3 Warriors ..... 3 Standards

[Conquistador]

 

At least you guys can paint!   

I hesitate to use that term to describe my attempts.  

Those are very nicely painted and I look forward to your future success at this.  

Although I am a GW "critic"  99% of the time I also think you were wise to change the GD title (until one win one which just seems to be a matter of time.)   

Gracias,

Glenn

[Mrdee]

@ Alxbates

I am working on it mate, I will PM you once it is set in place.

@ P_Clapham

Thanks, I have started to put models on CMoN, my urban legend Sophie and the Forgeworld Ogre (on ebay) and I agree it does generate alot of interest, had an extra 1000 views on ebay in the three days I put a link on CMoN and it will be something I definately pursue.  Golden Demon Standard I will definately not be using now having taken on board what has already been said by others in this thread and I suppose it could be construed as a form of misrepresentation no matter how close I may have come this year.  The only reason I painted that standard on the rank and file model was to give a comparison of techniques available for each of the three categories on the same (or nearly the same) model so it is purely a painting comparison and there would be influence from a decent sculpted model, there was also an element of a personal challenge as to whether or not I could actually paint to a extremely high level on such a poor model, personally I am happy with the result, no surprised in fact.

@ Gluteus Maximus

Luckily I do Krav Maga for just such instances where people try to cut my hands off!  I am actually surprised how much people are liking the economy model, I had the same feeling of guilt painting that as I do if I eat a cake or chocolate, I guess I am a bit of a painting snob.  Sorry I meant to take the good photos last night but I got sidetracked with Kettlebells, cooking and started painting the rider from my Khornate Chaos Dragon.  I will try and get some nice ones done tonight after Krav Maga.

@ Conquistador

Thanks Glenn, I will keep plugging away until I win one, might even have to come over to the US and try my hand at a few of yours, I am in need of a good holiday.

[Mrdee]

I have given some consideration to a draft pricing scale over lunch and would appreciate some sort of feedback on this guys and gals.

Economy/Tabletop Quality - £1 - £5 per 28mm infantry sized model.

Good/Hero Quality - £15 - £25 per 28mm infantry sized model.

Display Quality £100+ per 28mm infantry sized model.

Obviously it is totally dependant on what everyone wants, any price scale would have to be flexible, for example someone wants a display quality painting but does not require any freehand the price would reduce accordingly.

So is any of it too cheap/expensive/just right ?

[Heldrak]

I have given some consideration to a draft pricing scale over lunch and would appreciate some sort of feedback on this guys and gals.

Economy/Tabletop Quality - £1 - £5 per 28mm infantry sized model.

Good/Hero Quality - £15 - £25 per 28mm infantry sized model.

Display Quality £100+ per 28mm infantry sized model.

Obviously it is totally dependant on what everyone wants, any price scale would have to be flexible, for example someone wants a display quality painting but does not require any freehand the price would reduce accordingly.

So is any of it too cheap/expensive/just right ?

I think that your cheap range is too cheap and your expensive range is too expensive...

I think the question that you need to ask yourself is who most of your customers will be and what will they want? You're probably going to do a great deal more commission painting for units/armies than you are for individual display pieces. My instinct would be:

Tabletop: $5.00 USD/3.00 GBP per single figure, with "unit discounts" for multiples of 5-10.

Front-Rank: $10.00 USD/6.00 GBP per single figure, with "unit discounts" for multiples of 5-10.

Character: $50.00 USD/30.00 GBP per single figure.

Unless your name is Jennifer Haley and you've got a stack of awards statuettes, I think that you're going to price yourself out of the market at 100.00 GBP for a single character figure.

Just one man's opinion...

[Major_Gilbear]

[...] what I do find hard is painting stuff for myself at below my very best as I try to strive for perfection only that way can I improve, when I say the economy/rank and file standard took me 15-20mins I lied, there was a good hour before hand where I was sat staring at the model trying to make myself paint to that standard, someone pays me I will do whatever sort of like a painting whore. [...]

I smiled when I read this, because I know exactly how you feel.

The one time I did some commission work, I did so to a standard that I would never have been happy with for myself (simple base colours with a few limited ink washes), but my customer was so pleased with them that he upped the amount he paid me voluntarily!

That said, I think all three Chaos Warriors you posted looked good to me.

I think in terms of prices, that you might do well to look at people like Jakob Rune Nielsen, Jennifer Haley and Marike Reimer; this is what multiple GD and Slayer-Sword winners charge for their very best efforts on single figures.

I also think you need to think about what you would expect to pay if somebody else painted for you. If a plastic regiment of 20 Chaos Warriors was just painted and based, Would £20 seem like a lot? How about £40? Or £60? And would you do all the prep-work and assembly yourself, or would you be happy to paint what others may have (perhaps badly) assembled?

Also, what you feel happiest painting? What's easiest for you? If you like painting to your #2 level for example, then price that competitively compared to the other two levels (For example, #1 = £4, #2 = £7, #3 = £30... it is clear that the best the best 'value' for the level is probably the middle at £7 per fig).

Your suggest pricing levels a bit too wide in their scope at the moment I think. £1 is a steal, but £5 is high for level #1. £15 is okay, but £25 is very high for #2. £100 for #3 is pretty high when I consider that Slayer-Sword and multiple GD winner Jakob will do a figure for £150.

Finally, I'd suggest that you consider what the terminology is. I'd rather buy "Troop" than "Economy" quality for example!

[Mrdee]

Cheers guys maybe I over value my time a little too much.

Perhaps a much lower price scale in the beginning might be a good idea until I get a "name" end of the day I am a nobody at the moment

How does this rate?


Tabletop/Troop Quality - £3-£5 a model (discounts on multiples)

Command Squads/Heros Quality - £15-20 a model (discounts on multiples)

Lords/Display Quality - £50 a model

[Red Orc]

The trouble is, I don't think you are over-valuing your time. An hour's painting should net you £6 at minimum wage. So if you can paint two Chaos Warriors to 'Troop Standard' in that time, or half a 'Front Rank' model, then your base rates should be (about) £3 for a 'Troop' and £12 for 'Front Rank'l. These are the minimum rates you should be charging. That's pretty much a given I'd say.

[Dr.Falkenhayn]

sounds pretty fair to me.Just keep in Mind that Commission Painting is not only about Painting.Its about Assembling and Basing too.Some Clients maybe want their Bases blank etc.So you have to descripe very clear whats within the Price and whats not.
Maybe you should  specialize yr Business on just a Few Eras,prefferably Stuff you would like to paint  

[P_Clapham]

My friend Navin may still be looking for freelancers.  Here's the company website.  Very cool guy, lures workers away from their sweatshop employers to paint wargaming figures.

http://www.paintedfigs.com/index.html

[Major_Gilbear]

Well, there are lots of things to consider when you open yourself up for commissions, including figure assembly and cleanup.

I think the best way to do this is perhaps to have two schedules of rates. One set of three rates that reflects bulk painting (like regiments/units) and one set of rates that reflects single models.

So maybe:

Army Rates
(Units of 10+ models, or cavalry/monster units of 5+ models)

Regiment Quality = £2-3 per figure, simple basing.
Specialist Unit Quality = £4-5 per figure, simple basing.
Elite Units / Command Rank Quality = £7-8 per figure, simple basing with some extra details.

Single Rates
(Single models of any type, units of up to 5 models)

Troop Quality = £4 per figure, simple basing.
Character Quality = £15 per figure, reasonably detailed basing.
Display Quality = £25+ per figure, charge extra for specific details like a complicated base, extensive freehand, extensive NMM, etc. The main goal of this level is to produce a nicely shaded and highlighted model, with anything that adds a significant amount of time as a chargeable extra that you agree with each client.

So if I wanted to play with a Display Quality Infinity starter box of six models on some resin tech-bases that I supply, it would cost me £150. If I wanted all the metals to be NMM, and for there to be more OSL than just the helmet lenses, you might decide on an extra £5 per figure, so it'd cost me £180. That would be akin to your #3 Warrior, but without all the freehand or the base work.

On the other hand, if I wanted a Chaos Warrior regiment painted, I might opt for 15 models at your Regiment Quality, and the front/command rank of 5 models at Command Rank Quality. That would cost me £65-£85 for the regiment of 20 models.

Those sorts of costs feel about right to me, and demand will determine whether you charge more or not. The idea is also that the repeat work in doing a unit does cut down a bit on time per model at the lower paint levels, which makes units a bit more affordable. It also means that a painting commission is more likely to be worth you time to take on - I mean, would you prefer do a 20-model unit at £70 or three single figures at £5 each?

I would also suggest that you include simple cleanup and assembly for free, but perhaps charge a small fee for anything over doing say 20 models in one go or for the more multipart plastic models (because there are more mouldlines to remove). I would probably ask for pictures if a client wants to send you a prepped commission though, so you know what you're letting yourself in for.

If you want to see what the lower/cheaper end of the existing commission-painting scale looks like, check out Blue Table Painting. Their most basic level is hardly worth the bother of the commission, and their prices reflect this. Their high-level is still quite cheap, but hardly display standard (models in their gallery still have mould lines on them!). They do well and get a lot of custom though because they pitch at the lower end of the market who just want models painted and aren't too fussed otherwise. I see many folks from pre-paint models backgrounds who get into skirmish wargames games for example, and are happy with the price/service that BTP provides.

The other end of the 'bulk' scale might be someone like 3 Colours Based. They also offer basic paint jobs, but they neatly paint them (rather than dry brushing and washing) and base them. This means that they cost a bit more, but are still affordable. What I like about them over BTP, is that it is a good way to get the leg work done on a unit and you can just go back and do the detailing yourself at your leisure if you wish. I think many folks would like to paint their own stuff, but the volume is daunting - a neat basic paint job lets you get playing and still have the opportunity to come back to the unit later if you want.

Anyway, enough rambling now!

[Orctrader]

Going through the post and I'm not sure why you are doing this.  Is it a full-time job, part-time to supplement your main income or just something to earn a bit extra?

The answer influences your prices.  For example, if full-time when working out costs for your time, how about all of the small business things like going to/from the post office.  Answering emails, phone calls, etc.  Are you giving all of that time for free?

Another thing I’d consider is just sell some figures on Ebay to begin with.  That will give you a feel for the Market Price of your figures.

Better to start your rates “high” because if you start low then it will be difficult to raise them later.

And bear in mind – though I’m sure you already know this – there are a lot of people trying this, and crowded market places usually drive prices down.

[Sangennaru]

An hour's painting should net you £6 at minimum wage.

i think that's the main point.

you are not trying to survive only with your painting, and i guess that you will have a job to do, so not so much time.
i think you shoulld evaluate your time as you think is fair, and then wait to see the reaction to the customers.
maybe you'll work less than a cheaper whore, and probably the GD winner will have more work than you.
but that's your time, working for other people is not as relaxing than working for yourself.
i know it, even if i'm 20 i try to evaluate my time. i have to study and to do many other thinks, so when i sculpt for commissions i always think about my time, before thinking about the fair price.
that's the problem of the hobby-work!

[Mrdee]

As promised better pictures