Airbrush help!

[cram]

Anyone used one of these: http://www.hobbycraft.co.uk/spraycraft-sp60-universal-dual-action-airbrush-kit/573798-1000 ?

I can't find any reviews. Also I can't seem to find any other nozzles for it besides the one you get with the kit.

I'm thinking its probably best left alone, but thought I'd ask on here first.

[Connectamabob]

The brand name is generic sounding and unfamiliar. There are some legit smaller or lesser known airbrush brands, but they tend to have names that are distinctive, such as the name of the company founder. "Spraycraft" is the sort of generic descriptor mash-up name one expects from the knock-off companies.

The brush in the photos appears to be a copy of the Iwata HP-SB+, only with a right-hand-only cup mount (with a screw-on fitting, rather than Iwata's pressure fitted cup).

Price is oddly higher than knock-offs usually go for. About comparable to the low-mid stuff from a well known brand.

I'm fairly sure it's one of the Chinese knock offs. I made my thoughts about those clear in the airbrushing thread in the "how to" board (I recommend against them, especially for beginners). If you REALLY want to take that risk though, you can probably find the same or similar knock-off for cheaper on Ebay or Amazon or any number of other such venues. The "brand names" on the knock offs are pretty interchangeable, as most seem to come from the same factories.

Honestly though, If that's your budget range, there's no reason for a knock off to even be a temptation. You can get an Iwata Neo for less, or an Iwata Revolution for similar, or an Iwata Eclipse for just a little more. Since you're in the UK, you can also get a Harder & Steenbeck Evolution* for around that (these are much more expensive in the 'States). All of which will be much more reliable in terms of manufacturing QC, will have much better service and parts availability, and actual resale value if it turns out you don't like them or decide to upgrade.

Even if it is legit and not a Chinese knock off, you're still probably better off buying from a well known company, since they're already well established and "tried and true". You know you'll be able to easily get parts and tech support for them now and in the future.

*This is the one I'd recommend most to you out of these. The Eclipse is what I'd consider Iwata's best beginner brush, but the H&S Evo and Infinity lines from what I've read are both higher quality and more beginner friendly than the Eclipse or Iwata's other low-to-mid models (though Iwata still owns the high-end market). That plus being cheaper than the Eclipse (if you're in the UK), and being comparable in price to this "Spraycraft" thing (if not a few quid less, depending on where you look) makes it seem like the best buy in your price range IMO.

[cram]

Thank you.

I have had a very basic airbrush for almost the last year, but that has died on me. Looking at upgrading to something with plenty to offer but also user friendly for someone without much experience. You have given me some great advice there.

[cram]

Any of these sets any good? http://www.modellingtools.co.uk/airbrush--compressor-sets-196-c.asp

[Connectamabob]

Hard to tell from what's shown.

The compressor looks to be a Chinese cheapie, but that can be OK maybe. If you have to choose between going cheap in the brush, and going cheap on the compressor, I'd say go cheap on the compressor. Compressor quality is easier to mitigate, whereas brush quality can significantly effect your actual workflow.

Name brand compressor's are pricy. Getting an equivalent name brand one by itself plus an H&S brush by itself separately would together cost you a little more than that kit, and you wouldn't get the extras. Find out what their policy is on returns/replacements if the compressor craps out a couple months down the line. If it's a good policy, this should be fine.

I have one of those Iwata/Sparmax cleaning pots, and it's quite nice. If that's the real deal and not a knock off, it adds a nice bit of value. Note however that that site doesn't include the pot in the written description, and doesn't sell the pot separately in the cleaning supplies tab. I recommend calling or emailing them to ask what brand the pot is before buying.

Cleaning brushes vary widely in quality depending on source and manufacturer, and the manufacturers are all of the "cheap" variety. I generally feel better buying these in person, and dental interstitial brushes from the drugstore can do you just as well anyway. Regardless of its hypothetical price, I would not count this toward the kit's value.

The mask is hard for me to asses, as I'm in the US and we have different regulatory bodies and such and thus different mask product lines and labeling standards. Again though, it feels a little off that there's no description or branding. As with the pot, call/email and ask. If it's a Chinese no-name, don't factor it into the kit value, and don't use it if you buy the kit. Health and safety gear is the one area where knock-offs and generic cheapies (especially from China) are 100% non-negotiable do-not-use. A mask is a good idea if you don't have a force ventilated spray booth, so if the mask in the kit is bad, it not only subtracts the price of the mask from the kit's value, but adds the cost of an alternative to your total setup, so this may potentially have a large impact on the kit's total value.

Airbrush booklet... well the internet is overflowing with info these days, so this is IMO pretty redundant, even if it's good. Might be nice as a freebee, but like the cleaning brushes, I wouldn't count it's value towards that of the kit.

One thing that's conspicuously missing from the kit is a regulator (the compressor has a moisture trap, but doesn't appear to have a regulator). Also, for optimal use, the moisture trap should be separated from the compressor by a length of airline to allow vapor to condense before entering the trap. So you'd want to buy a regulator and a length of coil hose on top of this kit anyway. TBH having a moisture trap pre-attached directly to the compressor has become pretty standard for this type of small compressor regardless of brand or source, so you'd be looking at doing the hose thing at least no matter what.

TL/DR: If the cleaning pot, the mask, and the replacement coverage on the compressor check out, that adds enough value that it'd be worth it. Otherwise look elsewhere for a similar name-brand compressor (which will have an actual warranty). That will cost you more than the kit would, but the value-per-pound will be better.

[cram]

I really appreciate the advice you have given me. I did find this which gives more detail on the kit: http://www.little-cars.co.uk/airbrushes/starterset.pdf

[Connectamabob]

Ah, that looks good then. Compressor and pot by Sparmax (a legit Chinese company: does subcontracting for Iwata, and makes some AB's of their own that aren't knock-offs), cleaning brush is the H&S one made specifically for their brushes. Compressor has a regulator. The DVD is H&S so it might have some useful nuggets in it pertaining specifically to H&S brushes. Only thing still vague is the mask, but the brush + compressor + pot make it a good kit.

Of the brush options, I recommend the H&S Evolution Silverline Solo. "Evolution" is H&S's midrange brush series, and it shares all part sizes/threads with their higher end models, so you can actually fully upgrade to a higher end bush one a part at a time if you need/want to. "Solo" means you get one size needle/tip set with it (as opposed to 2in1, which gets you two sets of different sizes). My experience with my Iwata brush (I have two different size sets for it) has been that you can do pretty much anything with a single tip/needle size. Size changes handling characteristics, but not capabilities, so barring the rare oddball project, one size is all you need. "Silverline" means it's chrome plated instead of nickel, which will make the finish more durable, less reactive, and easier to clean.

Of the cleaning fluid options, just pick whichever matches the brand of paint you use most frequently.

A tank will extend the life of your compressor by giving it a more drawn out duty cycle in use, but is not necessary for in-the-moment performance if you do the coil host thing I mentioned above. The hose adds a little bit off compressible "tank" volume as well as acting like a baffle, which will smooth out the pulsing airflow just as well as a proper tank. A hose costs a fraction of adding the tank option to your kit, so the choice is yours: potentially longer compressor life down the road, vs. cheaper start-up cost today.

The coil hose will also cool the air coming from the compressor, allowing moisture to condense, and thus improving the efficacy of the moisture trap. A tank will also improve the moisture trap's performance, but not as well as the hose will, due to the tank having much larger thermal mass (of air) and much lower surface-area-to-volume ratio. I don't count this as part of the trade-off above, however, as it is trivial to use both in combination. A coil hose can substitute for a tank in terms of airflow smoothing, but you can also use a coil hose with a tank to get the benefits of both (better duty cycle + better moisture trap performance).

Personally, IMO if you had the budget to consider the tank upgrade, I'd say spend it on the Evolution ALplus Solo instead. The ALplus has an anodized aluminum body instead of plated brass, making it much lighter in the hand. I've seen a few H&S owners say that upgrading one of these to an Infinity via part swapping gets you the best H&S brush possible.

If you do the hose thing, just remember your air flow order should go compressor-->(optional tank-->)coil hose-->regulator-->moisture trap-->brush hose-->brush. Unscrew the regulator/trap combo from the compressor, and mount it on your workbench, (or on a stand or box you can just set on a bench, if you don't have a permanent workspace), and put the coil hose between it and the compressor.

[cram]

Thank you for taking the time to help  

I will go for the coil hose. Oddly H&S do not seem to make a coil hose! Will have to look at other manufacturers. I'm a little worried over what adapters I might need to fit it to the compressor and airbrush. But if I buy the hose coil from the same site I am getting the kit (They do an Iwata coil hose) the should know what adapters I'll require.

Thanks again Marc.

[Connectamabob]

Those are hoses to connect the airbrush to the regulator/trap. They're smaller in diameter than regular pneumatic tool hoses, and usually have a small sized fitting at the downstream end to fit the airbrush. That's not what you want for between the compressor and the regulator/trap. For that you just want an ordinary pneumatic tool hose like you'd find at a hardware store. The fittings on the compressor and trap/regulator will just be whatever is standard for pneumatic tools in your part of the world (here in the US it's 1/4" NPT, dunno what the UK standard is).

As far as the fittings on the airbrush go, H&S brushes are built with a quick-connect nipple instead of a threaded fitting. Since so many people use quick connects for ABs these days, H&S just up and decided that should be the new standard (and I kinda agree with them). What that means is any AB hose will work equally well for you as long as you've got a female quick connector on the end. Just make sure the female quck connector is the same brand as the hose, and everything will work fine. You don't have to worry about mixing brands with the male/female ends of the connector, as those are standardized. The upstream end of the AB hose will always be the standard pneumatic fitting, just like the regulator/trap/compressor.

The kit doesn't appear to come with an airbrush hose though, so it's good that you're getting one anyway. I recommend the Iwata/Tamiya polyurethane hoses (they have a coiled and a straight one, I use/like the straight). Most AB hoses are cloth sleeved rubber or clear vinyl. The cloth sleeved ones are heavy, and a bit overkill. Clear vinyl is a little lighter, and has the benefit of letting you see if there's any condensation happening in the line downstream of the trap. The Iwata/Tamiya hose is very thin (about the diameter of a knitting needle) and feather light, pretty much the closest you'll get to a feeling of wielding the brush without a hose at all.

EDIT: Here's a quick pic of my setup to illustrate (click to enlarge). You can ignore the tank and the fittings between the coil hose and the tank, as those are only relevant to the tank. I don't actually keep the AB on the ground like that, it's just for the pic.

My setup is a little weird (for example: having the coil hose in between the compressor and tank rather than between the tank and regulator/trap), as it is kluged together out of separate components over time, ad I don't have a permanent bench, so the whole thing is set up for disassembly and movement, as well as being able to disconnect the hose from the AB setup so I can use it for a cleaning/dusting air gun (run on sentences are my superpower, LOL). You can ignore most of that though: important part is compressor-->pneumatic coil hose-->regulator-->trap--airbrush hose-->airbrush quick connect-->airbrush.

[Connectamabob]

double double post post

[cram]

You have taken a lot of time and effort to help, I really appreciate it.

Should hopefully be able to get the coiled hose from a Machine Mart a few miles away, I will call in to see them tomorrow.

Many thanks 

[Connectamabob]

No worries. 'S what communities are for.