Thoughts on Mantic Firefight?

[eilif]

Just got an email from Mantic that the new edition of firefight is out.  Anyone seen/read/played anything about it?

I've played the original Warpath beta version (the free booklet that was first released, aka "KingsOfWarInSpace") and it was a fantastic, simple set for playing Apocalypse size battles with lots of abstraction in a limited amount of time. Bought what the billed as the first edition with separate Warpath and Firefight game books and it didn't get played once.  Read through it, but it seemed to have lost the smooth streamlined feel of the original. 

I'm attracted to the idea of streamlined 40k'ish play, but maybe I should just stick with Grimdark Future?  Anyone who could contrast Firefight and Grimdark would be appreciated as well.

[Elbows]

Is this the version of the skirmish game based on squares?  I actually liked the look of that as a game, back in the day - but that was many years ago at this point.  I never bothered because I think Mantic, on the whole, produces god awful miniatures.

I know KoW etc. are pretty well received, so I get the vibe they do pretty decent rules, though.

[eilif]

Is this the version of the skirmish game based on squares?  I actually liked the look of that as a game, back in the day - but that was many years ago at this point.  I never bothered because I think Mantic, on the whole, produces god awful miniatures.

I know KoW etc. are pretty well received, so I get the vibe they do pretty decent rules, though.

The big Squares/Grid game was "Deadzone" which I gather is still produced.   I bought it when it first came out and was unimpressed, but folks seem to like it.

Firefight was originally billed as a scaled down (with a bit more detail) to around Platoon size version of "Warpath" (the mass battle game).  Both books were released at the same time a few years back. I picked up both in the kickstarter and have played neither.

Firefight is now being updated on it's own and the curious thing is that now Mantic has said that new firefight is in some ways a gridless scaled up version of Deadzone. No word that I've seen on whether-or-how Warpath will get an upgrade.  I'll probably toss the Firefight book I've got into the freebie bin and hold onto the Warpath book I have for now.

As for Kings of War, I love those rules and have really enjoyed playing them.  Very fast and streamlined way to get my blocks of fantasy figures on the table.

[NickNascati]

The original rules called Firefight were by Alternative Armies, a great skirmish SciFi game played on a squared playing area.  I believe AA still sells it.

[eilif]

The original rules called Firefight were by Alternative Armies, a great skirmish SciFi game played on a squared playing area.  I believe AA still sells it.

Old-school!
I had those rules. Never played them though. Sold them a while back I think.

I could be wrong, but I don't think there's any connection at all between AA Firefight and Mantic Firefight.

[Golgotha]

See the author of the rules explain what Firefight is https://www.manticgames.com/news/firefight-playtest-designer-notes-part-one/

He says: "I think it’s important to be clear though that Firefight is not Deadzone and, likewise, it is not Firefight: First Edition. It is, to some extent, a hybrid of the two with a lot of aspects of other Mantic games and other non-Mantic games I play thrown in for good measure."

[eilif]

Yep, I think that or something like it is what I read indicating there were similarities between Firefight and Deadzone.

Doesn't make me more likely to buy in but I am interested to hear folks impressions as they come out.
Going to watch the video at that link later.

[NickNascati]

To further confuse things, AAs Firefight has been through two editions.  I wonder what first edition he is referring to?

[eilif]

To further confuse things, AAs Firefight has been through two editions.  I wonder what first edition he is referring to?

Nick, I think you're confusing the two games.  Firefight from Mantic appears to have no connection to Firefight from AA.

First edition Firefight the Mantic designer referred to is the game
first released by Mantic in 2016 as part of the second Edition of Warpath. It was a modified version of Warpath scaled down to Platoon size. It is not played on a grid.

Firefight has just been released in it's second Edition (without an accompanying Warpath edition). It appears to have been somewhat scaled up in scope, reportedly uses some concepts and dice from the game Deadzone (see below) and feels to some to have suplanted Warpath of whose future nothing concrete has been promised.

Mantic’s sci Fi wargame on a grid (3 inch square) is called Deadzone. It also appears to have no connection to Alternative Armies Firefight. It was released after Warpath. Deadzone was released in 2012 and is now in it's third edition.

[NotifyGrout]

I've read through the beta rules and can add a few things:

The game uses the command dice system also in Kings of War: Vanguard. You get a certain number and type of command dice based upon your force list selections, and these can be used for tactical actions like adding more dice to an attack or moving more than the normal allowed movement per turn. Each faction has unique tactics that no one else has, too.

It's d8 based, which I am sure is already sending some purists running for the hills. There are actions beyond move, shoot, melee- a good tactic for large but poorly shooting units is to Blaze Away, which puts suppression on the target unit. Enough suppression can force a unit to panic or even rout from the table.

Movement is much simpler than in 40k. You measure from the squad leader, move that model, then pick the others up and arrange them within their command distance of said squad leader. Targeting is also done from the squad leader (though cover bonuses apply if some of the target unit's models are in cover).

Is it revolutionary? Probably not. But it is a streamlined set of rules that also plays very differently from the old large-sized version of Warpath (which I think is also due for a rework, but that might depend on how well Firefight does). It's simple enough to be easy to pick up, but with just enough crunch that positioning and tactics matter more than just one's army list and the luck of the dice.

[eilif]

Thanks for sharing your observations.

Some of that definitely does sound appealing.  The move a leader and position the rest around is a mechanic I have enjoyed in the past. It might have been part of the original Warpath booklet rules.

[Malebolgia]

The big Squares/Grid game was "Deadzone" which I gather is still produced.   I bought it when it first came out and was unimpressed, but folks seem to like it.

You should really try it again, the game is waaaaaay different from 1st edition. I played 1st edition and thought it didn't work that well. But then second edition came and the game changed a lot...for the better! It became my favourite sci-fi skirmish game. Now with the third edition it's even better. The changes from 2 to 3 are not that big but they make a fantastic game even better. So yeah, highly recommended!

[eilif]

Thanks for that. I may give it another look.

[the trojan bunny]

You should really try it again, the game is waaaaaay different from 1st edition. I played 1st edition and thought it didn't work that well. But then second edition came and the game changed a lot...for the better! It became my favourite sci-fi skirmish game. Now with the third edition it's even better. The changes from 2 to 3 are not that big but they make a fantastic game even better. So yeah, highly recommended!

I second this. I played first edition Deadzone and did not like it at all. Then tried second edition and it rapidly became my favourite sci-fi skirmish game.

I'm curious to give the new Warpath a try as alternative for all my 40k minis. The endless army books and supplements for 40k is just too costly for me and my buddies.