Scottish Mercenaries in a Medieval French Army

[GerryB21]

Considering building a French medieval army where the core of infantry were Scottish Mercenaries. ( circa 1450 )

Can anyone tell me what type of tropps would make up these mercenaries and what they would look like.

Looking at 28mm

thanks

gerry

[Atheling]

Considering building a French medieval army where the core of infantry were Scottish Mercenaries. ( circa 1450 )

Can anyone tell me what type of tropps would make up these mercenaries and what they would look like.

Looking at 28mm

thanks

gerry

Essentially they could literally be of any "type" or rank.

Maybe you're thinking of the Scottish Archers (French: Gardes Écossaises) lead by 1418 Robert Stewart, Duke of Albany and employed as a bodyguard for  Charles VI and made more official by Charles VII.

For images see below:

[painterman]

Hi
As Darrell says these are good references, the source for these is this painting of Charles VII of France.
In this post - some resin models are being made - for adding Perry plastic heads and arms to - which are ideal.
https://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=139269.0
simon

[fantasticlegions]

I have no clue how numerous the Garde Écossaise was, but certainly they should feature in a 1450 French army showcasing Scots.  You could also include "regular" units of Scottish men-at-arms, longbowmen, and pikemen, but I'm not sure the Scots were ever numerous enough to make up the "core" of any French army.

[Atheling]

I have no clue how numerous the Garde Écossaise was, but certainly they should feature in a 1450 French army showcasing Scots.  You could also include "regular" units of Scottish men-at-arms, longbowmen, and pikemen, but I'm not sure the Scots were ever numerous enough to make up the "core" of any French army.

The Scots contingent present at Cravant (1 July 1423) in very large numbers; made up the largest and definitely most enthusiastic contingent at Verneuil (17 August 1424) and made up all the soldiers at Bauge (22 March 1421). Also, they instigated the charge at the Battle of Rouvray/Battle of the Herrings (12 February 1429).

At least in the 1430's, the Scots were a very strong presence in the armies in France fighting against the English.

[frank xerox]

Allies, please, mercenary is such a dirty word

[Atheling]

Allies, please, mercenary is such a dirty word

There's a very strong argument that any paid soldier in the Late Middle Ages was acting in some capacity as a mercenary. In some armies they were made up almost entirely of mercenaries; just take Charles the Bold unfortunate for example.

[frank xerox]

I prefer to think of them as an expeditionary force

[commissarmoody]

Only if they were dispatched by the Crown of Scotland. Maybe paid volunteer is the word you are looking for if mercenary causes offense. 

[commissarmoody]

On the last page in this project he posted up some of the dolls for he made for Charles the bolds guard.  Which should work for what you are doing. https://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=139269.120

[Metternich]

Note that the Garde Ecossaise was a very small, hand-picked bodyguard unit, numbering only 100 men.  These consisted of 25, the Gardes de la Manche - Guard of the Sleeve - who remained physically close to the King at all times, and; an escort group consisting of 75 mounted archers (these did not shoot from the saddle).   

[Sheikdjerboutiy]

Scotland was (and is) an extremely poor and desolate country. In total the French estimated that Scotland could produce no more than 500 men-at-arms during their expedition to Scotland, the 15th.c is a little later, so their access to horses and arms may have improved with french finance, but most of the scottish mercenaries were longbowmen or halberdiers in the English style, although there will have been some men-at-arms in the retinues of the nobles leading them.

[Atheling]

Scotland was (and is) an extremely poor and desolate country. In total the French estimated that Scotland could produce no more than 500 men-at-arms during their expedition to Scotland, the 15th.c is a little later, so their access to horses and arms may have improved with french finance, but most of the scottish mercenaries were longbowmen or halberdiers in the English style, although there will have been some men-at-arms in the retinues of the nobles leading them.

Sorry, but the idea that Scottish men at arms, be they part of the gentry or not, were less wealthy than many of their English counterparts just does not hold water anymore. The Scots men at arms outnumbered French men at arms in the Franco Scottish army at Verneuil 1424.

[frank xerox]

And the bit I live in is certainly not poor or desolate

[Sheikdjerboutiy]

Sorry, but the idea that Scottish men at arms, be they part of the gentry or not, were less wealthy than many of their English counterparts just does not hold water anymore. The Scots men at arms outnumbered French men at arms in the Franco Scottish army at Verneuil 1424.

This is from the first hand account of De Vienne, the leader of the french expedition to Scotland in 1385. I read it in The Hundred Years War, volume 3, by Jonathan Sumption, around p500-600. The French expedition noted the abject poverty of the kingdom, the scarcity of men-at-arms, and the miserly nature of the scottish, who expected to be paid by the French for helping them in their war, as well as forced the French to pay for all of their supplies and for lodging and who would stop the French if they rode over a field in anything but single file. The French noted that the vast majority of scottish forces were light cavalry or infantry, who were more accustomed to looting than to fighting, and estimated that the scottish could produce no more than 500 properly equipped men-at-arms from their entire kingdom. This is merely 40 years before Verneuil. It is possible that the scottish could arm substantially more (with heavy French financial assistance) by 1424, but i think it incredibly unlikely that Scotland in total could put together more than 1500 men at arms even then, its far more likely that many of the rest of their numbers were made up of French, Breton and German mercenaries.