to the Crimean War, substantial elements of the British Army fought the two Sikh Wars. The Sikh armies were organised, trained and equipped along European lines.

[Atheling]

Hi Darrell,

You might want to consider 36 figure battalions for your Russians. 4 companies of 8 figures if you are basing in fours? That’s how I did my Napoleonic Russians.

I have often mused about this period. British guards in bearskins, Russians in pickelhaubes. Such great ranges from Great War Miniatures and Foundry. Looking forward to seeing your pictures 

I'm not 100% set on a number yet mate. I still a a lot of reading to do.

The project should be fun to paint up but I'm not looking forward to painting up all those Russian Greatcoats!  I reckon the key there will be variation in hue/tone!

You’re probably thinking of the January Uprising. The Russo-Polish War took place in 1830. Oddly enough there’s a small, dedicated range for it.

In 28mm?

In the decade prior to the Crimean War, substantial elements of the British Army fought the two Sikh Wars. The Sikh armies were organised, trained and equipped along European lines.

Of course! You're spot on. I'm not quite sure where I left my memory today- I was just in contact with Stuart from Studio Miniatures last week discussing the Sikh Wars ranges they used to do that have now been sold on.

[carlos marighela]

Yep Steve Barber models do the Russo-Polish War of 1830 in 28mm.

I wonder who Studio Miniatures shifted the Sikh War range to? I know they were trying to interest loval manufacturers with their First Afghan War range.

[Atheling]

Yep Steve Barber models do the Russo-Polish War of 1830 in 28mm.

I wonder who Studio Miniatures shifted the Sikh War range to? I know they were trying to interest loval manufacturers with their First Afghan War range.

I'm not at all sure if I'm supposed to pass the information on so I'd better keep stum. I can say it is a good manufacturer with years of experience.

Sorry I can't be of more help.

Maybe if you drop Stuart at Studio miniatures a line?

[MiniPigs]

In early April, On their FB page, Studio Miniatures said they sold their 1st Afghan War and Sikh War ranges to Bicorne Miniatures. Bicorne doesn't seem to have relisted/released them yet.

[Atheling]

In early April, On their FB page, Studio Miniatures said they sold their 1st Afghan War and Sikh War ranges to Bicorne Miniatures. Bicorne doesn't seem to have relisted/released them yet.

Yeah, that's what Stuart told me. If it's been announced on the Studio Miniatures Facebook page I suppose I can say now 

[MiniPigs]

On April 5th from FB:

Studio Miniatures Update
Due to family and work commitments over the past two years I made the decision at the start of 2022 to scale back on the ranges that I produce at Studio Miniatures.
Rather than just shelving these ranges indefinitely , I have over the past month, sold them to other companies allowing them to continue to be available (after a small settling in phase) and I'm sure to be expanded upon at their new homes 😀
The following ranges are now with:
The Medieval Mayhem, Horror Characters and Vehicles ranges - Hayland Terrain
The 1st Afghan War, Sikh Wars and Dead Through Time ranges - Bicorne Miniatures
The Street Gangs range - Tangent Miniatures
The NWF British range - Templar Wargames
The Atlantis Imperium range - C P Models
We will continue to expand our Survivors and Zombie ranges with Paul Hicks working on new releases as we speak.
We would like to wish all the best to the new owners of the above ranges and I am sure you will all support them in their new homes. 🥰