Question(s) on Hail Caesar Epic Battles

[Mallo]

I'm thinking about starting Hail Caesar Epic battles, but been trying to find some more out about it before getting caught up in another project that takes up shelf space that becomes another 'if only I had the time'. For 30+ years I've really only done fantasy + scifi gaming and I'd really like to do something historical.

- Are the Epic rules compatible with the main HC rulebook and supplements?

- Do we know if Warlord plan to continue expanding the range to cover more of what they already cover in their 28mm range. Eg I'm mostly interested in doing the Roman invasion of Britain rather than the Hannibal era. I see they have just released the Celt army set, I was mostly wondering if they intended to release more models or supplements to cover this era?

- Does the game/scale feel restrictive to people that brought into it ie: do you feel you are a little beholden to warlord games as they are the only offering at this scale, or does the game feel 'complete' enough that it doesn't matter? (I don't 3D print and would only be buying 'official' minis)

TIA 

[jon_1066]

Ask yourself why select these?  They have deliberately made them incompatible with most other figure ranges so you are locked into their system.  If it stops doing well it gets dropped and you get no new models.

You can play Hail Caesar with any models and at almost any scale.  Unless you really like the figures I would look elsewhere.  eg 6 mm Baccus, 10 mm Pendraken, etc. 

To me the epic figures are too computer generated and sterile.  They are too regular and regimented, too perfect.

[Mallo]

Ask yourself why select these?  They have deliberately made them incompatible with most other figure ranges so you are locked into their system.  If it stops doing well it gets dropped and you get no new models.

You can play Hail Caesar with any models and at almost any scale.  Unless you really like the figures I would look elsewhere.  eg 6 mm Baccus, 10 mm Pendraken, etc. 

To me the epic figures are too computer generated and sterile.  They are too regular and regimented, too perfect.

Thanks for the reply! 

I'm not too bothered about the rules directly- I spend more time painting than gaming anyway, as long as the rules are not too bloated and are accessible so it was more for the model range than the game as a whole. I am trying to avoid playing Hail Caesar itself at larger scale as I have so many victrix etc models (many thousands) which I used for lord of the rings and just couldn't find the patience to paint the same identical models for historicals, so was looking at the smaller scales.

I already have huge 6mm collections, I play a lot of 6mm fantasy and SciFi games. But the difficulty of getting models shipped here now means I have pretty much brought everything I intend to for 6mm from places like Baccus going forward. Between the rising costs anyway, and now with them dropping selling to places in the EU last year due to the GPSR rules and then another price rise recently (and I suspect more to come shortly) its just not cost affective to buy from some of these companies in the UK now. Its one of the reasons I want to try a historical game- I've pretty much been pushed out of collecting anything further for my scifi game as I'm just not going to pay the import fees going forward!

Warlord games I can at least purchase locally.

I'm not too worried if they are incompatible with other ranges, as long as their game 'feels complete'. I'm just not sure how often warlord drops their historical ranges (I've seen them drop their licensed games before). If they drop the range, then that would be problematic!

[fred]

The rules in Epic HC are the same as for HC

Probably worth having a look at the Epic ACW range to see how that has grown as it was the first one released.

You could just use your existing models to play HC - we played far more with 10mm fantasy figures than with historicals.

[Kelly_]

- Do we know if Warlord plan to continue expanding the range to cover more of what they already cover in their 28mm range. Eg I'm mostly interested in doing the Roman invasion of Britain rather than the Hannibal era. I see they have just released the Celt army set, I was mostly wondering if they intended to release more models or supplements to cover this era?

As far as I can tell, the new Celt frame was put out due to the success of the initial 5 Punic frames, and definitely see Warlord putting out more Hail Caesar in epic, but maybe not specific to Britain at first.  My best guess would be that the next plastics would be Greek / Macedonian to allow multiple usages of the frames, but that does not rule out any smaller resin releases that could cover skirmishers or specialty troops before an Eastern expansion.  I have several of the individual Warlord resin infantry epic pieces from the baggage and ballista boxes, and they have a good level of detail.

- Does the game/scale feel restrictive to people that brought into it ie: do you feel you are a little beholden to warlord games as they are the only offering at this scale, or does the game feel 'complete' enough that it doesn't matter? (I don't 3D print and would only be buying 'official' minis)

With what I have so far, I am looking to build out three forces, between Carthaginians, Celts, and Romans, with each of them having between six to ten troop types and still allowing for allies to be switched between them, and definitely feel like I am getting my money's worth.  At this scale there is still a lot of potential for painting depending on the time you choose to invest in it, and I have had to set a time limit on myself per base to keep within some kind of schedule.

[Ran The Cid]

7th Son on YouTube did multiple videos on HC Epic.  That's where I've gotten most of my epic info.
https://www.youtube.com/@7thson726 
There are minor rules differences between 28mm and Epic.  Mostly about unit size, driven by how the plastic frame is constructed. 

[rumacara]

If you are based in EU you have companies in Spain and Germany that sell many of the UK manufacturers.
Atlantica Juegos and Bandua in Spain, Miniatoricum in Germany to name but a few.

[Mallo]

The rules in Epic HC are the same as for HC

Probably worth having a look at the Epic ACW range to see how that has grown as it was the first one released.

You could just use your existing models to play HC - we played far more with 10mm fantasy figures than with historicals.

Thanks! Thats good to know, I would be tempted to pick up some of the 'regular' scale books as well for reference. I'm unlikely to play HC with my fantasy collection, I have plenty of fantasy rules I don't have enough time as it is to play. If anything I would just like to have a game that is vastly different to normal fantasy/scifi genres my group is absorbed by!

As far as I can tell, the new Celt frame was put out due to the success of the initial 5 Punic frames, and definitely see Warlord putting out more Hail Caesar in epic, but maybe not specific to Britain at first.  My best guess would be that the next plastics would be Greek / Macedonian to allow multiple usages of the frames, but that does not rule out any smaller resin releases that could cover skirmishers or specialty troops before an Eastern expansion.  I have several of the individual Warlord resin infantry epic pieces from the baggage and ballista boxes, and they have a good level of detail.
With what I have so far, I am looking to build out three forces, between Carthaginians, Celts, and Romans, with each of them having between six to ten troop types and still allowing for allies to be switched between them, and definitely feel like I am getting my money's worth.  At this scale there is still a lot of potential for painting depending on the time you choose to invest in it, and I have had to set a time limit on myself per base to keep within some kind of schedule.

Thanks for the reply, that's exactly what I was wanted to hear. I didn't want to find I'd purchase the game and find that I'd always be looking for a troop type that doesn't exist in the range yet, or waiting on some new release to fill a gap! I'm hopeful they continue to expand the ranges, but there is a lot there already!

7th Son on YouTube did multiple videos on HC Epic.  That's where I've gotten most of my epic info.
https://www.youtube.com/@7thson726 
There are minor rules differences between 28mm and Epic.  Mostly about unit size, driven by how the plastic frame is constructed.

Thanks, I've gone through his whole playlist for his epic HC stuff now! Excellent and just what I was looking for! I'd see his channel before for his larger scale HC battle reports, good to see someone promote the game!

If you are based in EU you have companies in Spain and Germany that sell many of the UK manufacturers.
Atlantica Juegos and Bandua in Spain, Miniatoricum in Germany to name but a few.

Thanks! I hadn't heard of these companies before, I will check them out!

Thanks for all the replies! I think I'm going to get stuck into Epic scale HC (and might even try Pike & shotte as well!  )

[Waffles_vs_Tacos]

I play Hail Caesar strait out of the rulebook, in terms of rules. I use standard sized units, so all of my units are 3x60mm bases. I think it visually looks good. For units rules I use this website as I like how they do the unit rules:

https://hailcaesardb.wordpress.com/culture/

Polybian Roman's and Late Carthage, of course.

I am going to so 2 boxes + some celts and the commander sets for my armies when I get to building them. 

[Frostie]

I have thousands of 15mm Punic Wars mins, taking in all nations.

But if I were to start again I might be drawn to these.  There are a few companies that are doing 3D prints to match these, Cromity Forge being one.

[Waffles_vs_Tacos]

I just bought some of the Cromarty Forge Roman Cavalry and Velites in 13.5mm to go with my legionary units from WLG and they look very good. The PSC prints were mostly outstanding, though the ones with 2 Pila on the shield have the pila looking droopy, but everything else looks great. They seem to scale well too, and they also have elephant options without the howda I may try.

[Norm]

I have bought the Warlord Epic in several periods and I am enjoying them. they are a big seller for the company, so I think support will remain good.

Some gamers get a bit wound up about these being a ‘new size’ - they are not! They are just like old 15’s i.e. small end of 15mm and there has always been and always will be compatibility issues between manufacturers in the same scale regardless of whether that is 6mm, 15mm the new 18mm which is the old 15mm apparently) and 25 - 28 - 32mm!

Where they are incompatible is the general look i.e. their close order infantry are generally tightly formed shoulder to shoulder and that is a difficult look to get with individual sculpts from any manufacturer.

You can get a little bit imaginative with some of the bases if you want. Have a look at this blokes ‘take’ on Hannibal Epic.

LINK

https://youtu.be/JTA9yWCD5R0?si=F3XbjBZcxoQ85YoQ

Your best bet is to order a single sprue from e-bay or some such and judge for yourself.

I have some info on the ACW range concerning basing, which may interest you, here is a link

https://commanders.simdif.com/american_civil_war.html

If you can get Warlord Games local, then that is another positive.

[Waffles_vs_Tacos]

Norm,

I like a lot of Scotty's basing suggestions, though I am not brave enough to cut the sprue myself.

I will probably still base the romans on 60x20mm for the infantry, but I want to do the Lybian Infantry 4 deep since they are a phalanx, on a 60x45mm bases, and do my cavalry on 90x55 for a small and 2x 90x55 for 180mm frontage for cavalry, and 60x40mm or 60x45mm for Light infantry and skirmishers.

I can also do warbands on 60x45 so I don't need to do 6 bases, just 3 with the same amount of strips.

[Norm]

Yes, I think the deeper bases are the way to go, both for infantry and horse and certainly the phalanx look is important. Warlord Games seem to have locked themselves in to that 20mm depth for infantry, over several releases. I am currently ‘experimenting’ with 60mm x deep bases.

[Waffles_vs_Tacos]

Only the Roman legionary i am not sure how to base differently than the 60x20 because of the Oreo models.