I need help getting off the ledge (switching from 15mm to 20mm for WW2 gaming)

[acctingman]

So, my scale of choice is 12/10mm because they aren't small enough for me to squint and I can put lots of stuff on the table an it doesn't look like a parking lot.

Prior to this I was using 15mm on a smaller table. I like the scale, but even on a 6x4 board tanks looked too close together for me. So, I thought I'll use my 15mm for smaller scale (platoon level games), but now 15mm seems a tad too small for that and they aren't that much bigger than 12/10mm.

I will not own 3 scales. I just do not want to be that guy 

Browsing the Battlegroup (current ruleset I'm into) FB page I started drooling over all these table setups with 20mm. In my opinion, 20mm would give a better smaller scale game than the 15's, at least I think so.

Someone, anyone, tell me I should stay away from 20mm and just stick to 15's!!!! 

[Inkpaduta]

Do what makes you happy. It is a hobby.
Who cares if you do an ear in three scales.
Just have fun.

[fred]

Terrain.

That is why you don't want to do this in 3 scales!

I agree 10mm is a great scale for WWII.

Battlegroup photos, much like Perry photos just make you want stuff!

I think 15mm is a pretty good choice for skirmish - its 1/100 scale which is the ground scale of a lot of rules. The figures are a fair bit bigger than 10mm so much easier to tell weapon types apart.

Beyond the storage and painting - there aren't any wrong answers to this!

[Panzer21]

At the risk of probably giving an unhelpful answer......

Many many years ago when I started wargaming I had WW2 in 20mm.....all since lost / given away.

So when restarting with the aim to do WW2 desert, I debated which scale to use. Micro was out - don get on with it.
At the time, 20mm plastic kits were expensive (before fast assembly) and resin/metal even more so. 10mm/12mm/1:200 were limited ranges. 15mm /1:100 was just beginning to expand with Battlefront pre-FOW.

So I went 15mm. Bought loads. Has sat there unpainted for years due to life.....
Then prices crept up and 20mm went down in price. Started collecting late war western front in 20mm..

Got into idea of operational games - 1 model = a battalion. 15mm was bought for 1model = platoon.
Went crazy, started duplicating Western Desert in 20mm but at third the number of models....

Now approaching retirement, have started to work at the lead mountain.
Despite casting envious eyes at Anschluss and Victrix 12mm (resist, must resist...) I have started tackling 20mm with visions of lovely models with AB crew......

What have I found going back to this scale?

Modelling v wargaming models

A lot of kit is unavailable in fast builds which means 3D print, specialist resin or metal or the dreaded kit.
New models are a joy, older means struggling with inaccuracies and rubber tracks!
To make them look really nice means modelling......serious modelling!
Some fast builds are awful. Really awful. CAD scaled up can result in some serious problems (PSC M3 Stuart I'm looking at you). Some are simply superb - S-Models.
Some modern kits come with Photo Etched brass parts and many, many small parts. Instructions can be "interesting" ; I now have the Bradford plans booklets open to work out where some bits go!
After all that work, they can be very fragile......

Scales

20mm isn't a scale, it's a size of figure. Nominally, you should be looking at 1/76 or 1/72. No-one it seems can agree what figures go with what scale and where to measure "20mm" to and from......
What does this mean? Unless you stick to one manufacturer, your figures can be anywhere from 18mm to 25mm, and have different proportions, mostly over sized heads. The vehicles are no better. 1/72 which should represent a vehicle in that scale, sometimes doesn't; it can be a 1/76 reboxed as 1/72 or a new tooling or huge and more like 1/70.

While 15mm has similar problems, the differences are less noticeable. However, the number of 15mm manufacturers has decreased, but 3D printing has more than filled the gap. Both however, are apt to disappear at short notice.....

So, it's your choice, but beware, 20mm has it's pitfalls.......

If you want to see more of my adventures, as well as an ill advised attempt to recreate the Israeli Defence Force of 1967 in 1/87 (less said the better), visit my blog where I discuss tackling various 20mm kits and plastic figures....

[sultanbev]

I collect 1/72 model tanks, mostly because I like to build kits, and put them on display. The proliferation of 3D resin prints means I can now get models of AFVs that will never appear as 1/72 plastic kits. Thus '20mm' is having the greatest moment of its existence in terms of choice.

At the same time I wargame WW2 in 10mm, using mostly Pendraken figures and 3d printed vehicles and guns. With aircraft in 1/144 scale. I did have WW2 in 15mm but I swapped them all for 10mm (500 vehicles given in 15mm in return for 750x 10mm ones, think it was a good deal)

I still have a lot of 6mm Cold War stuff, but now want to replace it with 10mm, but don't think I'm going to live long enough to do that as well!

But yes, terrain! I plan to convert all my wargaming to 10mm (there's the 15mm Napoleonics to go) just so I can use N guage model rail terrain to enhance the wargaming industry's 10mm terrain.

And then our gaming group got into 28mm plastics for 19th century gaming, and I took a diversion...

[Gunbird]

Tricky question. I switched from 20mm to 15mm cause there are much more 15mm players locally, and with a lot of people giving upw with the release of FoW....4 I think, many folks sold their armies, so a lot cheaper. But after moving I realised that this works fine for WW2,  I simply do not have the space for a table for 15mm Moderns (and avoid the parking lot syndrome). So they are gathering dust right now and are basically put into my Skirmish corner. Even ordered some 3mm testers that should arrive soon just for trying out if that works for me.

I'd focus more on who plays what in your area. 20mm is all nice and dandy, but if no one place you are stuck making multiple forces. Burn out lies in that area. But the same goes for other scales. If you already have a lot of scenery for 15mm, I'd stick to that.

And yeah, the Battlegroup FB has tons of lovely eye candy....but nothing stopping you from doing the same in 15mm.....

[frank xerox]

Im going to agree with you!
I went 20 mill because I fancied the original IABSM rules & thought a couple of packs of cheap plastics would let me try them before deciding on scale. Then I got in way over my head & felt I had to stick with it.
Anyway - with a normal 6x4 table, company level games felt & looked too crowded with 20mm.
BUT for platoon level CoC type games, you’re right it looks great! Detail & size just fit really nicely. Plus stick to platoons & you dont need too many figures or vehicles etc
I’d say go for it

[acctingman]

So, I've been asking myself this question....what scale of game do I want to play?

Battalion to company level. My 10mm will handle this wonderfully. So, what am I doing with my 15's?.

10 times out of 10 l'm reaching for my 10mm over 15's for a company or higher level game.

What about platoon level games. Not really my thing, but there are times where I have that platoon "itch".

15's, imo, are just too small for a platoon level game. Table space isn't an issue for me, so I feel my 15's are just going to sit there. There will never be an instance where I'll NOT use my 10's.

I'm not going to buy into scale because its the popular choice with locals. I'll just use other people's toys.

My purchase decisions are made for my desire to solo game.

I'm kind of thinking that I should give 20's a go. Buy a couple platoons worth of Americans and Germans with a AFV's here and there isn't going to be a huge hit on my wallet.

Anyways, just my online ramblings (my wife refuses to listen to my gaming oscillation).

I just don't see a scenario where I'd use my 15's for a platoon level game when table space isn't an issue.

Ok, thats it for me. Thanks for chiming in