The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread

[Momotaro]

I've seen some dates on other LOTR forums that claim license end dates of Dec 2015 for the Hobbit and sometime in 2017 for the other LOTR ranges.  But I always thought they had three licenses - The Hobbit; the LOTR films; and the more generic Tolkein one they used to produce Scouring of the Shire, Shadow and Flame, and other non-flim related stuff.  So who knows.

JDE

The LotR Licence New Line got is through The Saul Zaentz Company, which covers The Hobbit, the main text of LotR and the timeline in Appendix A.

So if IIRC, the Hobbit licence covers the book and movie imagery.  The LotR licence covers the movie imagery, the book, events from the Hobbit and "some other stuff".  No licence for anything from Unfinished Tales or the Silmarillion.  And of course they can make up anything they like.

The Fall of Arnor sourcebook is really thin compared to what's in the expanded history just because of the "some other stuff" limitation.

IIRC, GW claimed at the time they released A Shadow in the East that they told the Tolkien Estate (which holds the entire copyright) that they would call the second named Ringwraith somehting like "Fred the Nazgul" if they weren't allowed to use the name "Khamul the Easterling". 

[OSHIROmodels]

IIRC, GW claimed at the time they released A Shadow in the East that they told the Tolkien Estate (which holds the entire copyright) that they would call the second named Ringwraith somehting like "Fred the Nazgul" if they weren't allowed to use the name "Khamul the Easterling". 

Things like that kind of put all those C+D letters to shame 

cheers

James

[Momotaro]

And, certainly at the current prices/materials, I doubt most of GW's customers will give a flying toss if it's dropped or not. For instance, I liked the plastic eagles (which are generic anyway), but I'm totally unfussed by any of the Hobbit releases, and I've only ever played a game or two LOTR.

Me too, and I am/was a pretty ardent LotR player.  I've bought nothing from The Hobbit apart from the eagles.

Although it has to be said, halving the contents of the boxed sets and going to 5 armybooks a year before the Hobbit line was released pretty much killed LotR for me.  Have picked up a couple of boxes since, but not much  

[eilif]

I may have been a bit off in my estimation of dates.  A rumor posting over at one-ring suggests that the hobbit license runs out next year and the LotR license may last until 2018. 

I've got no intention to chase after the Hobbit stuff. The prices are beyond ridiculous, especially for a game that has a very limited life span.  I'm also seeing a change in style for some of the minis that I'm not fond of.  (Goblins, ugh…)

However, I'm slowly acquiring a few forces of LoTR minis on the second hand market. I like the style and look of the minis (yaay, Perry's!) and I hope to get my group to give it a go sometime next year. We'll probably just use the "Return of the King" rulebook from the late '00s which has force lists from all 3 films and seems to be a very complete ruleset.  That it's available for chump change ($4 shipped from Abe Books) helps too. I hope to end up with at least 4 copies of the rulebook so I can send them home with club members and they can learn the rules on their own.

Anyone with LotR experience know any reason why I shouldn't just use the RotK book if I'm not planning on playing it outside my gaming group?

[von Lucky]

Can't help - as I only play WotR (and enjoy it - it is actually pretty good), along with a Fellowship I am slowly collecting from eBay to paint.

I'd love to get those eagles, but they're AU$85 here, while £30 (~AU$57!) in the UK. This just shows a total lack of caring.

[McMordain]

Anyone with LotR experience know any reason why I shouldn't just use the RotK book if I'm not planning on playing it outside my gaming group?

The Rotk book doesn't have the siege rules section, and of course its missing any figure statline, that come after its release. Other than that its good to go.
There is not much change between the Rotk book and the One rule book. The Hobbit book made more changes and added a few things, mostly for the better.

If the license is ending soon, that could explain the ridiculous prices. Milk the cow till you can...

[eilif]

The Rotk book doesn't have the siege rules section, and of course its missing any figure statline, that come after its release. Other than that its good to go.
There is not much change between the Rotk book and the One rule book. The Hobbit book made more changes and added a few things, mostly for the better.

If the license is ending soon, that could explain the ridiculous prices. Milk the cow till you can...

That's good to know, Thanks!

I don't think I'll have much use for Siege rules as our club prefers to play smaller games, but it's good to know what I'd be missing.

I think you're right about the license.  GW has a license that is ending soon and hasn't been nearly as popular as they would have hoped. They seem to have completely turned to the collector market and collector prices to make it their money.

[Momotaro]

McMordain has the biggy, the siege rules, but there were other rules changes as well.  The "Alone on the Battlefield" courage rule was dropped after this edition, as it was too much of a pain to remember to apply the rule!  Broadly, the changes after RotK were small though.

If there's one thing you may miss, it's a little diversity in some of the armies.  If you want to play "historical" forces, then Moria Goblins have a single warrior stat line and a captain, plus a Cave Troll for backup.  Oh, and a Balrog  .  No wolves, spiders or bats or drums, no goblin kings or shamen.  Easterlings have a captain and a warrior!

It's not necessarily a bad thing though  - power creep did happen with the game's stat lines, but it came after the RotK book.  Easy enough to make up, for example, armoured horsemen like Easterlings and Dol Amroth.  It's actually scary to remember how early in the game's development the films were!

If you do want later stat lines, drop me a PM - I have all the free summary sheets that GW made available for the supplements before the army books were published in 2012.

[Streetline]

Anyone with LotR experience know any reason why I shouldn't just use the RotK book if I'm not planning on playing it outside my gaming group?

The Hobbit book/booklet expands both what monsters and heroes can do, tweaks shooting while moving and through cover, and gives rules for each type of hand weapon.  All of which improves the game if you ask me, but to start with you won't miss it.

JDE

[Zoggin-eck]

That should get some debating going.
 

Nope. Totally wrong on one (lotr) account, and a couple of decades out of date (40k WHFB 2nd ed. spinoff) on the other!

[Tactalvanic]

Nope. Totally wrong on one (lotr) account, and a couple of decades out of date (40k WHFB 2nd ed. spinoff) on the other!

I can dream - early dementia, etc etc. I have plenty of excuses I can make up and I will stick with them 

Main thing is I have been educated by those in the know of the current and recent past, situation, rather than the distant past situation that I have/had more understanding of...

[Momotaro]

The Hobbit Five Armies supplement is free on Black Library:

http://www.blacklibrary.com/Downloads/Product/PDF/rules/HOBBIT_III_BoTFA_UK.pdf

Honestly nothing special - two hero-heavy scenarios, bunch of stats.  Smaug is the highest-point model in the game by miles, basically an army by himself.

Couple of very powerful orcs, as you'd expect.  No Dain, dwarves of the Iron Hills or ram riders.

Definitely going out with a whimper.  Bit sad really.

[Tactalvanic]

So as with the lotr, so with the hobbit part of the franchise, GW proceed with abandoment of the product line, effectively before the last movie actually hits the cinemas.

Shame as usual. I guess that means they will stop producing those mini ranges shortly, not that I could afford that much for a few hobbits - they will all end up OOP and mass available via e-bay.

I even got tempted to look at http://www.mithril.ie/Default.asp just to remind me of what they used to do, and still actually do.

on some up GW news sisters of sigmar and weapon allocation added to the mordheim comp game. Hold off from buying it yet but it does seem to be getting better all the time. Possessed up next and hopefully some sort of carry over system of damage and Xp.

Starting to sound more and more tempting, nice to see that maybe the developer are doing something good with it.

[Too Bo Coo]

Well, this is for sale...

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Giant-Chaos-daemon-with-over-800-mantic-zombies-and-undead-Bigger-than-a-titan-/331414659209?pt=UK_Toys_Wargames_RL&hash=item4d29da6089

WOW!!!!

[Argonor]

Well, this is for sale...
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Giant-Chaos-daemon-with-over-800-mantic-zombies-and-undead-Bigger-than-a-titan-/331414659209?pt=UK_Toys_Wargames_RL&hash=item4d29da6089
WOW!!!!

That's an awful waste of zombies if you ask me.