The end and new beginnings of Dredd

[Ulfhednar]

That's probably the only real option as proxies aren't working, converting & using that green stuff to sculpt your own East Meg pads, boots and judge badges (that are simple shapes), and helmets and guns are available off the Foundry Soviet Judge.

And you could cobble a Meg1 heavy weapons judge from the Foundry Tech Judge Deex figure, that has 2 pads and no eagle (just like the Warlord Judge with lazooka was so he could shoulder the weapon), a clean cut on the head and arms in the right place to be holding a big gun.

I bet a kickstarter for just a small range of East Meg judges, a few Soviet female & specialist judges (like medic & tech), and a box set of fully cast or kits with separate arms and weapons etc so you can have several boxes and still have variance, to match the scale and style of the Warlord East Meg Judges, would do brilliantly. KSing individual sets would work now the big kickstart created a population invested but possibly unable to achieve what they wanted. The whole range just needs a bit more here and there, if it was just that stuff that is missing from this range I think it would do really well.

[Ulfhednar]

Those conversions are fantastic, and painted perfectly too, real correct character. Do Reaper Miniatures scale well to Warlord Dredd? They have some great figures but I passed them by as they're described as 25mm heroic and Warlord Dredd seems like 28mm heroic, even 28mm true (like Konflikt 47 and even Mongoose's KS Rogue Trooper Norts & Southers) seem a bit small for it. Would Reaper work with Warlord Dredd?

[Dr.Falkenhayn]

Nice work Doctor! Are those Prodos Miniatures Dredd figs? I can't seem to find them!

What's the source mini for those conversions? I recognise the Chronoscope base for Dredd.

Good likenesses, well executed.

Yes,they are Reaper Chronoscope Minis (Metal) with Head Swaps. Corrupt Judge with Shield is from Victory Force (Red Reddan Range) Ma-Ma is from RAFM ModernX or whatever the Range is called 
the Reaper Marine is a very versatile Model 

Those conversions are fantastic, and painted perfectly too, real correct character. Do Reaper Miniatures scale well to Warlord Dredd? They have some great figures but I passed them by as they're described as 25mm heroic and Warlord Dredd seems like 28mm heroic, even 28mm true (like Konflikt 47 and even Mongoose's KS Rogue Trooper Norts & Southers) seem a bit small for it. Would Reaper work with Warlord Dredd?

Cheers Mate  Yes Reaper Chronoscope match well Sizewise with Mongoose/Warlord JD. I've also used some Superfigs to bolster my East Meg Army


there's also a Tank in the Dystopian Legions Range (Spartan Games) that looks like a Rad Sweeper 

[Vanvlak]

Small heads up - Wayland still have a dwindling number of models (not at half price of course, but with 20% off in most cases.

There are some on Amazon too - but as these are from a variety of sellers the prices are outrageous!

[Ulfhednar]

And Element Games have 1 Spikes Harvey Rotten on lawmaster for £9 (but then there's the shipping).

It looks like all the stock is out there now and I still failed to get Street Judges with hvy weapons (lazooka and stub gun). Someone must have an army of only them. Though I did pick up some odd things including Judge Koburn's Grav Bike, that has no rider (but looks an easy conversion from a spare tech judge rider I have) that was apparently never released and I can find no pictures of on the net at all. I don't think it's even mentioned in the kickstarters (though I guess it must be from that). And I saw go by (but unfortunately missed getting) a Cal-Hab Judge on Iron Horse Lawmaster. I wonder what else was on the verge of happening before the licence ran out?

[n815e]

How much money did Matt put into having models sculpted and then not releasing them for retail?

[Ulfhednar]

It's this that makes me think it was more a project to create a range of figures they personally wanted, and with that achieved the project has served it's purpose and so they passed on (declined renewing rather than gave to someone else) the licence. It may have been necessary because it wasn't cutting it financially, but then I think you could argue some of that is because they made it too enthusiast comic and not wargaming enough. Judda instead of an East Meg equivalent to Citi-Def, or a proper zombie horde and cultist horde (that people from other games might also want) is baffling. For whatever reason they definitely seem to have made personal enthusiast rather than commercial choices in the prioritising of the figure range. There's a really decent force available for Meg1, and over powered too with them being judges, it's impossible within the range available to wargame against them. But then I guess that's what fitted into the Dredd miniatures game (which isn't wargaming). And I'm not criticising just observing, if it was only way some of this could exist at all then it was probably worth doing it like this, just seems a shame as I think aspects of it had much more potential and it was just a few additions away from the whole thing becoming much more.

edit - I imagine some people here know but as a non kickstarter on the sidelines it's hard to know what was available for retail. Some may have been via pre-order or only for very short periods retail, or not at all. Although I think they may have been listed with the product picture for a time on Warlord's site before the fire sale started, I don't remember ever seeing the ABC Warriors, Robo-Doc, Citi-Def Reinforcements, Oz Judge on Trike, Car or Manta tank etc actually available to buy (though citi-def reinforcements and Robo-Doc suddenly came into stock for about 1 hour one day late October, well into the sale already starting and sold out half price very fast).

There's another East Meg judge (without helmet & in cloak), an Accountant Judge, the Meg 2 Judge (I think came with the car), and a female judge with 2 lawgivers I've not seen retailed either. And it looks like you can add the Rogue Trooper figures to that, they have Nort snipers (pack of 6 + a black dome sniper) for sale on ebay too (Altsain).

edit again - also if you're after figures to play Nu-Earth, Pulp figures zepplin soldiers might work, have gloves & non laced boots like in chem suits, gas masks and it seems air canisters like the Norts, and cool German para helmets, if they're in scale (kickstarter Rogue seems to be true 28mm rather than heroic) and you can do something with their guns (and tiny bit of back of head may be exposed as gask mask with helment rather than hood, could putty the texture out).

[mcfonz]

Ulfy - whilst it may be nice to have a conclusion, a synopsis of why. But really - as others have already said, you only need look at Mongooses' prior miniature based projects and the way they went. Starship Troopers etc. The only difference I can see is the Kickstarter.

[Ulfhednar]

:-) Yes I've accepted now the range is definitely going OOP and that's almost certainly it. And I know this happens all the time with gaming range products & licences, and maybe in particular with Mongoose, but I don't think it needed to with this, Dredd is properly viable done right. Apocalypse War, Block War, zombie or cultist hordes, cursed earth raids / clearances etc. It's wargaming not roleplaying that sells miniatures in volume, they didn't go there with this when they so obviously could have, when they were already half way there anyway having made a decent Meg1 force. Eg a Soviet tech & med judge, an East Meg cit-def / militia (or if they don't exist more Soviet Judges), 10 or so figures could have massively opened things up. Maybe one day some one will do it and make it make sense for wargaming.

[Major_Gilbear]

The only difference I can see is the Kickstarter.

Specifically that the KS allowed a much bigger range to be sculpted than would otherwise be the case.

And to be fair to Mongoose; at least it looks like they are going to deliver all (or nearly all) the models that backers were supposed to get... I mean, they could have passed on renewing the licence sooner, and just left everyone with outstanding pledges with little more than a feeble apology - but they haven't.

[Ulfhednar]

Yes I'm not criticising Mongoose to a serious degree I'm glad they did the range in the first place, and not that I know but I only hear good things about them being straight. It's just frustrating that a few more figure variants would have massively improved the options of the range for wargaming, and the few figures that are in the range that are essential for wargaming, like the Judges with hvy weapons that are simply impossible to find, (and East Meg reinforcements with an anti-armour hvy weapon that I finally got in a bundle off a private seller but otherwise would be just as impossible to get) it seems have been out of stock a long time before the range went OOP, leaving people really short. It was a shock that Warlords birthday celebration sale turned out to really be the end of licence and the range going OOP, there was no way of catching up once it became clear what was happening. That's a different issue though than the apparently really good stuff (like Brit Lawmaster, Grav Bike, maybe Trike & ABC's etc) that it seems won't get to retail. I'm amazed it wasn't in their interests to negotiate a short extension to the licence in order to sell that stuff for a couple of months, it was moulded after all, I hope that means they intend to sell it on and it will appear one day.

[twrchtrwyth]

Ulfhednar have you seen these? Not unreasonable prices.
http://stores.ebay.co.uk/TheTrollTrader/Judge-Dredd-/_i.html?_fsub=8386390014

[Vanvlak]

Element Games still have some stock too, including JD and Walter, street judges, the tech and medic judges and an assortment of others - not the heavy weapons, I'm afraid.

[Ulfhednar]

Ulfhednar have you seen these? Not unreasonable prices.
http://stores.ebay.co.uk/TheTrollTrader/Judge-Dredd-/_i.html?_fsub=8386390014

Yes thank you, I definitely want a Sabbat (brilliant figure & one for my cultists or zombie queen), didn't buy one as couldn't think how I could use the Scottish guy but then Mongoose (Altsain) put Cursed Earth Desperado's on ebay for £10 (+£2.50 P+P, still has some), and I ended up with the Angel Gang by accident for free, so now I've got a Cursed Earth army and he'll do as a mutant :-P So good spot, and the werewolf too (for my cultists), I can use the Ape with my gangsters.  (Altsain have the werewolf theoretically cheaper but in a bundle with figures I've already got). I think it's worth getting as much of this range as possible cuz it obviously all works together, and I received some today 2nd hand that had already been sprayed black (shows more of the detail at distance) and a built sentanoid & quite well painted mini-bots, first time I've seen them for real as not bare lead unbuilt in boxes and they really are superb figures, they've got the 2000AD character that isn't in anything else (that I think is missing from most of Foundry's versions, that are great figures, maybe anatomically more correct / stronger but mostly with less character & charm). I know people have issues with some of the figures, I agree some could be better, I definitely wish there was a bit more variety & depth in the range in certain areas to open it up more for wargaming, but overall I think it's a real gift to the hobby.

I suspect some people have bought stock (out of Warlord sale etc) and are waiting for things to die down before selling it off on ebay at better prices, though probably won't include hvy weapons Judges as think they've been out of stock a while, but at least they were on retail for a long time before going out of stock then OOP, they'll turn up sooner or later, though I suspect to get those I'll need to buy someones entire Dredd bundle with them in then sell off the rest myself.

Or do some swaps, I bet lots have grabbed what they could just cuz it was disappearing fast and there may be a bit of trading afterwards. That might be good as I'm not sure I'm the right person to be trusted with an apparently rare Grav Bike that will need converting and stuff (cuz I think they meant to do more with it, it has no rider and is quite bare).

edit - re element games, you have to check the coloured light below the listing, dark green is in stock, light green expected into stock, light blue can be ordered. On first day this started and found Warlord already almost totally out of stock, Element had nothing in stock but were showing light blue on lots of things so I put an order in for lots of it. I spoke to them and they said they hoped to be able to still get it in as it should be sitting with the distributors, and it was scheduled to be in stock in 1 week. After 2 weeks of it not showing up I cancelled the order and got what I could elsewhere. A few days later the Harvey Rotten went dark green so had arrived and gone into their stock, everything else I'd ordered but cancelled showed as light green (so it hadn't turned up but they still hoped it might), Then it all went back to light blue. It maybe came into stock, sold immediately and I missed it, or it didn't turn up at all. It can be a problem as they take payment when you place the order not when it's dispatched, but if that's ok it's maybe worth a try but don't rely on it (or anyone else) ordering stuff in.

But thanks for the tip all are welcome :-) I went through Warlords stockists list (put in a Southern postcode SW1 search radius 500 miles to catch Europe), checked every one with a site and apart from the odd thing that's on ebay anyway there's nothing out there. Though it did turn up an original Mongoose Citi-Def command (different to the one in this range), with an officer with a tache, they'll do for Brit-Cit :-) This is a picture of a painted set Mongoose sold off on ebay. It's properly mad when you look at the some of the painted (and unpainted rare / unreleased) stuff they were selling earlier on and the prices it went for, crazy bargains. Though they probably went to kickstarters so fair enough, but I wonder with them being so familiar with the range and distracted at how it might have fallen short in places or been frustrating, they've lost sight of what a really good thing it is.

[Ulfhednar]

Yes Warlord's stock is weird. They show out of stock, then suddenly they get a batch in of an odd thing. Happened to me so that I got a robo-doc and 2 citi-def reinforcement blisters. I wonder if they were still casting up figures to fulfil the kickstart (returns etc) had just a few spare each time. Or maybe they were returns from distributors. They have some of the Ape bikes left which are tempting at £10 each, but then all 4 pro-painted versions went ridiculously cheap on ebay on Saturday for £61 total. If I was going to do Apes on bikes that was my chance, but I missed them as I was watching the pro-painted ABC warriors auction.

Should be clear by tomorrow if there's any more going to come available, if more hasn't been listed on Altsain's ebay sales by tomorrow then Mongoose are almost certainly done and that's probably it. Hopefully though with that heavily discounted stock gone it will then settle down, prices will recover and people will start selling on ebay the extra's they picked up, probably expensively but it would be worth it to get sorted. There's no substitute for a Judge with a lazooka, especially when you have 4 sentanoids in the opposition side.

Done ok though (for a non kickstarter catching up at the end), out of what I want I'm only missing the Judges with lazooka and stub gun, the Oz Judge on trike, and the Cal-Hab judge on Iron Horse (and those last 2 bikes aren't essential, just nice to haves), but picked up a couple of medi-Judge lawmasters with sidecar, tech Judge lawmasters, and that weird grav bike. Now all I need is a Mega City one to put it all in.