1/72 fantasy that isn’t Caesar or Dark Alliance?

[Ozreth]

Other than individual figures listed online that are no longer in production these are the two names I see pop up. I’m particularly looking for orcs, goblins, wargs/wolves, trolls and ogres but curious about anything else.

Thanks in advance.

[Hobgoblin]

There isn't much that's specifically 1/72, but there are loads of 15,18, 25 and 28mm figures that work well in 1/72.

The (nominally 15mm but more like 20mm) Battle Valor orcs ("Orcians") are perfect Uruk-hai in 1/72. They're a bit shorter than humans, but "squat and broad" as per Tolkien (and with the requisite big heads, bow legs and long arms too!). The range also has warg riders and trolls/ogres. NB: the "Orcians" aren't representative of Battle Valor's range, size-wise: some of the other armies are much more traditional 15mm; their orcs are meant to be very big in that scale. I think the lizardmen ("Scalians") are similarly large.

The 18-20mm Blood Dawn orcs that Magister Militum used to do are about the same size as the Battle Valor ones but have a slightly more cartoony look. I think they may have just gone out of production, but the range may well have been sold by MM. They're also frequently available second hand.

For trolls and ogres, you're really spoilt for choice with 15-28mm manufacturers. It just depends how big you want them. Tolkien's trolls seem to have been 12'+ ("[There] came forward out of the trees three strange shapes. As tall as trolls they were, twelve feet or more in height...."), so if you want that sort of size, you're looking for trolls that are perhaps 40-50mm tall. Lots and lots of manufacturers make those. I'd have a look at the Ral Partha Europe range of ogres and trolls by Bob Olley.



You might want to take a look at the goblins in the same range. While they're nominally 28mm, they're very small and delicate by modern standards. I have the AD&D group of five that Bob Olley did for Ral Partha; I think the RPE ones are an extension of that range. They are a bit bigger than the Battle Valor ones, but perfectly compatible with them as either elites or champions/leaders.
To give you an idea of scale, the integral bases are perhaps 16-18mm across (I don't have an unbiased one to measure, but there's a bit of room all round when they're based on 20mm UK pennies):



There are also wolf riders, with slightly idiosyncratic wargs in the Olley style. But there are also some old Tom Meier "lesser goblin imp" wolf riders that are exquisite and absolutely perfect for 1/72. They're at the bottom of the range (there are archers too):



A lot of the old Tom Meier Ral Partha goblins/lesser orcs would work well in 1/72 as well. They're still in production in the US, though they're expensive, but they frequently pop up on eBay; they've been produced more or less continuously since the late 1970s, so there are lots in circulation!

Other sources of orcs would be the old Rieder Design goblin terrorists, now produced by Alternative Armies. They're quite nice miniatures that have aged well - I think the AA photo is a bit unflattering.

Alternative Armies also produce some of the Rieder orcs, plus some that have been converted more recently. I'm not 100% on the size of these, but I have a couple of the Rieder orcs from a different pack not yet back in production, and they'd work well in 1/72 if you don't mind your orcs on the large size. There are wolf riders too.

If you want Kev Adams goblins, AA do a group of 28mm lesser goblins by him that would work well in 1/72.

Denizen do seven "true 25mm" orcs/goblins, all of which are very nice figures that are great for 1/72 (FA5, 6, 16, 18, 27, 39 and 45). They're roughly the same size as the Ral Partha ones - slightly more delicate, though.

There's another Denizen range of goblins by a different sculptor. They're a bit more cartoony, and I couldn't swear to the size, but I suspect they're small enough to work in 1/72.

One more thing: the Nolzur's/Wizzkids/official D&D plastic figures are often compatible with 1/72. They're 28mm, notionally, but their proportions are much more in line with scale models (like 1/72) than traditional 28mm. The goblins are very small and fit with 1/72 ranges; the orcs are perfect as 1/72 ogres. I was playing 1/72 Hordes of the Things last night; my flyers are Nolzur's gargoyles, which look the part among Dark Alliance and Caesar orcs.

Hope that's some help!

[Galtisant]

The Games Workshop Lord of The Rings goblins are also small enough to work very well with 1/72 figures.

[Hobgoblin]

The Games Workshop Lord of The Rings goblins are also small enough to work very well with 1/72 figures.

Yes - that's a good point. I've got a couple of the Moria ones based up as leaders or champions for the Caesar goblins.

Another manufacturer that's worth a look is Irregular. The Irregular '15mm' ranges are quite large; their orcs, goblins, lizardmen and ratmen are fine for 1/72; I'm using them in 25mm RPGs.

For humans, Tumbling Dice vikings and WotR types mix in well with 1/72 plastics.

[Ozreth]

Hope that's some help!

Wow this is exactly what I needed, thank you! This is going to be fun, already filling up some shopping carts. I had a ton of em4 orcs that I painted up quick and dirty to try Oathmark. My friend and I are loving it so I'm expanding the force and wanted to stay within scale and aesthetic as best I could. I've got some Dark Alliance wargs that I'm going to mount some em4 orcs onto, but don't love the DA orc and goblins themselves.

[Ozreth]

The Games Workshop Lord of The Rings goblins are also small enough to work very well with 1/72 figures.

Thanks. These the ones? https://www.games-workshop.com/en-PL/Goblin-Warriors-2018

[Ozreth]

Some of these are really perfect, thanks again.

[Hobgoblin]

Wow this is exactly what I needed, thank you! This is going to be fun, already filling up some shopping carts. I had a ton of em4 orcs that I painted up quick and dirty to try Oathmark. My friend and I are loving it so I'm expanding the force and wanted to stay within scale and aesthetic as best I could. I've got some Dark Alliance wargs that I'm going to mount some em4 orcs onto, but don't love the DA orc and goblins themselves.

Oh - be careful about the scale! The EM4 orcs are great, but they're chunky 28mm and much bigger than 1/72 orcs from either Caesar or DA. The biggest Caesar orcs might be almost as tall as the EM4 orcs, but they're about a quarter of the mass if that. And the Battle Valor Orcians will be tiny next to the EM4 orcs. For example, while the EM4 orcs are on (roughly) 25mm integral bases (suitable for Oathmark), a Battle Valor orc will look OK on a 20mm square but would be a bit lost on 25mm. The wolf riders do look OK on 50 x 25 bases, but they'll be in quite loose order!

(Ignore me if you know all this already!)

[Ozreth]

Oh - be careful about the scale! The EM4 orcs are great, but they're chunky 28mm and much bigger than 1/72 orcs from either Caesar or DA. The biggest Caesar orcs might be almost as tall as the EM4 orcs, but they're about a quarter of the mass if that. And the Battle Valor Orcians will be tiny next to the EM4 orcs. For example, while the EM4 orcs are on (roughly) 25mm integral bases (suitable for Oathmark), a Battle Valor orc will look OK on a 20mm square but would be a bit lost on 25mm. The wolf riders do look OK on 50 x 25 bases, but they'll be in quite loose order!

(Ignore me if you know all this already!)

I did not know this! I've only dabbled in wargaming over the years and come from the RPG world, but I believe it was someone around here who mentioned that these were 1/72, and they do look a lot smaller than my 28mm figures.

[Hobgoblin]

I did not know this! I've only dabbled in wargaming over the years and come from the RPG world, but I believe it was someone around here who mentioned that these were 1/72, and they do look a lot smaller than my 28mm figures.

Ah - well, be careful, then!

The EM4 figures were originally produced by Grenadier for Fantasy Warriors, a game that set itself up as a rival for Warhammer. They're definitely 28mm - and 1/72 figures will look tiny beside them. Some "28mm" figures have got a bit bigger since the 90s, and some companies have turned their orcs from goblins to ogres, but the EM4 orcs are still big and burly (if short) when compared to a 28mm historical human.

Both Mirliton (in Italy) and Forlorn Hope (in the UK) still produce the metal figures that were designed to go with the plastics. I've linked to the orcs, but there are trolls and ogres in the range too. This unit is a mix of Forlorn Hope metals and EM4 plastics:



This shot shows a 28mm Skaven compared with 1/72 Caesar ratmen. As you can see, there's quite a difference:



This one shows a 1/72 Caesar lizardman between a 28mm Oathmark goblin (with a different head) and a 28mm Perry knight. The lizardman is very big for 1/72 scale (I can only get two of them on a Hordes of the Things 60mm base vs three or four normal 1/72 figures), but he still looks very small compared with the 28mm figures; he's only 'saved' because a weird reptile creature could be any size. Both the 28mm figures here are much slighter than the EM4 orcs.



I had an RPG project underway in 1/72 scale; I was using some of the Fantasy Warriors/Forlorn Hope orcs as ogres in that scale!

[ithoriel]

Elheim have a small selection of 20mm fantasy figures that might suit.
https://www.elhiem.co.uk/

[blacksmith]

Elheim have a small selection of 20mm fantasy figures that might suit.
https://www.elhiem.co.uk/

Elheim are Ok figures, a bit crude and static though, but good for some characters hard to find somewhere else. Here's two I painted recently:

[Ozreth]

Hm, well now I'm realizing that measuring scale is trickier than I thought. I'm doing some research and it seems that you need to either know what the model is from the manufacturer, or do some division by guessing the average height of the real life thing? I suppose since there are only a few scales you can use the process of elimination?

[Hobgoblin]

Hi Ozreth,

The only way you could really use EM4 orcs with 1/72 is if you are assuming that they are much bigger than humans. Some games do this - e.g. Warhammer and Kings of War, which have 28mm orcs on 25mm bases while humans are on 20mm bases. The EM4 figures are on (roughly) 25mm bases to begin with, so they're already big (broad rather than tall) in 28mm scale; 20mm is the default base size for 28mm humans (e.g. in historical games).

I actually used to do this, as we began playing Kings of War in 1/72 scale, and 1/72 figures fill a 20mm base OK. But we've gradually drifted up to 28mm for everything. EM4, Mantic and old Citadel orcs are roughly the size relative to 1/72 humans that newer GW orcs are to 28mm humans. But they're still big compared with 28mm humans - just not as big as they got later on!

Oathmark uses 25mm bases for everything, as I recall, so you're really stuck with 28mm. There's nothing in 28mm that's as cheap as 1/72 figures, but there are lots of fairly reasonably priced hard-plastic 28s from Oathmark, Frostgrave and Mantic. You can buy individual sprues on eBay. The Frostgrave demons make good armoured orcs if you leave their tails off: the leader in this unit below is a Frostgrave demon. Some of the others are EM4 with Mantic heads:



By the way, the EM4 orcs are quite a bit chunkier than the official Oathmark (28mm orcs), but they mix well enough if you don't mind some being more human (Oathmark) and some being more bestial (EM4), although the EM4 ones have much bigger/thicker weapons.

[102-year-old-man]

Nice thread with good tips already!!
I like those Elhiem chaps! Elhiem will produce some orcs sooner or later: https://www.elhiem.co.uk/ourshop/cat_1604228-VoteFund-future-ranges.html (I guess end of next year?)

For smaller goblins you can also use most 15mm goblins like those: https://www.alternative-armies.com/products/kc1-coblynau-lesser-goblins

CP models has some 1/72 orcs: https://www.checkpointminiatures.co.uk/product-category/20mm-ranges/20mm-tqd-castings/fantasy-tqd-castings/generic-fantasy/

Most of gnomes from Reaper Bones and Wizkids fit as 1/72 humans. You just maybe have to cut the ears away

For some special characters you could also use those: https://www.ebay.com/itm/353467981718 (they are 1/72)

A really nice source for some off scale interesting stuff is https://www.alternative-armies.com , because they always publish the size of each miniature on their shop.

So maybe this is a good ogre with 35mm in size: https://www.alternative-armies.com/products/fm63-ogre-35mm-tall?_pos=1&_sid=4c93fbbba&_ss=r