What is the driver of the wargames industry? Rules or new figure ranges?

[vodkafan]

I was sitting in the bath last night musing and it occurred to me that the real drivers of wargaming (more than any other factor) are the people who write rulesets. For instance a new set of rules will come out and then people will get enthused about a period all over again and start buying up figures. Whether they actually get the figures painted up and any games played is another matter.
Then the process happens again when we get excited about another ruleset.
I haven't thought this out deeply, but I reckoned it was worth putting the idea out there and asking for LAFers opinions.
What do you all think? Any alternative viewpoints?

[Michi]

You pretty much got it James. I think the same.

[stone-cold-lead]

That's a chicken or egg question! Quality of both game and miniatures really matters though. A crap game alone goes nowhere. Crap game with great miniatures will just sell miniatures. A great game can be hampered by crap miniatures though. Great game, great miniatures, win, win... but not necessarily.

I've just finished my second drink tonight, I can't be doing with this. I'm going to be pondering this at 2 in the morning now ya bugger! 

[Mick_in_Switzerland]

I think miniatures is the main driver.

I am almost always attracted by the figures first.
I buy miniatures that I like and then look for rules second.

Most periods have a variety of possible rules so it is easy to change rules.
Making and painting figures is a bigger investment of both money and time.

[Elbows]

While I agree it's a bit chicken-and-egg, I think the rules (the chicken in this instance) are the predominant driving factor behind the entire hobby - or we'd all just be model makers or toy soldier collectors (and there are plenty of those around).

That being said, when a model or miniature line has enough "cool factor" to push someone to develop rules or modify existing rules in order to use them - that's a bit of the egg taking over.

I think neither can survive without the other, and the real objective is the "experience" provided by the combination of the chicken and egg together.  A game's rules mechanics, fluff, background, aesthetic, scale and playability are hugely important but it all falls to nothing if you have no wonderful miniatures which stir your imagination to play the game with (you can always role-play instead!).

I think lately we've seen how great some random rules sets can be when they allow people to use any miniatures they want (the strength of several of the recent Osprey titles over the past 3-5 years).  We've seen the opposite though where a company releases a beautiful line of minis and a terrible game (rules-wise, I think GW falls into this category often enough).

[vodkafan]

Interesting replies already.

[stone-cold-lead]

The two aspects are very intertwined yet there are good examples of either or working well. It's a riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma. 

[Davout]

I know for me personally it's rules first then miniatures. I'd never bought a fantasy fig until I picked up Dragon Rampant, and I've bought historical rules  that drive future army plans as well.

The rules set the parameters for what I want to buy, how much and in what scale. The rules in some cases help set an army list (which doubles as a shopping list) and then off I go.

[Cubs]

I buy some rules just on a whim, to flick through the book and look at the nice pics. It's completely illogical, because I never game, but if a rule set is popular, or even just shiny, there's a good chance I'll pick it up some time.

But miniatures? Well, they have to be nice miniatures of course, but also in a genre and/or period I'm interested in (or can be persuaded to be interested in). The most beautiful (new) GW figures will never tempt me, because they're not my thing. A load of historical periods/conflicts/armies will just never be able to tempt me, because they're not my thing. Sci-fi likewise.

Because I'm not buying miniatures to go with rules, or rules to go with miniatures, they're completely separate buying decisions in my tattered mind.

[vodkafan]

I buy some rules just on a whim, to flick through the book and look at the nice pics. It's completely illogical, because I never game, but if a rule set is popular, or even just shiny, there's a good chance I'll pick it up some time.

But miniatures? Well, they have to be nice miniatures of course, but also in a genre and/or period I'm interested in (or can be persuaded to be interested in). The most beautiful (new) GW figures will never tempt me, because they're not my thing. A load of historical periods/conflicts/armies will just never be able to tempt me, because they're not my thing. Sci-fi likewise.

Because I'm not buying miniatures to go with rules, or rules to go with miniatures, they're completely separate buying decisions in my tattered mind.

You are a true Maverick Cubs...that's the way Sir! Keep them guessing!

[Momotaro]

The real hobby is planning armies, buying them, then stashing them in the attic when you realise what a faff the whole thing has turned into.  Often the main manufacturer stops producing figures of unit type A, and the latest rules supplement nerfs unit type B.  Both those units were, of course, the mainstays of your tactical plans.

Or you keep up with the rules and figure churn, and instead end up with three army plans for five rulesets, and have bought figures for all the options, including at least one marginal historical unit that for everyone has, inexplicably, statted up as the equivalent of Terminator cyborgs.  

"Putting it in the attic" becomes complex, as different configurations and painting plans cycle through your head, and you end up with no idea which units are actually in the attic, and which are in the varuous "keep", "sell", "paint" or "maybe" staging areas that you have established through the house.  Ar some point, you will buy duplicates of everything in your army, either to counter scale creep or because you forgot you ever had them.

Then you'll try the whole bloody thing in 15mm, and stash THEM away when you realise they're too small for you to paint.

So a 50-figure DBA army in 28mm ends up with 1500 miniatures in three scales that can make armies up to 500 minis for half a dozen rulesets.

So you start looking at a new skirmish game, and decide that you could paint up several of the factions...

Can't just be me?

[shandy]

For me, it usually starts with an interest in a period (in a wider sense, including sci fi and fantasy), inspiried by reading a book or watching a movie or visiting a site or a friend babbling something or whatever. Then I look what rules and what miniatures are available. If I find both to my liking, the planning and buying starts... However, I guess if I've got a period and rules I like, I might compromise with the miniatures (as I had to do with the 15mm Haitian Revolution project).

EDIT: But of course, my answer is off topic as it does not answer the question: What drives the wargames industry. Should have thought before writing... 

[Steve63]

Beer

[Driscoles]

Rules & Miniatures go hand in hand.

[Dan55]

For me it's something like what Cubs describes.

If I'm really fascinated by a period or genre, I'll go looking for figures so that I can play those types of games.  Then I'll search for rules that I like.

However, the rest of the time I need to find a set of rules that really inspires me, and only then will I start collecting the figures.