Thinking of starting Successors

[Dervel]

Might I suggest taking a look at Triumph!

http://www.wgcwar.com/

Available as a PDF from Wargame Vault, or a hardcopy from Scale Creep Miniatures or On Military Matters

[AdamPHayes]

After about 30 years you will be able to put on a battle like Paraitecenae. Over 400 infantry, 100 cavalry and 20 elephants on the table...

[Westbury]

Ref, comments so far:-
Atheling. Thanks for reminding me about Nick Sekunda I've actually got the Selecid book but had completely forgot about it until I went hunting amongst the book shelves! Now reading  .
Rules. What do I like? Well I was brought up on WRG 5th and it's competitors and have no problem saying I enjoyed them; probably don't need the same amount of detail this time around as I'm a lot older! That said the current fad for groups of singly based figures mounted on sabot bases or movement trays being called armies and buckets of dice being thrown is definitely not for me. I like blocks of figures (call them elements) anywhere between 4 to 6 figures per base put together to make a unit - we were going to use Legio last time around. I don't mind book keeping or casualty counters, I like factors, I like ranking of commanders and that making a difference. A big no to random movement - patently nonsense and not that keen on silly random cards - Lucius Cretinous has the flu, no advance for 3 turns, etc.
Have heard of Hail Caesar and To The Strongest but not seen them in action, didn't know there was an Armati II but do remember playing the original years ago and quite liking, how do these play?
Figures. The group is still on for plastic from a cost point of view - is there a height difference between Victrix and Warlord? I think some Aventine metal might sneak in but the web site is a bit crap.

[Atheling]

Ref, comments so far:-
Atheling. Thanks for reminding me about Nick Sekunda I've actually got the Selecid book but had completely forgot about it until I went hunting amongst the book shelves! Now reading  .
Rules. What do I like? Well I was brought up on WRG 5th and it's competitors and have no problem saying I enjoyed them; probably don't need the same amount of detail this time around as I'm a lot older! That said the current fad for groups of singly based figures mounted on sabot bases or movement trays being called armies and buckets of dice being thrown is definitely not for me. I like blocks of figures (call them elements) anywhere between 4 to 6 figures per base put together to make a unit - we were going to use Legio last time around. I don't mind book keeping or casualty counters, I like factors, I like ranking of commanders and that making a difference. A big no to random movement - patently nonsense and not that keen on silly random cards - Lucius Cretinous has the flu, no advance for 3 turns, etc.
Have heard of Hail Caesar and To The Strongest but not seen them in action, didn't know there was an Armati II but do remember playing the original years ago and quite liking, how do these play?
Figures. The group is still on for plastic from a cost point of view - is there a height difference between Victrix and Warlord? I think some Aventine metal might sneak in but the web site is a bit crap.

For me it choosing a rules set usually comes down to two things:

i/ Do the units look authentic when based up on the tabletop? I've seen a load of games where a small stand with perhaps four mini's based on it represents a large number of men. This just doesn't do it for me personally. I like larger units. so, that's something you're going to have to ponder

ii/ Do the rules have the right feel for the 'period'. This is a tricky one as sometimes we just don't know how some wars were fought and only have snippets of information. So, with that in mind, the real question is; does it feel right according to your interpretation? If it's any solace, I've been looking for a suitable set of Late Medieval rules for twenty years and have yet to find the perfect set, if such a thing exists

[vodkafan]

Mr Westbury sir it just occurred to me, could the scythed chariots be 3d printed? That would cut down the cost considerable, like.

[AdamPHayes]

Mr Westbury sir it just occurred to me, could the scythed chariots be 3d printed? That would cut down the cost considerable, like.

Does this depend on already having the 3D printer? I don’t and I haven’t had much luck tracking down a place with reasonable prices to get prints done.

[vodkafan]

Ref, comments so far:-
Atheling. Thanks for reminding me about Nick Sekunda I've actually got the Selecid book but had completely forgot about it until I went hunting amongst the book shelves! Now reading  .
Rules. What do I like? Well I was brought up on WRG 5th and it's competitors and have no problem saying I enjoyed them; probably don't need the same amount of detail this time around as I'm a lot older! That said the current fad for groups of singly based figures mounted on sabot bases or movement trays being called armies and buckets of dice being thrown is definitely not for me. I like blocks of figures (call them elements) anywhere between 4 to 6 figures per base put together to make a unit - we were going to use Legio last time around. I don't mind book keeping or casualty counters, I like factors, I like ranking of commanders and that making a difference. A big no to random movement - patently nonsense and not that keen on silly random cards - Lucius Cretinous has the flu, no advance for 3 turns, etc.
Have heard of Hail Caesar and To The Strongest but not seen them in action, didn't know there was an Armati II but do remember playing the original years ago and quite liking, how do these play?
Figures. The group is still on for plastic from a cost point of view - is there a height difference between Victrix and Warlord? I think some Aventine metal might sneak in but the web site is a bit crap.

Am fairly sure To The Strongest has that same activation mechanic as your Spectre rules, but could be wrong.....years ago my very first wargames were 15mm Ancients using Vis Bellica rules.....I have a feeling that might just fit your bill. Don't know if I still have the rules but for sure I have the army lists. They were elements of 12 figures on a 60 x 30 base, and looked great on the table. 

[FierceKitty]

Ref, comments so far:-
Atheling. Thanks for reminding me about Nick Sekunda I've actually got the Selecid book but had completely forgot about it until I went hunting amongst the book shelves! Now reading  .
Rules. What do I like? Well I was brought up on WRG 5th and it's competitors and have no problem saying I enjoyed them; probably don't need the same amount of detail this time around as I'm a lot older! That said the current fad for groups of singly based figures mounted on sabot bases or movement trays being called armies and buckets of dice being thrown is definitely not for me. I like blocks of figures (call them elements) anywhere between 4 to 6 figures per base put together to make a unit - we were going to use Legio last time around. I don't mind book keeping or casualty counters, I like factors, I like ranking of commanders and that making a difference. A big no to random movement - patently nonsense and not that keen on silly random cards - Lucius Cretinous has the flu, no advance for 3 turns, etc.
Have heard of Hail Caesar and To The Strongest but not seen them in action, didn't know there was an Armati II but do remember playing the original years ago and quite liking, how do these play?
Figures. The group is still on for plastic from a cost point of view - is there a height difference between Victrix and Warlord? I think some Aventine metal might sneak in but the web site is a bit crap.

You speak much sense, Sir.

[Dervel]

i/ Do the units look authentic when based up on the tabletop? I've seen a load of games where a small stand with perhaps four mini's based on it represents a large number of men. This just doesn't do it for me personally. I like larger units. so, that's something you're going to have to ponder

That is somewhat relative.  In this picture you see three different representations of a unit of Horse Bow in Triumph.  The recommendation is to use two per stand to allow people to play with fewer figures.  but you can just as easily add more figures to the standard base and create the crowded look.  you can also increase the size of the armies (scale up the points deployed) which has a similar impact of creating a crowded table with a lot more maneuver elements.

That is why we don't state a "scale" for troops in Triumph, because it is adjusted to the battle you want to represent.  This video helps explain it a little better.

[AdamPHayes]

For me it choosing a rules set usually comes down to two things:

i/ Do the units look authentic when based up on the tabletop? I've seen a load of games where a small stand with perhaps four mini's based on it represents a large number of men. This just doesn't do it for me personally. I like larger units. so, that's something you're going to have to ponder

ii/ Do the rules have the right feel for the 'period'. This is a tricky one as sometimes we just don't know how some wars were fought and only have snippets of information. So, with that in mind, the real question is; does it feel right according to your interpretation? If it's any solace, I've been looking for a suitable set of Late Medieval rules for twenty years and have yet to find the perfect set, if such a thing exists

I think there’s a bit more to these questions than is answered by “it doesn’t have a scale.” More pertinent is what level of abstraction do tge rules work to? To take a Roman Army as the example. Is it at the DBA end of the scale, a short step away from playing chess, where you accept that an element of 3 or 4 figures represents an entire Legion? Or do you want to be able to see a Legion as having multiple components that you have to make the choices about how they will manoeuvre and support each other? You might even want to see your Roman Legion with every cohort/maniple represented separately and be personally in charge of the whole line replacement process. These different levels of abstraction or command and control will really require different approaches to the way the rule mechanisms are designed. They should give a very different feel to a game and I would be dubious about any set that claimed to do the entire span.

[Atheling]

I think there’s a bit more to these questions than is answered by “it doesn’t have a scale.” More pertinent is what level of abstraction do tge rules work to? To take a Roman Army as the example. Is it at the DBA end of the scale, a short step away from playing chess, where you accept that an element of 3 or 4 figures represents an entire Legion? Or do you want to be able to see a Legion as having multiple components that you have to make the choices about how they will manoeuvre and support each other? You might even want to see your Roman Legion with every cohort/maniple represented separately and be personally in charge of the whole line replacement process. These different levels of abstraction or command and control will really require different approaches to the way the rule mechanisms are designed. They should give a very different feel to a game and I would be dubious about any set that claimed to do the entire span.

Multiple components making a choice. DBA looks rubbish IMHO. Your chess analogy is very apt though in terms of game mechanics and aesthetics.

Also, you're spot on about Ancients/Medieval rules that claim to cover a huge span of history. Take the pike Phalanx; despite wielding the same weapon, the phalanx of Alexander behaved in a very different way to that of say the Swiss in the Late Medieval/Early Renaissance time frame. They had very different problems to over come.  That's just one example, there are hundreds.

[has.been]

Good luck with this endeavour.
You have already sparked interest & responses.
Keep us all informed of developments, please.

[Dervel]

The group is still on for plastic from a cost point of view - is there a height difference between Victrix and Warlord? I think some Aventine metal might sneak in but the web site is a bit crap.

I have some of the Victrix plastic Republican Romans, great figures.  If you are looking for plastics, I can recommend them.

The warlord stuff tends to be smaller.  I am looking at Aventine comparisons, I would say they will mix with the Victrix plastics, but I have only seen picture comparisons.

[SJWi]

I've just noticed that 1st Corps army packs for the Successors are currently on sale at a 20% discount. These figures are smaller than the other ranges mentioned ( eg Aventine, Gripping Beast) but the range is pretty complete so you can make up any Successor army using just 1st Corps. They are nice figures if a little caricatured.

Might be worth a look? 

[Frostie]

I have a Seleucid and Ptolemaic armies made with Xyston 15mm figures.   The armies are based on Raphia and number nearly 3000 figures.

Check my blog

www.warrenswargamerantings.blogspot.com