Gŵr y Gogledd (Men of the North)

[Derek H]

I’ve just finished off this Gŵr y Gogledd (Men of the North) force for Dux Britanniarum from TooFatLardies.



Blog posting at http://dereksweetoys.com/2014/10/gwr-y-gogleddthe-cavalry-options/ As usual with me , the painting is decent wargames standard rather than anything really good, but I really do like the overall look of the force.  Not many of the Chi-Rhos you find in so many Arthurian forces, but lots of white shields.

Men went to Catraeth with the dawn.
Their bravery cut short their lives.
They drank yellow mead, sweet, ensnaring,
For the space of a year the minstrel was merry.
Red their swords, let them not be cleansed;
Their shields were white, their spearheads four-edged,
Before the retinue of Mynyddog Mwynfawr

The Gododdin

[Gibby]

Very nice

[Jeff965]

Lovely little force and nice background.

[olyreed]

Great work

[WillieB]

Great looking warband!

[emosbur]

Very nice, Derek!!



Emilio.

[Derek H]

That should be Gwŷr y Gogledd,
Gwŷr = Men
Gŵr = Man

I messed up when working out how to use accented letters in html. 

[Cubs]

What dictionary are you using?! It may be slightly different up in North Wales (where cutlery is optional), but down here -

Dyn = man, dynion = men.

Gŵr = husband, gŵyr = husbands.

I'm not judging of course, and it's all legal now, but that might give a slightly different slant on your force.

[Little Odo]

Great army - I really like the basing on the cavalry and that flag is sumptuous

[twrchtrwyth]

Very nice.

What dictionary are you using?! It may be slightly different up in North Wales (where cutlery is optional), but down here -

Dyn = man, dynion = men.

Gŵr = husband, gŵyr = husbands.

I'm not judging of course, and it's all legal now, but that might give a slightly different slant on your force.

Gwyr is correct. As in milwyr.

[Derek H]

I'm no expert in things Welsh, but you can find the Men of the North translated as Gwŷr y Gogledd  in all sorts of historical texts.  http://amzn.to/1z9igef  for example   A Google search gives lots of pages with information on the Men of the North.

It seems to be the term used by the early medieval Welsh, perhaps modern usage is different.  

[Cubs]

Yeah, you are right, my mistake.

[Derek H]

I've done a lot of looking around the internet and read a few books and have come to the conclusion that what has become the accepted look for an Arthurian British wargames army is not really backed up by an awful lot of historical evidence.

The source for all the hundreds of Chi-Rho shield designs you see in wargames armies seems to be a single plate in an Osprey book, the Warhammer Ancient Battles Age of Arthur supplement and Little Big Men Studios. You can find evidence of Chi-Rhos as Late Roman shield designs and people seem to have just extrapolated from there to the British after the Roman withdrawal. Nobody even seems to know when the cross replaces the chi-rho (or the fish) as a symbol of Christianity.

I'm not saying that the conventional interpretation is "wrong", just that other interpretations are probably  just as valid.  My own for instance 

Most wargames armies for the Northern British tend to use figures without trousers, but I reckon anyone living in what is now Southern Scotland would want to wear the things if they could and those figures do have the overall look I was after.

The evidence for white shields come from the Gododdin, though a friend has pointed out that they could have been talking about white shields with Chi-Rhos on them, just seen from a distance. I was going to make some transfers for myself and put small Chi-Rhos, crosses, and alphas and omegas on the shields I've got, but decided I like them fine just the way they are.

[charla51]

You're right about the lack of historical evidence. Note that the so-called historical references to Arthur do not mention him or his men as mounted; although you might want to extrapolate that from Y Gododdin, which may, or may not, have a greater, or lesser, historical basis.

Shield design is a case in point. The reference to Arthur carrying an image of Our Lady (Virgin Mary) on his shield at one battle is anachronistic. At the time of the battle (supposed late 5th/early 6th century) the cult of Mary had hardly gained any following in the Holy Land, let alone the fringes of Western Europe.

Just go with what looks good for you, and that army looks good.

[Cubs]

At the time of the battle (supposed late 5th/early 6th century) the cult of Mary had hardly gained any following in the Holy Land, let alone the fringes of Western Europe.

The Emperor Constantine adopted Christianity back in the early 4th century and it thus travelled all over the Roman world quite rapidly with imperial support. Anywhere that was part of the Roman empire (or that had been) would most certainly have felt a heavy Christian influence by Arthurian times (whatever they were, there is one argument that places him as a Roman at the end of the 4th century).

Not to say he was Christian, or that he displayed Christian iconography, just that it was most certainly a strong contender.