Are WARMACHINE and HORDES bad words on these forums?

[Gluteus Maximus]

I'm not particularly interested in either game and the style of sculpting doesn't really appeal to me, but your brushwork, however, is absolutely splendid!

So, please do keep posting pics of your figures 

[Westfalia Chris]

I started a Khador troop back in 2003, but lost interest in the game when it became abundantly clear that it would be yet another combo-building tournament thing, here in Germany.

Nonetheless, the figures are top notch. I still want to convert my Manowars to japanese power armours for 3W2 games.

[Dolmot]

I have a small, painted Cryx army, and another group coming up some day. They're fine models, both inspired and inspiring. Consequently I found the bots pleasant to paint. In many cases all you need is a metal colour, some oily wash and then a few theme colours for the plates.

Unfortunately the game itself has escalated (yes, that's the name of one expansion) to a heavyweight gamers' game. Nowadays one single <30p model can come with seven different special rules, which don't only affect the model itself but everything around it too. Each of them modifies the outcome so heavily that without memorising all of them you're potentially screwed. Then all these bonuses stack up so eventually a properly built army will break every single core rule of the game. It will teleport 30 inches and gain +20 attack dice for some truly absurd reasons. It's a fine game for professionals who have the time to study the stats of each faction and every new release. It's good for sunday gaming as long as none of the players want to take it too seriously. However, it would be pure suicide to play casually and then enter a competitive event. You will get instantly devoured by the special rule combo hell.

I just don't have the time it would take to "learn to play" - that is, memorise special rules. Buying yet another 200 page rulebook every year is also a bit excessive. They're nice books, but the rules get scattered over too many heavy volumes. Cards do help but they aren't always enough.

Anyway, the models are cool. I'm going to buy the bear as soon as it ships, for example. In other news, I just heard that my new camera has arrived so I can take some pics of that Cryx army for anyone interested.

[Backyardpatrol]

I started with Khador painting them high end, then got burned out on all the models. 'Couple years later the guy I sold my Khador to bought me the Menoth boxed set, this time I gave them a playable paint job.
I have yet to win a game, it reminds me of Magic the gathering with miniatures.
We play for fun now, I've noticed that the game polarizes people. Definitely not your beer and pretzels sort of fun/tactics.
You can't beat the figures, I use alot of them for other games.

[Dewbakuk]

It is indeed Magic the Gathering with figures. My little group of players has made that comment many times. If we played it competitively, I think we'd stop playing very quickly. It's all about pulling off combo's at the right moment.

As an example, I played a game last night with my Menoth against a friends Khador army. I was using Amon Ad-Raza as my Warcaster and as a result was using quite a Jack Heavy army. We manouvered around each other, while lining up some charges etc. I'd gone first and I knew he was lining up a boosted charge with Beast-09 (a Khador character jack) so once he'd positioned himself, I threw down my surprise. I used Amons feat which allows him to cast spells and then allocate that same focus to jacks in his battlegroup, but just as importantly, gives jacks in his group, his movement stat for that turn. I then cast Mobility (gives all jacks and himself +1 movement and allows charges over difficult terrain) and Synergy (gives a +1 bonus to hit and damage, to the battlegroup, for each jack that hits an opponent in his control area) and allocated out 7 points of focus to the jacks (I'd sacrificed my move). I then activated the Choir and had them cast Infuse which gave all my jacks +2 to hit and damage.

This meant that I suddenly had 3 Warjacks (a Revenger and 2 Crusaders) charged with focus and a 10" charge range (12" for the revenger if you include Reach) that ignored difficult terrain. I also had another Revenger but I didn't have the spare focus to include him. I activated the Revenger first and charged his Demo corps, I had some bad rolls but still killed his Sergeant and more importantly kicked off Synergy. I then had the first Crusader charge one of his big jacks and do some damage and add to Synergy. Then I had my other Crusader charge Beast-09 with a +5 to all it's attack and damage rolls. The big, bad character jack died in one round.

That didn't win me the game but it knocked the Khador onto their back foot and they never really recovered. I took a pounding in the following turn when Sorscha used her feat and made my Jacks "Stationary" (can't move, can't defend themselves) but not enough to take me out. I then systematically took out all support and opened up a charge lane for my caster and killed Sorscha.

It could have easily gone the other way at many points and there are other units I could have brought in which would have made my combo even more vicious but would have made my army a true one trick pony, whereas that was done mostly on the fly.

The real problem with Warmachine is the shear number of special rules, a 500pt game is supposed to last about an hour, I don't think we've had one that's taken less than two. The interactions of all those rules mean they get checked so many times! I'm sure if we played competetively we'd have those all worked out though, and then not play as it'd not be as fun. Currently, our forces change every game as we try different combo's. Sometimes they work as above, other time they don't.

[jet]

As far as I'm concerned, Warmachine is certainly one of those games that really suffers when played in a competitive environment. (Of course, I feel the same about all wargames)  Because I play it with the same group of close friends, I don't worry about that .  We play the models based on looks and coolness factor.  I think Warmachine is a rich, fun game, and although there seems to have been some stackable/killer combo type developments as of late, that sort of stuff doesn't have to dominate your game unless you choose to allow it. We don't.  As for time issues, we play with a chess clock set at 7-minute turns.  The time limit makes the game more fun, as neither player has the time to execute the "perfect turn."  With the time pressure, mistakes are assured, and the game becomes a nail-biting, dramatic affair. ("Oh crap - I forgot to move my warcaster!")

Even though I'm a fan of the game, I am looking for variety now.  I'm looking forward to games that are a little more mentally relaxed and of a different format - 10 and 15mm historical gaming, historical skirmish, and perhaps T&T when plastics become available. 

Again, thanks for all the comments and input,
JET

[Plynkes]

The time limit thing sounds like a hoot.

I always remember that was one of the fun (and nerve-wracking) things about Space Hulk when playing as the marines. It really adds something (sometimes panic-induced paralysis!).

[Argonor]

I started a Khador troop back in 2003, but lost interest in the game when it became abundantly clear that it would be yet another combo-building tournament thing, here in Germany.

I got a Cygnar starter set for my 40-years birthday from a gaming pal who bought himself a Khador pack.

I have assembled the heavy 'jack, and halfways assembled the two light 'jacks... before I got around to finish the set, the game had also turned into 'Magic with Minis' here in DK, and I frankly prefer games where the outcome is decided on the table and not in the planning phase (both Warhammer and 40K suffers a bit from combo-disease, too, I think... although not as badly as they used to).

That being said, I like the look/setting/style of the Iron Kingdoms and would happily use their minis for other settings (as well as play friendly games of Warmachine/Hordes with small forces, just for the laugh of it...).

[Argonor]

The time limit thing sounds like a hoot.

I always remember that was one of the fun (and nerve-wracking) things about Space Hulk when playing as the marines. It really adds something (sometimes panic-induced paralysis!).

Oh yes... that look on your (marine) opponents face when he realizes he just lost another 15(?) secs because of this sarge dying 

[LeadAsbestos]

I'm a fan!:
Circle
http://www.displacedminiatures.com/LeadAsbestos/gallery/1683/
Trolls
http://www.displacedminiatures.com/LeadAsbestos/gallery/1704/
Khador
http://www.displacedminiatures.com/LeadAsbestos/gallery/92/

All sold up the river, but what the hell! More room for the next project!