Author Topic: Wargames Atlantic pick next box poll (Read 9394 times)

Grumpy Gnome · « **Reply #15 on:** April 23, 2021, 10:46:11 PM »

Quote from: Elbows on April 23, 2021, 10:37:10 PM

Sure, but we won't really know until someone tries it. The advantage here is that there is not a competitive market for that...meaning if you did a really nice box of plastic cowboys or gladiators - you'd be it. The only show in town. Now neither of these genres is huge...but it exists. There is a new Old West skirmish game released maybe once a year. I do agree that there's no point in several companies competing with boxes of plastic figures for a small genre - but the space is there for someone to grab it. Particularly if you become "the" supplier who does that stuff. I think it's a market space that's available - as long as you're not trying to be the next Games Workshop.

The advantage here is that 3D printing will cover all these bases, but a lot of people (myself included) still "prefer" simple HIPS plastic kits.

I agree with Elbows.

Mr. White · « **Reply #16 on:** April 23, 2021, 10:49:05 PM »

I do as well, but I feel like there are a few companies that have positioned themselves as the "go to" makers of Cowboy minis.

Black Scorpion and KnuckleDuster come to mind. Now, neither do a box set of mix'n'match plastics but I would assume if anyone found it viable it would be one of those two.

3Fingers2 · « **Reply #17 on:** April 24, 2021, 10:57:30 AM »

Set of plastic Wild West with potential to swap weapons out for sci fi and mounted torsos so they could be put on alternative steeds would be a dream come true.

armchairgeneral · « **Reply #18 on:** April 24, 2021, 07:49:19 PM »

Each to their own I suppose, but the list looks like people have just requested whatever suits their current pet period rather than what would be best for a plastic set.

I voted for WW1 Russians and Austro-Hungarians in an earlier round as I felt they would suit mass battles so sorry to see they have disappeared from the current list. Odd that EW Austro-Hungarian Dragoons are still there though.

Belgian · « **Reply #19 on:** April 24, 2021, 08:21:04 PM »

Quote from: armchairgeneral on April 24, 2021, 07:49:19 PM

Each to their own I suppose, but the list looks like people have just requested whatever suits their current pet period rather than what would be best for a plastic set.

I voted for WW1 Russians and Austro-Hungarians in an earlier round as I felt they would suit mass battles so sorry to see they have disappeared from the current list. Odd that EW Austro-Hungarian Dragoons are still there though.

If I'm not mistaken the best picks of each current poll will be bundled into a second round so the most chosen sets will come back in the next round. World War One Russians would be very interesting, also very useful for the Russian Civil War for both whites and reds.

armchairgeneral · « **Reply #20 on:** April 25, 2021, 08:34:51 PM »

Quote from: Belgian on April 24, 2021, 08:21:04 PM

World War One Russians would be very interesting, also very useful for the Russian Civil War for both whites and reds.

That’s what I thought. This set would be really useful for doing epic battles throughout the WW1 Eastern Front. Similarly for the Austro-Hungarians.

Belgian · « **Reply #21 on:** April 25, 2021, 08:47:01 PM »

Quote from: armchairgeneral on April 25, 2021, 08:34:51 PM

That’s what I thought. This set would be really useful for doing epic battles throughout the WW1 Eastern Front. Similarly for the Austro-Hungarians.

This, not an expert but thinking of the excellent Copplestone range. The miniatures in greatcoats, advancing poses and multiple head options allowing for siberian rifles, bolsheviks, white infantry and so. Regarding the First World War, not sure if both sides during the Russian Civil War wore identical uniforms but that would also be great as an extra option instead of the all greatcoat option. Could even be a good option for their new army builder concept.

Thinks the most popular countries are already more than sufficiently covered, always good to have more options especially in plastic though but indeed Austro-Hungarians, Russians, Ottomans would be very useful and could also be used for Back of Beyond style wargames. Looking at some of the rather odd choices in the polls I hope the more decent options are certainly chosen the most as the public's prime choice might be worse than you can think. Thinking of the Boaty McBoatface name affaire but guess Wargames Atlantic is smart enough to avoid rather poor future releases.

Major_Gilbear · « **Reply #22 on:** April 26, 2021, 12:30:50 PM »

Quote from: Jack Hooligan on April 23, 2021, 10:49:05 PM

I do as well, but I feel like there are a few companies that have positioned themselves as the "go to" makers of Cowboy minis.

Black Scorpion and KnuckleDuster come to mind. Now, neither do a box set of mix'n'match plastics but I would assume if anyone found it viable it would be one of those two.

I dunno; Black Scorpion hand-sculpts their minis, and to make that into a mould suitable for injection-moulded plastic means that the models would have to be sculpted oversized, then traced by hand to cut the mould into a metal die via a pantograph machine... Which is how GW used to do it, and how Renedra still mostly do it (...I believe?).

GW has since moved to all digital sculpts, which the machines then cut straight into the moulds (i.e., no laborious "middle step" of scanning/pantographing required), and they do all of this in-house. In fact, I'm not even sure if the moulds they cut are even still steel any more; if not, or if at least some are in a softer metal that's easier and cheaper to machine, then that would explain why they seem to be happier making single-model or limited releases these days.

Anyway, my point is that just because a one-man-band like Black Scorpion doesn't find it economically viable to make cowboys in plastic, doesn't mean that it isn't viable for somebody else to make them. I would imagine Knuckleduster are in the same position as BS.

Quote from: Belgian on April 25, 2021, 08:47:01 PM

This, not an expert but thinking of the excellent Copplestone range. The miniatures in greatcoats, advancing poses and multiple head options allowing for siberian rifles, bolsheviks, white infantry and so. Regarding the First World War, not sure if both sides during the Russian Civil War wore identical uniforms but that would also be great as an extra option instead of the all greatcoat option. Could even be a good option for their new army builder concept.

Do you mean having one frame be the greatcoat bodies, and the second frame being the specific arms/heads/equipment, etc. required to make different units? If so, the main issues with this are:

1) The moulds wear at different rates; the shared part of the mould gets way more use than the unit-specific part of the mould. This means it's hard to gauge how much lifespan a particular boxed set has left, because it's availability depends on a shared asset.

2) The shared mould can only be used in one kit run at a time. So you can't produce two kits at the same time (assuming you have machine availability to run multiple kits simultaneously, or course), because the part you need for Kit B is currently being used by Kit A.

There are ways around these (especially (2), as you could just do a big run of the shared sprue, and then marry them up with a specific sprue by hand at the box-packing stage), but I believe the main miniatures company that used to do this (GW) stopped this practice because it was more logistically complicated then the benefit they ended up getting from it.

Quote from: Belgian on April 25, 2021, 08:47:01 PM

Looking at some of the rather odd choices in the polls I hope the more decent options are certainly chosen the most as the public's prime choice might be worse than you can think. Thinking of the Boaty McBoatface name affaire but guess Wargames Atlantic is smart enough to avoid rather poor future releases.

I am aware that there is some pruning at various stages to remove things that are deemed not commercially viable, and I believe they retain the final say on anything that makes it to the last round of voting. Precisely for the reason you mention!

robh · « **Reply #23 on:** April 26, 2021, 01:51:54 PM »

Quote from: Major_Gilbear on April 26, 2021, 12:30:50 PM

I am aware that there is some pruning at various stages to remove things that are deemed not commercially viable, and I believe they retain the final say on anything that makes it to the last round of voting. Precisely for the reason you mention!

Given the lead time to research and design a range of figures, to some extent for Fantasy/Sci-fi, but certainly for Historical armies, they must already be well into the "production" of the sets they know they want. Largely I think an exercise like this set of votes is a marketing tool not a serious production scheduling activity.
Their chosen options are in those lists already and will "win" the vote counts.

Belgian · « **Reply #24 on:** April 26, 2021, 07:12:41 PM »

Quote from: Major_Gilbear on April 26, 2021, 12:30:50 PM

Do you mean having one frame be the greatcoat bodies, and the second frame being the specific arms/heads/equipment, etc. required to make different units? If so, the main issues with this are:

1) The moulds wear at different rates; the shared part of the mould gets way more use than the unit-specific part of the mould. This means it's hard to gauge how much lifespan a particular boxed set has left, because it's availability depends on a shared asset.

2) The shared mould can only be used in one kit run at a time. So you can't produce two kits at the same time (assuming you have machine availability to run multiple kits simultaneously, or course), because the part you need for Kit B is currently being used by Kit A.

There are ways around these (especially (2), as you could just do a big run of the shared sprue, and then marry them up with a specific sprue by hand at the box-packing stage), but I believe the main miniatures company that used to do this (GW) stopped this practice because it was more logistically complicated then the benefit they ended up getting from it.

Wasn't thinking of separate sprues per boxed set but more like their army builder concept of identical small sprues with six bodies per sprue and limited head options but giving you an astounding 60 miniatures per boxed set or more like their other boxed sets which are mostly (or all not sure) single sprue kits if I'm not mistaken. With smaller army builder sprues you could also opt for slightly less bodies per sprue but with more options. With their current output more than happy with the quality and price of these sets especially with the many conversion possibilities. Have already been making some interwar german leftist militia, fantasy dwarf warriors and weird wars world war one soldiers and just touched the surface of possibilities.