Post-Brexit Shipping (EU<->UK): What's the situation for customers and traders?

[Nordic1980s]

In theory Ireland too should count here for mainland Europeans. In practise their logistic routes via England seem to have been at least partially messed up, for I have still to receive a Prince August order from Ireland sent out before last Christmas.

With the Prince August stuff from Ireland finally arriving (4 months), it seems the postal mess from Ireland via UK to continental Europe has been sorted.

[Andrew66]

Just received  this from warlord games  all I can say is ouch!!!!

Hello Warlorders,

As you may have already noticed, we have had to make some changes to the way we handle shipping to your destination recently.

Firstly, I want to give some background as to why we have introduced these changes. We know just how important our products are to our customers. We have been inundated with messages (especially of late during the Covid-19 pandemic) about how the hobby we love had helped with a stress release, meditation, mental health or some other form of therapeutic benefit. This makes us happy beyond words and we are so proud and humbled to provide you some kind of comfort, especially in these challenging times.

This means that we place a lot of emphasis on ensuring our products pass freely across borders as smoothly as possible. Since Jan 1st we have adopted a policy of only selling our products into Europe as DDP (duties paid), meaning that you, our loyal customers, don't pay any additional customs fees when your orders reach you. However, as a result of this, we have unfortunately seen a large spike in costs in shipping to certain areas of the world.

The solution below is our way of ensuring change isn't felt too strongly in any one region, but fundamentally these changes are required to allow us to continue to be profitable in these areas:
EuroZone
Orders to the EU will be subject to a minimum order value of 50 EUR. Orders below this amount will not be able to be processed. A shipping fee of 24 EUR will be applied at checkout on all orders under 150 EUR. Orders of over 150 EUR will offer free courier shipping.

All orders between 50 EUR and 150 EUR will have the option to select a free box of one our best selling plastic sets during the checkout process to help offset the cost of shipping.

[Jagannath]

Man, what a mess.

My deep cut order arrived cost free (though was delayed a few days in Poland abs Germany) so I think whatever deep cut have done (vat registered in UK I think) is working well.

[Coenus Scaldingus]

Just received  this from warlord games  all I can say is ouch!!!!

It's something isn't it!
Admittedly, I had been thinking of not ordering directly from them when they announced they'd switch to UPS for EU deliveries (who are bad at the best of times, and terrible at the worst of times around here), but this seals the deal. Flat-out not accepting smaller orders and strongly incentivizing very large ones (for anything just over €50, the €24 represents too big an increase in costs, but once you're over €100, you might as well add some extra things to cross the €150 threshold). Couldn't care less about a free plastic set to be honest, I can't even remember the last time they released a new plastic kit for their ancients ranges, and I've got all the decade-old Roman and Celtic sprues I'll ever need.

[Fighting15s]

It's something isn't it!
Admittedly, I had been thinking of not ordering directly from them when they announced they'd switch to UPS for EU deliveries (who are bad at the best of times, and terrible at the worst of times around here), but this seals the deal. Flat-out not accepting smaller orders and strongly incentivizing very large ones (for anything just over €50, the €24 represents too big an increase in costs, but once you're over €100, you might as well add some extra things to cross the €150 threshold). Couldn't care less about a free plastic set to be honest, I can't even remember the last time they released a new plastic kit for their ancients ranges, and I've got all the decade-old Roman and Celtic sprues I'll ever need.

Euro 24 for shipping may seem steep, but Belgian customers would pay that to their post office just to collect the VAT, on top of delivery. So for any EU country where the VAT collection fee is high, Warlord’s approach is quite reasonable.

The thing about delivery duty paid services is that they’re expensive. They don’t necessarily save the customer very much: they simply avoid the shock of getting a separate VAT bill and collection fee when the order arrives in their country.

With the first guidance on the EU’s IOSS now available - non-EU businesses can register from 1 April - I can’t honestly say the situation will improve, because the guidance states that an intermediary in the EU is normally needed to take responsibility for the VAT liability. And an intermediary will only be extra expense that may be beyond small businesses.

[Andrew66]

I live in the Republic of Ireland , if I order from a Vat registered company like a gripping beast I pay zero vat plus postage ,then at my end I will pay the vat plus 8€ Processing from An Post  , I can live with that for sure , but 25€ from Warlord is a bit steep , perhaps like some other companies you could be given the option to use a courier which in Ireland would mean a charge of 28€ or the regular postal system which I mentioned is 8€

[Coenus Scaldingus]

Alright, I suppose relatively speaking it is a bargain for our Belgian, Hungarian and Danish friends compared to the incredibly overblown costs their own postal services charge! For smaller orders, this €24 would however easily double the shipping costs here (normally €5-10 from the UK, plus €2.90 handling costs), made worse by the minimum order value (which taken on its own already really irks me).

Given the high handling costs of couriers mentioned earlier in this thread, I do indeed wonder how much of a factor those are within this €24, since WG insists on using courier services exclusively.

If this is simply the new reality that may become the norm over the next year for other companies too, Brexit will certainly shake up the traditionally UK-centric market of wargaming even more than I would have expected. Hopefully Miniaturicum, Battlefield Berlin and other distributors will start carrying more of their ranges; assuming their prices won't be too badly influenced by all this. Warlord Games is presumably one of the larger players in this field, and if this is what they seemingly have to resort to...

[Kitsune]

So, I’m considering an order of some stuff and have found it’s a french company that produce them - one man operation. Should I just avoid buying then, as I don’t wanna get stiffed with a huge unexpected charge?

[Andrew Rae]

So, I’m considering an order of some stuff and have found it’s a french company that produce them - one man operation. Should I just avoid buying then, as I don’t wanna get stiffed with a huge unexpected charge?

Are you in the UK? If you keep the order under £135 you won’t be charged anything after you make the purchase. Royal Mail* no longer collect VAT under that value.

However, as soon as a foreign seller makes an e-commerce sale to a UK consumer, they must register for, collect and pay UK VAT. To not do so is, by HMRC's definition, to commit VAT fraud. But as I said, Royal Mail are not stopping packages valued at less than £135, so they will not collect unpaid VAT from the end consumer as used to be the case. They will collect import VAT, duty and fees from the consumer if the package is over £135.

The new UK VAT system is no longer comparable to the EU system when it comes to imports, so this thread does not apply to UK consumers.

*don’t know how couriers are handling VAT non-compliance.

[Wellington]

My Osprey Men-At-Arms (~13€) mistakenly ordered at Amazon UK came without customs and trouble as a letter to Munich.

[Kitsune]

Are you in the UK? If you keep the order under £135 you won’t be charged anything after you make the purchase. Royal Mail* no longer collect VAT under that value.

However, as soon as a foreign seller makes an e-commerce sale to a UK consumer, they must register for, collect and pay UK VAT. To not do so is, by HMRC's definition, to commit VAT fraud. But as I said, Royal Mail are not stopping packages valued at less than £135, so they will not collect unpaid VAT from the end consumer as used to be the case. They will collect import VAT, duty and fees from the consumer if the package is over £135.

The new UK VAT system is no longer comparable to the EU system when it comes to imports, so this thread does not apply to UK consumers.

*don’t know how couriers are handling VAT non-compliance.

Thanks. I am in the UK, yes. Decided against the purchases in the end as I can’t be bothered with all the “maybe?” elements of purchasing from the EU.

[Wellington]

It seems the ordering for privat customer gets a little bit faster now.

But if you order at German online shops and they have to restock, you have to wait much longer than last year.

[AndrewBeasley]

Are you in the UK? If you keep the order under £135 you won’t be charged anything after you make the purchase. Royal Mail* no longer collect VAT under that value.

I'm interested in what will happen for sales via eBay as regs change throughout this year.  I've just been quoted an £11 VAT and processing fee by eBay for a £25 'buy-it-now' item - at first I thought it was postage but a double check shows postage was on top of this - end up nearly double the cost to order via eBay.

[Duncan McDane]

Let's hope that the people in charge on both sides of the pond understand that a custom free trade zone benefits all of us, especially the not-VAT registered smaller business like so many in our hobby are. Hope's still up voor July but we'll see.
Anyway, so far politics. If the situation stays "as is" it will become much more attractive to hop across the pond once or twice a year to go shopping. And it might be an idea to get adresses or storage room on both sides where our treasures can be held until collected by the owner... Just pondering because we all rather spend our cash on more figs than on tax & duty ( on top of tax & duty ). 

[Leunstoelgeneraalbd]

I noticed that Salute this year is organized on November 14th. So I am now thinking to spend at least one week in London (together with my better half, of course) and spend one day on Salute to pick up previously ordered (and paid for) miniatures. Throw away the packages, put the lot in a shoebox or something and claim you brought them to Britain and tried to sell them unsuccesfully IF some custom officer was VERY curious. Of course we would choose for going by train, not by airplane, but we wanted to do that anyway. Incidentally: I received small orders (below GBP 20.00 all in) save, from Peter Pig and Lancashire Games.