GoT Greyjoy project, Men at arms painted, plus Victarion.

[Jockjay]

Thought I would just mention in the title, if you want pics, this is not the thread you are looking for...

But, I am looking to kit bash some House Greyjoy stuff together in the next month or so, and was wondering, as there are so many GoT aficionados here, what kits to use to create the right sort of look.

After reading the books (in real time, as in when they were released) I always imagined the Greyjoys to be more of a raiding force with a viking sort of look and feel about them, but that era of kit (in our history) is fairly old school compared the the WotR stuff usually depicted.

Would viking stuff work and of so which manufacturer does great plastic vikings in 28mm.

Oh ruleset will probably be Saga.

Many thanks in advance

Jay,

[King Arthur]

Thought I would just mention in the title, if you want pics, this is not the thread you are looking for...

But, I am looking to kit bash some House Greyjoy stuff together in the next month or so, and was wondering, as there are so many GoT aficionados here, what kits to use to create the right sort of look.

After reading the books (in real time, as in when they were released) I always imagined the Greyjoys to be more of a raiding force with a viking sort of look and feel about them, but that era of kit (in our history) is fairly old school compared the the WotR stuff usually depicted.

Would viking stuff work and of so which manufacturer does great plastic vikings in 28mm.

Oh ruleset will probably be Saga.

Many thanks in advance

Jay,

Hello Jay

Gripping Beast have some decent plastic Vikings/Saxons/Hirdmen kits, Fireforge too I believe.

Perry Miniatures Plastics seem to be the most popular due to the casts and details being so crisp, I am currently doing a House Cerwyn project in this forum and have started out with the European Mercenaries kit, these could also be good for House Greyjoy as it has a good mixture of leather/padded armour with a dose or Chainmail and Plate mail!

You should also check out Captain Bloods threads here in the Fantasy forum and the Medieval forum, as he is the undisputed King or 'Kit Bashing' plastics together to achieve truly unique models 

Best of luck and have fun!!!

[Jockjay]

Dude, yours, franks and bloods are my inspiration. I sort of hate you all, as I am a notorious game butterfly. Many thanks!

Yes I reeeeally like the European mercs unit for bodies/ helms but cannot see them using pikes. And i'm torn between crossbows and bows. trying to dig up references in the books, Theon was a good archer but did he pick that up from being a Stark hostage or is it an Ironborn weapon too?

[Jockjay]

Also, if you are using Saga, therefore saga battleboards. How do you determine which board suits which faction?

[sukhe_bator]

My Ironborn are all GB Vikings...

I've also seen Fireforge foot serjeants used to good effect... they paid the iron price for the better kit no doubt...

[Jockjay]

Nice, did you hand paint those banners?

ohhhh nice shout on those foot sergeants, never seen them before, they look legit.

[Dilettante Gamer]

Welcome to the GoT party!

My personal preference is to not make them to obviously "Viking" (Sukhe's awesome rendition not withtanding!) 

Therefore I'm primarily using GB Saxon & Dane bodies for the light armor (guys jumping out of boats, you know) with head, arm and shield swaps to break away from the telltale Viking silhouette.

For heads I'm using mostly Fireforge Teutonic/Templar/Serjant heads with additions of hooded heads from West Winds' dark ages Picts.

For the more elite warriors (I'll be using Lion Rampant rules)  I'll be using the actually fully mailed bodies/arms.

I use the teardrop shaped shields from Fireforge to get away from the rounds.

But, that's just one guy's take on it.

[Jockjay]

That's some good advice, involves buying a fair few boxes of dudes for bits. But i hope to sell some Napoleonic brits soon to fund my next plasti-smack habit.

Also generated a great question: Lion Rampant or Saga rules?

I have two main gaming buds, one preaches either side of this argument.....

What say you?

[Charlie_]

I don't see the Ironborn looking like Vikings... admittedly there are a lot of Viking aspects to their culture, but I prefer a 'realistic fantasy' myself and so don't think they would look that much different to everyone on the mainland, in particular I don't see them as having completely different arms and armour, especially that 4 or 5 centuries more primitive than everyone else! (in real world terms of course)

Something to consider is that Victarion Greyjoy is described wearing plate armour when fighting at sea, and the different Ironborn houses do have heraldry much like on the mainland.

However having said all that, I do picture them as being much more rag-tag than everyone else, with a real motley array of weaponry and armour, much of it pilfered or bought with the 'iron price'. Certainly no uniforms of any sort.

In military terms, they should definitely not be particularly good at pitched battles. They should excel in small scale raids and skirmishes, and of course fighting on deck. So definitely no pikes.... Just a mix of swords, axes, short spears, etc..... I don't think they make use of bows or crossbows much, and they are mentioned as being poor horsemen, so no cavalry perhaps.

And though I don't like the 'cartoon viking' look with axes and horned helms, I will concede that they seem to have a thing for throwing axes!!!

I'd like to one day have a go at making some, but I don't quite know myself how I could do it effectively so they blend in with my 15th century collection in terms of arms and armour, yet still looking rag-tag enough....

[King Arthur]

Dude, yours, franks and bloods are my inspiration. I sort of hate you all, as I am a notorious game butterfly. Many thanks!

Yes I reeeeally like the European mercs unit for bodies/ helms but cannot see them using pikes. And i'm torn between crossbows and bows. trying to dig up references in the books, Theon was a good archer but did he pick that up from being a Stark hostage or is it an Ironborn weapon too?

I'm quite flattered actually  Hope we and all the others continue to inspire you!

Most likely the archery is from the Stark link,

And though I don't like the 'cartoon viking' look with axes and horned helms, I will concede that they seem to have a thing for throwing axes!!!

Now this would be fun to create! Gripping beast do some some nice loose Francisca throwing axes 

Depends on your budget, but the European Mercs do have some great 'bodies' and heads but you'll need to source hand weapons etc for them!

Looking forward to the progress 

Cheers

Gary

[Charlie_]

Depends on your budget, but the European Mercs do have some great 'bodies' and heads but you'll need to source hand weapons etc for them!

The new French Infantry set could be of use. It has swords, spears, and 2-handed axes, and the style of armour I think would suit better... padded gambesons, kettle hats, mail coifs...
Perhaps not by itself, but it has some very useful parts to combine with other kits.

[Dilettante Gamer]

That's some good advice, involves buying a fair few boxes of dudes for bits. But i hope to sell some Napoleonic brits soon to fund my next plasti-smack habit.

One box each - Templars, Teutonics, Serjeants. If I had to do it again, I would have bought a second Templars instead of the Serjeants for the hoods and capes.  My Ironborn are cloaked against the elements.

Also generated a great question: Lion Rampant or Saga rules?

Well, with no offense to Saga fans, I find it too "gamey" - what with the dice and the combos and the hey-hey (nod to Professor Frink)
I believe Lion Rampant/Dragon Rampant offers more flexibility for building diverse forces. AND, I would sooner use Dux Britanniarum with Ironborn as Saxons and either Lannister or Stark as Romano-Brits.  Less flexibility with force composition, but in return more colorful game mechanics and an outstanding campaign mechanic that would need a little modding to give it a Seven Kingdoms feel.

I have two main gaming buds, one preaches either side of this argument.....

 

Guess you get to be the tie-breaker.  Try stridently advocating for third option - Dux Brit - to force one of them off their standoff. 

[Jockjay]

Guys, excellent and much appreciated advice. I think we are sold on LR as Saga just seems to be a bit more 'off board' admin with the dice and stuff and LR can scale up slightly higher. Plus the glory systems is fairly cool.

SO. Putting together a shopping list of minis now.

Charlie- thanks for mentioning Victarion's penchant for plate at sea. Gives me some scope for an elite bodyguard of heavier troops to outweigh the thematic lack of cavalry and I will probably take crossbows for missiles as these guys probably do not train in bow, so a crossbow is pretty much 'pick up and fire'.

I would also like to imagine a sort of grappling hook crossbow bolt for boarding actions. Totally unfounded (GoT or real timeline) but hey, this is the fantasy section for a reason.

Oh and I have some agincourt french infantry. They are amazing. But I used them for a frostgrave warband. Still have some left though.

So I will reward you guys with pics soon.

[sukhe_bator]

Nice idea but the weight of rope necessary for a grapnel greatly impedes the mechanism and flight of an ordinary crossbow bolt. It has to be supersized so you can only really use a scorpion or bolt thrower for a grapnel hook. Agrippa is credited with developing one for the Roman Navy called the 'Harpax'.
The Ironborn didn't fear drowning so they invariably wore armour at sea. They are also supreme reavers, so excellent at raiding and the like. In Lion Rampant terms I'm classifying the bulk of the boat crews as 'Fierce Foot', with a foraging/skirmishing party of 'Bidowers' for each, led by a cadre of captains and a warlord as 'Foot Men at Arms'...

[Captain Blood]

I agree with Charlie_. I don't see anything in the books which describes the Greyjoys as Vikings. Sure they behave like Vikings - i.e. they have ships, they are a warlike, maritime culture, and they raid and ravage. But in terms of appearance, there's nothing to say their dress, weapons and armour is culturally very different from the rest of Westeros, which is broadly portrayed as a 'high medieval' milieu - Maybe C13th/C14th in medieval European terms.
But it's true the Iron Islands are portrayed as relatively poor, so for my few Greyjoys (I will do more at some point), I went for a kind of medieval-lite/slightly arachaic look. But definitely not C8th/C9th Vikings...

Then again, it's fantasy, so what the heck. Do what you like