Hellas V Macedonia

[Doom Beard 78]

I have just under  1000 painted figures of Hellenes and Barbaroi (( Macedonians) figures are gathering dust through lack of use .  I have managed to find a club  close to me and was thinking of staging a large game using the figures but am at a loss as to which rules  to use for a game set at this scale

I find it impossible to get excited the element games derived from the DBX stable ( which includes ADLG) 
Hail Caesar has the right aesthetics ( I.e. proper sized units)  but I found that games of it for this period were stodgy drawn out affairs , whilst this might be considered an accurate depiction of this type of combat ( and I hope not to ignite a discussion on this theme) it hardly gave an enjoyable game for this period.

I am not interested in the Lion rampant stable and have no interest in grids, I have therefore ruled out  To The Strongest so please do not suggest it.

Does a suitable system exits, or am I going to have to be creative and devise my own,

[Atheling]

Swordpoint? 

I think you would like the line of battle concept George. Especially with pike phalanxes/phalanges fighting it out.

i read the rules again and despite it being derived from WAB it has moved quite a distance away from one elite unit smashes the centre of your line and your army disintegrates which used to happen all too often with WAB.

The movement is refined and simple. Combats last much longer and there seems to be more of an ebb and flow during battle.

Of course, I'm yet to play a game due to you know what so I have no lived experience with the rules.

They have a good To the Ends of the Earth Supplement. Alas it end at 209 BC.

[Doom Beard 78]

Have you tried Impetus, the rules have 160x60 unit sizes for heavy infantry which In my view is a good size. Would give me 10 hoplites, 12 units of phalangites, 2 units of hypaspist

The basing for Swordpoint of 40x40 squares kind off turns me off ( A lot of my heavy infantry were multibased using 60x20, or 60x40 bases)

[Kugelfang]

It's been a few years since I looked at it but I'd take a look at Greg Wagman's 'Age of Hannibal' available on Wargame Vault. (https://www.wargamevault.com/product/253180/Age-of-Hannibal). IIRC, it does work better with square bases, but with your numbers you could use three 60x20 elements to represent a unit. Might need to do some tweaking for other troop types.

[Johnp4000]

George, you should try a small game of swordpoint as maintaining the line is a focus of the game which would suit pike blocks. The Age of Hannibal , I have only seen as a 6mm game although in theory it can be scaled up and it has the advantage of being based around the Macedonian and Punic wars. Little Wars TV has a video on youtube showing the battle of Trebbia, unfortunately it doesn't show a lot of the game!

[AdamPHayes]

Piquet works well for big games. The specific period variant is Archon 2. Scares the beejesus out of some people due to a bit of unorthodoxy in the choice of some mechanisms... I think the related game Pulse of Battle is a bit less “challenging” but I haven’t tried them.



Battle of Paraitakene at Society of Ancients Battle Day.

[SteveBurt]

Have a look at Sword and Spear. Maybe Armati is worth a look as well.
Field of Glory is quite good; proper units, but not the fastest playing

[williamb]

Scutarii from Hoplite Research https://www.lulu.com/en/us/shop/william-butler/broadsword_scutarii-tournament/paperback/product-1mwvzvp6.html?page=1&pageSize=4
which is designed for fighting large battles in an afternoon or evening.  figures in image are 6mm, but rules can also be used for larger figures

[Melnibonean]

I recommend To The Strongest. Very simple game mechanics that work extremely well. Players will easily pick up the rules after one or maybe two turns. Very easy to finish a large battle in an afternoon.

[SJWi]

Melnibonean, I don’t think you read Doom Beard’s now edited opening piece. TTS “doesn’t do it for him”…..and that’s putting it mildly!

 Doom Beard, I saw your question about Impetus. Whilst popular with some of our club members I tried them and just couldn’t get on with them. Can’t really put my finger on it.

 I too like TTS but if I was looking at another set for 28mm I would check out Sword and Spear v2 ( Great Escape Games) or Gripping Beast’s Swordpoint. I have also heard good things about PSC’s “Mortem et Gloriam” but no direct experience myself. However, any rules that make it to a version 2 must have something going for them.

 My problem was the basing. I had several armies based for Impetus and the 12cm wide units fitted perfectly for TTS but were less useful for other rules sets.

[Atheling]

I too like TTS but if I was looking at another set for 28mm I would check out Sword and Spear v2 ( Great Escape Games) or Gripping Beast’s Swordpoint. I have also heard good things about PSC’s “Mortem et Gloriam” but no direct experience myself. However, any rules that make it to a version 2 must have something going for them.

As SJW has pointed out, Doombeard has indicated that he is not interested in TtS. I know that he has had extensive experience of TtS, including being friends with and playing with the author.

[Johnp4000]

As SJW has pointed out, Doombeard has indicated that he is not interested in TtS. I know that he has had extensive experience of TtS, including being friends with and playing with the author.

Darrell, I think it is comical just how frequent people blatantly ignore the OP in their rush to plug a set of rules. Doombeard was involved in the playtesting of TTS, and just doesn't like the rules hence his frustration when people keep recommending the rules to him! This seems to happen on all forums now, I remember you posting a question about unit size in Comitatus, several replies but no one answered the question, all the responses were just again plugs for other sets of rules.

[Atheling]

Darrell, I think it is comical just how frequent people blatantly ignore the OP in their rush to plug a set of rules. Doombeard was involved in the playtesting of TTS, and just doesn't like the rules hence his frustration when people keep recommending the rules to him! This seems to happen on all forums now, I remember you posting a question about unit size in Comitatus, several replies but no one answered the question, all the responses were just again plugs for other sets of rules.

Indeed.

[trev]

How about DBA or Lion Rampant?   

[Atheling]

How about DBA or Lion Rampant?   

A wee reminder of the original post:

I have just under  1000 painted figures of Hellenes and Barbaroi (( Macedonians) figures are gathering dust through lack of use .  I have managed to find a club  close to me and was thinking of staging a large game using the figures but am at a loss as to which rules  to use for a game set at this scale

I find it impossible to get excited the element games derived from the DBX stable ( which includes ADLG

I am not interested in the Lion rampant stable and have no interest in grids, I have therefore ruled out  To The Strongest so please do not suggest it.

Does a suitable system exits, or am I going to have to be creative and devise my own,