Any info of victorian era mongolia (vids inside)?

[Fjodin]

Is there are info about mongolia in victorian era? What uniform and weapons do they use? Was there are tribes with bows and swords? Victorian Mongolia may be interesting place for wargame (mongols, china and russia+ some VSF goodnes).

Here just battle scene from Mongol for inspiration (its medieval, not vsf)

[Doc Twilight]

Victorian Era Mongolia was considered "uncivilized" by the Europeans of the day (and to be fair, most of the Asians). It was populated in the main by semi-nomadic tribes of herdsmen (as it continues to be today). Various "Great Powers" attempted at one time or another to influence the Mongols or buy their loyalty; the Russians and the Chinese being the most successful. From about 1900 or so, Mongolia was essentially a Czarist satellite, though the process did begin earlier in the 19th century. When the Russians went Communist, so too did the Mongols, and that's generally true of many phases of Mongolia's history during the 20th century, though the various Mongol tribes, even at the best of times, tended to fight amongst themselves for most of that time.

No uniforms, for the most part, though some Mongol potentates did pattern personal guardsmen loosely on what they observed being used by the Russians. Firearms were known, but bows remained an important part of daily life and even internecine warfare until the end of the Victorian period. Essentially, the Mongols encountered by "The Mad Baron" in the 1920s were not entirely dissimilar from those that would have been seen even fifty or one hundred years earlier, plus a few modern accoutrements.

Very basic encapsulation, but in essence, a semi-nomadic state of loosely aligned clans theoretically ruled by a "Great Khan" from time to time.

-Doc

 

[Fjodin]

WOW! So they was like "upgraded" medieval mogols? It will be great for wargaming scenario!
They was only tribes or there was some kind of king(khan) or something?

[Patron Zero]

I can't say how accurate or 'authentic' this might be but the 'origin' sequences in the 1994 film The Shadow does depict a bit of Mongolia, again many licenses likely taken.

There was also an interesting PBS documentary filmed in Mongolia with Julia Roberts, well worth a look to get a 'feel' of the terrain and the indigenous peoples there.

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/nature/episodes/wild-horses-of-mongolia-with-julia-roberts/introduction/2887/

[zebcook]

For some reason I thought I wrote a post on this, but then it vanished. That's what I get for doing it at 2:00 AM.

During the 1800's Mongolia was part of the Qing Dynasty which, of course, means that it was nominally controlled. Officially, the Emperor held the title of Khan of Mongolia, and Mongolians were considered lesser people (forbidden to marry Chinese, etc.). For much of the period, the area was a backwater, ignored so the the vast expanse of Outer Mongolia could serve as a buffer to Tsarist Russia. In the latter half of the century, deliberate efforts were made to settle ethnic Chinese in Inner Mongolia to bolster the frontier.

Russian adventurism was never heavy in Mongolia, mostly focused on Manchuria or Kazakastan. Toward the end of the century, there were more moves on western Mongolia, which in turn alarmed the Chinese.

Around 1900, Mongolian nationalists made overtures to the Russians, as natural enemies of the Chinese. Nothing came of it, but region declared independence in 1911 under Bogd Khan (with Russian and Japanese support). That lasted for several years until the a Chinese warlord removed him, but then in 1921 he was briefly restored by Baron Ungern-Sternberg (the Bloody Baron). But that takes us into the whole Back of Beyond time.

So, during this time you've got a mix of traditional Mongol nomads, Qing troops (pre-Boxer armies and probably some reformed post-Boxer units), and local troops. During the independence period you can add Russian and Japanese advisors providing weapons and training, a standing Mongol "army", Chinese warlords, and eventually White Russians and Bolsheviks. Ethnic riots, decadent Mongolian nobles, oppressive tax collectors, troop mutinies, independence movements, Chinese traders, Russian (and some Japanese) agents, exiled anti-imperial Han, bandits, and Western adventurers are all good fodder for a game in this period.

[Fjodin]

Zebcook, thanx a lot! That was very informative!