Going to start Swiss at some point, question….

[Tim Haslam]

I’m going to use Perry plastics, mostly the Mercenaries box set, I can do most of the figures from that.
However I’d like a few armoured pikemen, I’m wonder if I can use the dismounted knights box set and add the pikes??
Has anybody done this?

Is it just easier to just buy the Perry metal Swiss figures with armour?

To be honest I am getting into these all plastic armies !

And yes, I have noticed the new 3D printed Swiss elsewhere on this forum!

[Atheling]

I’m going to use Perry plastics, mostly the Mercenaries box set, I can do most of the figures from that.
However I’d like a few armoured pikemen, I’m wonder if I can use the dismounted knights box set and add the pikes??
Has anybody done this?

Is it just easier to just buy the Perry metal Swiss figures with armour?

To be honest I am getting into these all plastic armies !

And yes, I have noticed the new 3D printed Swiss elsewhere on this forum!

It's all down to how much you are willing to sit and glue the things together mate.

If I were going to do a Swiss army, without any major conversions, I would probably use the Foundry range as it's the most appropriate for the time period in WAB V.2 AoA.2 which is almost certainly what you are aiming for(?).

[painterman]

hello Tim
There will be some metal figures designed as Swiss going into production in January (I hope) - if I'm able to show these - the disclaimer is that I own Steel Fist Miniatures.
They'll have separate heads, so mixable with perrys - open handed too.
thanks
Simon.

[Tim Haslam]

Lovely stuff Simon.
I can wait until January or even February if it’s a genuine time scale?

I was really just asking if anyone had used the Perry dismounted knights to make front rank pikemen?

[GulKelan]

hello Tim
There will be some metal figures designed as Swiss going into production in January (I hope) - if I'm able to show these - the disclaimer is that I own Steel Fist Miniatures.
They'll have separate heads, so mixable with perrys - open handed too.
thanks
Simon.

cant wait to get your swiss, love your sculpts!
i have your whole late medieval line and they are just superb! Please make more, i can never have enough late medieval minis

[SJWi]

Tim, I certainly don't class myself as an "expert" in this period but looking at the box set in question I think they are just
too well armoured for pikemen. I have several books on the period featuring re-enactors and they have one or two fully-armoured officers, but most have either no armour or just body armour and helmet.  I know however that re-enactors doesn't necessarily = historical accuracy. Reading the old Osprey MAA book "The Swiss at War" the author claims that despite some illustrations showing troops en masse in full armour,  actual records of campaigns reveal an absence of  armour. Personally I would use Perry metals and plastics plus some of the Steel Fist minis. I wish you well in your venture. I started a Swiss army but sold it on as I wasn't satisfied with the variety of figures available. Seems you might have more luck!   

[Tim Haslam]

Good point!
Thanks
 

[Charlie_]

I'd agree.... personally I don't think using the Foot Knights plastics would look quite right. Not just the ammount of armour, but the style of armour, which is in an English and western European style - if you do have fully armoured Swiss, they should surely have more of a German style of armour.

The Perry metals can be used, though my slight criticism of them is the poses of the 'armoured halberdiers advancing' pack - four of them are a bit odd, hunched over and leaning forward....



Fine by themselves, but when you put the 'armoured halberdiers attacking' in front of them it can look a little odd.



If you're familiar with Perry metals you might know sometimes their casting quality is a bit off, and this is definitely the case with these packs, in particular the hands and getting the weapons to sit in them properly.

If you haven't seen them before, Steel Fist do already have a pack of multi-part metal Swiss armoured front-rankers, which can be combined with Perry plastic parts very easily.

https://www.steelfistminiatures.com/product/lm10-swiss-front-rankers/


The new Swiss pikemen Simon posted up above are being eagerly awaited by me and many others! Looks like they will have both heavily armoured and lightly armoured types, but in rear rank posings. Do you want your front ranks to have their weapons lowered? If not, the new Steel Fist ones will have you covered.

It's true finding one range to cover EVERY type of Swiss pikeman wanted for a unit (armoured, half-armoured, unarmoured, in all poses, front ranker, mid-ranks, rear-ranks etc) still doesn't seem possible! Personally I would love it if the new Steel Fist pikemen were a great success, and were followed by front-rankers in the same style.

My own Swiss/German pike units are based on the Perry metals, with additions from Steel Fist, Foundry, and a few other cunning conversions.



(Note that despite what I said about the plastic foot knights, there is ONE of them in that unit, though with metal Steel Fist arms!)

I have plans for another similar unit for 2023 which will feature the new Steel Fist sculpts heavily.

One last tip - there is a very small but good range of late medieval figures recently re-released by Eureka (also available from Eureka UK). Among the 'billmen' in the range, there are a few that look perfectly suited for Swiss or Germans in half-armour. I've picked these four out for that exact purpose, to go with my new unit.



https://www.eurekamin.com.au/index.php?cPath=87_126_909&sort=3a

[Tim Haslam]

All good information, many thanks guys.
Looks like I’m waiting for the new Steel Fist stuff then!
I’d prefer all my figures to be ‘rear rank’ or perhaps mid rank pose.

You do get the odd armoured officer in the plastic mercenary pack anyhow.
Funnily enough I’ve just found a big bag of Foundry Swiss stuff in a drawer I’d forget I had!
Lol
Too many miniatures in my shed!
It’s like the Tardis.

[Charlie_]

Looks like I’m waiting for the new Steel Fist stuff then!
I’d prefer all my figures to be ‘rear rank’ or perhaps mid rank pose.

That sounds like the perfect plan then.

[Griefbringer]

I was really just asking if anyone had used the Perry dismounted knights to make front rank pikemen?

To answer this original question, Perrys certainly suggest this possibility as an option in the leaflet that comes with the dismounted knights box.

Since I had a few sprues of spare dismounted knights left over, as well as some of the pike arms (the ones with plate armour), I tried out that idea last spring by dry-fitting the pike arms to the bodies. However, the end result did not look satisfactory to me, so I did not go forth and actually try glueing the pike arms. However, I also had a few spare command sprues from the Mercenaries boxed set, and these have a fully armoured body that looks pretty nice with the pike arms - the only problem that he has a dagger on the hip that slightly gets on the way of the pike arm on some poses.

Another issue with the Perry mercenaries set is that a lot of the bodies are wearing cloth armour (jack or gambeson), that was very popular in western Europe, but does not appear much in Swiss illustrations of the era. Overall, I think they are better suited as Low Countries spearmen than Swiss.

If you already have a big pile of Foundry Swiss, then I would suggest this time leaving the Perry plastics (lovely as they are) on the shelf, and getting more metal Swiss foot from Foundry, Perry and Steel Fist. Though if you end up needing some Swiss cavalry, the Perry ligh cavalry set (1450-1500) could be worth checking out.