I Need Rules Advice!

[Argonor]

I need to find a Dark Age/Medieval small scale skirmish ruleset that will allow me to start playing with 3-5 models per side, and then add models one at a time.

It should be sufficietly detailed to provide an interesting game with only a handful of minis, but at the same time be simple enough to allow for at least 10-15 model per side without bogging down.

And, yes, my Chivalry project should do the trick, but I'm not likely to finish the rules for it very soon, as I have plenty of other stuff going on atm., so I would like to have some suggestions, please!

I need to be able to paint a few minis, and get gaming right away, otherwise I probably will paint only a few minis, and then turn my attention elsewhere, as I cannot see myself paint an entire SAGA force in one go (mind like a butterfly, and all that...).

If I don't find a suitable set of rules, I may have to start out by using 1st lvl D&D characters, focussing on the combat stats only (I recently started a fantasy vikings prg project with my daughters).

[Mad Doc Morris]

Songs of Blades and Heroes may do the trick then. Not a huge fan myself, but it's well suited to micro-skirmish and can also handle groups of ordinary men.
Personally, for this kind of action I prefer the two spinoffs of the .45 Adventure rules, Broadsword Adventures and Gloire (depending if you want to include blackpowder or not). Admittedly, they are quite detailed and might not scale that well – but if you can't see yourself painting more than 10 models in the foreseeable future, anyway, these are strongly recommended. Bear in mind, with 45A you'll need to invest some time in character creation and general setup, because there's no ready-made Medieval supplement or such. But that's part of the fun, really.

Otherwise, if you're after a more recent and specific release, I've heard a few good things about Lords & Servants by Dadi e Piombo. The game is playable with small forces of about 15 figures per side. That's at least smaller than your average Lion Rampant or SAGA "army", even if both could be played with pure elite or halved count-as forces, of course.

[LeadAsbestos]

Song of Arthur and Merlin should do the trick. The complete one that just came out has all the rules frm the expansions that you might want, and the era is Dark Age Britain, stats for pure Historical all the way up to Dragons and the Questing Beast.

Lots of fun! My 7yr old son and I played many times, and it gives a good feel along w/ a fast and fun game.

[swiftnick]

Mordheim?

[rumacara]

Perry heroes Legend Of Feudal Times.
A variation of LOTOW for medieval bands.

And as said before Song of Blades and Heroes or Song of Arthur and Merlin.

[Argonor]

*facepalm* 

Why didn't I think of SoBaH myself (I have the Arthur and Merlin book, as well as everything else from the previous edition).

I don't remember if I have Broadsword Adventures (I have most of the other .45A books and spinoffs).

I also have LotFT on my DropBox, so it might be time to give them a read-through.

Mordheim is not a bad call, either, starting warbands can be quite small, IIRC.

Thanks, all, food for thoughts has been offered, and I now need to delve into almost forgotten tomes of lore.... 

[Atheling]

For Early Medieval Pig Wars, which has just been released again in an expanded edition is a great game and card driven.

Late Med. I'm not really in a position to comment on to be honest as I've never played a Late Med. skirmish game!  (it's highly unusual for me not to have tried a Late Med. set of rules but none of my stuff is skirmish based). I know that Dux Brit. has been used with some success by David Imrie (Saxon Dog) and Andrew Taylor when they did a demo game was a success. Obviously there is Lion Rampant that has taken the wargaming scene by storm which comes highly recommended.

Here are a few pics of David. Ian and Andrews Dux Brit. Late Med. game from the Claymore show last year:

[Argonor]

I have tried Lion Rampant, and decided not to buy it; it is necessary to roll averagely when playing it, which I rarely do (believe it or not, it's how I perceive it, anyway), otherwise it turns into one long series of frustrations when you cannot activate your units, at the same time watching your opponent fulfilling his objectives and completing his boasts, with absolutely nothing you can do about it (rolling batches of 12 dice or more in combat, only achieving 2 or 3 results above 3 didn't do much for my appreciation of the game, either). It's also more a 'unit' skirmish game than a 'single mini' skirmish game.

I don't know pig wars; how is it structured? Units or not?

For this particular purpose I prefer rules that do not use units (such as SoBaH, although the activation rolls of that has had me lose games in the same way as described above - even playing elves).

[Atheling]

I have tried Lion Rampant, and decided not to buy it; it is necessary to roll averagely when playing it, which I rarely do (believe it or not, it's how I perceive it, anyway), otherwise it turns into one long series of frustrations when you cannot activate your units, at the same time watching your opponent fulfilling his objectives and completing his boasts, with absolutely nothing you can do about it (rolling batches of 12 dice or more in combat, only achieving 2 or 3 results above 3 didn't do much for my appreciation of the game, either). It's also more a 'unit' skirmish game than a 'single mini' skirmish game.

Maybe you could find a way of juggling the activations?

I don't know pig wars; how is it structured? Units or not?

The edition I have is either- if memory serves- it's actually stuck in my ex'es garage and i haven't played in over a decade.

For this particular purpose I prefer rules that do not use units (such as SoBaH, although the activation rolls of that has had me lose games in the same way as described above - even playing elves).

What about the rules that Captain Blood and Silent Invader use?

Or are you looking for something like individual combats?

Darrell.

[Argonor]

Maybe you could find a way of juggling the activations?

Believe me, I only ever tried activating the units in descending order of probability.

The edition I have is either- if memory serves- it's actually stuck in my ex'es garage and i haven't played in over a decade.

OK

What about the rules that Captain Blood and Silent Invader use?

Or are you looking for something like individual combats?

I'm not sure which one ruleset you're referring to here - if you by individual combats mean 'one warrior attacks another and rolls for the attack', then, yes, not 'these four warriors attack those five and roll a combined attack'.

Much the same way as SoBaH, or LotR/Hobbit SBG, is played.  I'll dig out my Song of Arthur and Merlin book and see if I can find some profiles suitable for Vikings, Saxons, and Normans (or maybe make a couple of proxy LotR 'Battle Companies').

[pws]

I'll dig out my Song of Arthur and Merlin book and see if I can find some profiles suitable for Vikings, Saxons, and Normans (or maybe make a couple of proxy LotR 'Battle Companies').

Have you already tried a search in the Ganeshagames Yahoo group?
Here: https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/songofblades/info
Maybe someone has already did it, post a question or look into the "files".
Ciao

[Argonor]

Have you already tried a search in the Ganeshagames Yahoo group?
Here: https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/songofblades/info
Maybe someone has already did it, post a question or look into the "files".
Ciao

Thanks, didn't think of that. Found the file 'Song of Longship and Ravens' that should do 

[Lowtardog]

Steve Barbers Ultimate skirmish works quite well for small warring factions up to about 20 per side. We used it for samurai and also pirates way back in the day.

[Argonor]

Steve Barbers Ultimate skirmish works quite well for small warring factions up to about 20 per side. We used it for samurai and also pirates way back in the day.

OK, thanks, I'll keep that in mind, should the dice annoy me too much playing the SBH Vikings! 

[Lowtardog]

Here is a little review

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/neil.shuck/revskirmish.html