Warlord (Pro-gloria) plastic Landsknechte

[Captain Blood]

Sod it I'll skip these. This forum has become a great way to never want to wargame

Sorry you don't like it. You haven't been here very long. If you find visiting this forum counter-productive, well, you don't have to come here.

Can we please keep on topic from here on? There's a long history to these figures and so feelings on the matter run high. But if people can't deal with their differences civilly and constructively then it's time to close the thread. I'd prefer not to have to though, as I'm sure there will be other thoughts on these figures once people actually see them for real 

[tomrommel1]

please, Richard don't close it!

[The Red Graf]

I am friends with Michael Anderson, the sculptor, on Facebook. At the time the three ups were being made I was also following the Pro Gloria page and I think I was friends with the owner (not sure about that one). In any case, the point is that I saw the wip pictures of the original three ups and more importantly I was privy to the Facebook discussions that arose over the sculpts. I remember several times objections were raised to his use of various pieces of clothing and equipment. In every case, Michael was able to provide historical justification for his choices and once he had lade out his case the arguments usually ended. I have had occasion to work with several sculptors and observed many more and it's my opinion that if you want historical accuracy in late period European armor he is the go to guy.

Of course, all that being said, you can't stop grognards from arguing and I doubt this post will make a dent, but there's my two cents.

I think that if we could have had the whole kit there would have been much less to argue about because the options would have allowed you tailor your troops exactly to your liking. 

[Condottiere]

I am friends with Michael Anderson, the sculptor, on Facebook. At the time the three ups were being made I was also following the Pro Gloria page and I think I was friends with the owner (not sure about that one). In any case, the point is that I saw the wip pictures of the original three ups and more importantly I was privy to the Facebook discussions that arose over the sculpts. I remember several times objections were raised to his use of various pieces of clothing and equipment. In every case, Michael was able to provide historical justification for his choices and once he had lade out his case the arguments usually ended. I have had occasion to work with several sculptors and observed many more and it's my opinion that if you want historical accuracy in late period European armor he is the go to guy.

Of course, all that being said, you can't stop grognards from arguing and I doubt this post will make a dent, but there's my two cents.

I think that if we could have had the whole kit there would have been much less to argue about because the options would have allowed you tailor your troops exactly to your liking. 

This kit's versatility could've been increased had the torsos and legs been available separately. Exactly what period are these landsknechts for? Based on the metals, Pro Gloria covers the 1520/30+ period, with a few figures in pluderhosen. It's easy to say that Michael Anderson provided "historical justification for his choices," but what were his sources? There are some odd choices in clothing and there are some dodgy 18th/19th Century depictions of troops in a mishmash of various styles in addition to garish coloring.  IIRC, Pro Gloria was going to include an assembly sheet with each box, with instructions on putting together period appropriate landsknechts, but I don't think these could be used for pre-1520s and even if possible, the average customer would want to use all of the figures in the box.   

[Condottiere]

Lol... I didn't even see that bit.

The St. George Cross was the badge of the Swabian League, so a landsknecht might have a red patch on his shoulder, doublet or hose and a red St. Andrew Cross patch on his shoulder, doublet, or hose or just slashed onto clothing, but never on the same area, probably to avoid confusion.   

Yes, in 3-up it definitely looks like fabric. On the actual plastic figure it looks like it is supposed to be a padded leather doublet (painting the codpiece the same as the doublet certainly doesn't make it look like that though).

It's a mess...

The middle guy might be wearing leather and possibly the guy on the left, but it's a strange choice, as his shirt is exposed, negating the benefit of wearing a jerkin.

[moonshado]

Am I being dense and missing something? In Condottiere's post he discuss an image of three  of the 3-ups. But as far as I can see from the pictures released on Warlord's website none of these figures are actually included in the plastic boxed set that are being sold. The painted examples shown on Warlord's website clearly show 5 of the 6 bodies on a frame and none of them look like the 3-ups being discussed, which is a pity as they were rather nice 3-ups.
I've ordered myself a box. Hope to get some decent figures out of it but at the very least I visualise the Katzbalgers, daggers, pouches, some of the a heads and arms will be usable with those rather nice Tudor dollies that Stuart Mulligan has made. At the very least the pouches and daggers will be joining some of the Perry late Medieval plastics

[white knight]

those rather nice Tudor dollies that Stuart Mulligan has made.

Linky?

[moonshado]

@ White Knight. They  are mentioned in http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=78140.435. He was doing a limited run in June. As of this afternoon he still had some sets left as I managed to purchase to sets. More details are on Stuart's blog - Army Royal (http://stuartsworkbench.blogspot.co.uk/) start reading from 1st May 2017.

[traveller]

@ White Knight. They  are mentioned in http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=78140.435. He was doing a limited run in June. As of this afternoon he still had some sets left as I managed to purchase to sets. More details are on Stuart's blog - Army Royal (http://stuartsworkbench.blogspot.co.uk/) start reading from 1st May 2017.

Those dollies are just great! I bought three sets snd have populated them with Perry and GW arms and heads. Highly recommended!

[Condottiere]

Those dollies are just great! I bought three sets snd have populated them with Perry and GW arms and heads. Highly recommended!

I keep meaning to order some, but something else grabs my attention...

With a slight bit of tweaking, this would make great Italians, especially since they're the ones who started this style...

The plastic Empire archers are wearing the same style of coats and jackets - much better than the State Troops. Perry heads and arms I get, but wouldn't GW ones be slightly oversized for the dollies - the long arms making the figure look like gorilla? 

[Condottiere]

Am I being dense and missing something? In Condottiere's post he discuss an image of three  of the 3-ups. But as far as I can see from the pictures released on Warlord's website none of these figures are actually included in the plastic boxed set that are being sold. The painted examples shown on Warlord's website clearly show 5 of the 6 bodies on a frame and none of them look like the 3-ups being discussed, which is a pity as they were rather nice 3-ups.
I've ordered myself a box. Hope to get some decent figures out of it but at the very least I visualise the Katzbalgers, daggers, pouches, some of the a heads and arms will be usable with those rather nice Tudor dollies that Stuart Mulligan has made. At the very least the pouches and daggers will be joining some of the Perry late Medieval plastics

I chose this pic and the one in a prior to show which arms are supposed to go with the leather jerkins - Warlord included these arms, but no leather doublets.

For those who had pledged, did these figures have separate torsos and legs? Based on the 3 ups, the tops don't gel with the bottoms, factoring into account landsknecht fashion. On the Pro Gloria Facebook page, the dollies had separate torsos and legs...

[traveller]

I chose this pic and the one in a prior to show which arms are supposed to go with the leather jerkins - Warlord included these arms, but no leather doublets.

For those who had pledged, did these figures have separate torsos and legs? Based on the 3 ups, the tops don't gel with the bottoms, factoring into account landsknecht fashion. On the Pro Gloria Facebook page, the dollies had separate torsos and legs...

I use both Perry and GW Empire. The latter are bigger but look quite ok. If Photobucket hadnt stopped I could have shared some photos 

[Condottiere]

I use both Perry and GW Empire. The latter are bigger but look quite ok. If Photobucket hadnt stopped I could have shared some photos 

How about Imugr or Flickr?

Oli did some Perry plastics with GW Empire crossbow arms as Gascon or early 16th Century crossbowmen and while they look great, part of me thinks the arms are bit long on the human side - maybe it's the slashed and puffy clothing.

[The Red Graf]

For those who had pledged, did these figures have separate torsos and legs? Based on the 3 ups, the tops don't gel with the bottoms, factoring into account landsknecht fashion. On the Pro Gloria Facebook page, the dollies had separate torsos and legs...

I just went back and checked and apparently they did not. There are no pictures of the sprues, and no pictures indicating that torsos and legs were separate. Here is the blurb which indicates they were all one part.

"What is in the Plastic Box?
In this box will be 24 hard plastic 28mm (1/56) miniatures that come with a leaflet (approximately 16-18 pages full with historical background, assembling tips, painting shemes etc) and a single sheet with six different flags."


The box will hold 4 frames in total. Two core Landsknecht frames plus two extra command frames.
The core frame will contain 10 different bodies plus 20 different heads as well as enough arms to have yours  Landsknechts in advancing and marching poses with weapon options for halberds, spears and pikes. The frame will also hold extra swords, pouches and other nice extras.
The command frame will include 2 bodies plus a huge selection of extra heads, enough parts for musicians and banner bearers.

[The Red Graf]

Here are some shots I don't think have been posted.

Drummer


Poleaxe