(KICKSTARTER) WARZONE - Resurrection

[Torben]

I like the new AND the old models, but the old models say Warzone to me, the new says, ehm, something else, something new.

Actually, that really sums it up a lot better. It's just like the current trend of remaking movies in order to reboot a movie as a franchise (btw. remember when movies were just that - a movie and not a merchandice commercial?); it leaves to a certain number of expectations among those who remember the original first time around and then they (like me) become underwhelmed when said expectations are not met.

Although, in this particular case, then I just don't care much for the current "new style" of "realistic" miniatures made by 3D-printers; they look soulless and flat and no manner of painting technique can ever salvage that.

... I'll leave the thread now, grumbling in my "cranky old man" tone of voice and mutter something about "young whippersnappers don't know anything more!"

[Westfalia Chris]

I think the overwhelming majority of the figures look rather awesome and very much up-to-date, stylewise. The painted pics do a lot to help that, although the "staged" ones published in the books and magazines did a better job of showcasing the figures (mind you, there was some absolutely dire reproduction quality in some parts of the 2ed books).

I'm personally more interested in seeing the figures on general release rather than the books (which don't really do anything for me, it's the minis I'm excited about).

[sundayhero]

Why a mini has to be realistic to be a good mini ?  On LAF there is a lot of really cool, nicely painted warzone minis, from 1st and 2nd edition.

I don't think people who prefer the old models to the new does so because they feel the old are more realistic. I think it is a matter of style, the old Warzone minis is just the way people think this should be.

I share this opinion. But I also wish all the best to the new range 

[Argonor]

I am not going to win any friends amongst the old Warzone fans here but here goes...

Amongst the hundreds of old Warzone miniatures, how many actually look good enough to buy in today's modern market place?

I still think most of them are too far away from the original concepts for my liking (I think it would have been possible to 'modernize' the sculpts without drifting so far from the old imagery),

I agree - many sculpts were awful by today's standards, but I have to disagree on the notion that the models should not correspond to the imagery, style-wise. The perfect war game is, at least to me, one where fluff, rules, and models fit together completely. The fluff sets the mood for the game, and if the models (or the ruleset) does not support that mood, it takes a lot of the incentive away for actually playing a game.

As for nice old sculpts, the first ed. blood berets, and the 1st ed. Capitol infantry are still among my favourites, and not far from the standards of many contemporary minis.

As for realism: Come on - how many other tech-fantasy, sci-fi, or fantasy minis are really that realistic?

[rob_the_robgoblin]

Rather than realistic, I would say proportionally realistic.

Mutant Chronicles is a dark setting, it was always meant to be a 'Techno-fantasy/horror' background, which I do not think Kev Adams, Tim Prow etc could pull off. Kev White could have done, I am sure, but he came in much later with a brief to make the minis fit in with the rest!

I will point out, I am a big fan of Kev Adams and Tim Prow, just not for Warzone!

Although, I do have quite a few of the old models, which I have bought very recently from Prince August, just because I like them.

...aaaaand, the new models have been okayed by Frederick Malmberg, creator of Mutant Chronicles.

[King Tiger]

Allot of the models visually remind me of the later quake games, not that it is a bad thing, being new to warzone (it sort of stopped around when I started waisting money on 40k) I like the new look compared to the old, as I never grew up on around the old models, a handful are superb, a handful are poor the rest are fine for what they are,,the same as any miniature range.

I'll save further thoughts for when/if I can afford a starter set when they appear.

[Inso]

I am not suggesting that the models shouldn't correspond to the background/imagery either. However, if you have an artist who doesn't draw things in proportion, it doesn't mean that the sculpts shouldn't be in proportion either... and vice versa.

This is Warzone 'the next version' not 'the original warzone brought back to life' (although the title of this new game does contradict that ... which was the biggest mistake of the entire project, in my opinion; setting expectations of a continuation of the original game in its entirety, including the style of the miniatures... Warzone Evolution/Evolved/A New Start/The Next Generation would have been better titles)... maybe evolution has occurred in the meantime?

If the new imagery matches the new miniatures, then things are as they should be, surely?

I'm a serviceman. A lot of changes happen in military circles over relatively short periods of time so you may end up with different modification standards of equipment that look 'almost' the same but aren't quite. Look at the evolution of the british Harrier jump-jet. over its life it had many changes but it still looked like a harrier and was called a harrier, even though the wings were extended, a dual cockpit was added (for trainers), the nose cone changed (sea-harrier), etc...

... and that doesn't even touch on artistic lisence and interpretation of the design brief.

But when all is said and done, we all like what we like and don't like what we don't like and the world would be a horrid place if it wasn't like that .

I still maintain that if the title had been different (Resurrection suggests bringing the OLD game back to life) there would have been less expectation from old school players and I think it was a little unfair to a fan base that enjoyed the old school game. As much as I like the new Vulkans, I was expecting the old style so was a little disappointed when the design was so radically changed... but that expectation was generated by the 'resurrection' in the title... so I can understand the disappointment from the Old School Posse.

[Prodos]

Maybe it is called Resurrection for more than one reason, i.e. the resurrection of a game that at least commercially (as far as the IP owners were concerned) and with regard to its fluff progression was 'dead', but also other reasons that will become clear as the game and story behind it progresses.

I disagree that it was unfair to call it a resurrection and to do so mislead old fans. Any resurrection results in something different to the original (at least I can think of none that don't). I think that the word that best describes the new is 'Re-imagining', but lets be honest Warzone Re-Imagined' would be a rubbish title. It also could have just been called 'Warzone' ala the rebooted 'Battlestar Gallactica', which again was very different to the original of the 70s. But this I think would have been even more misleading if your point is correct.

And remember this new version of Warzone does not preclude the older versions or their models from being used. Infact we the team behind WZR have done our upmost to ensure that old models can be used in the new game and vice versa.

Really all that WZR does is allow more choice for the WZ fan. New models and a new rule set, why is that bad? No one has to buy the new (or the old), but WZR has generated a lot of new interest in the IP and lets be honest everything WZ. Lets not beat up people who choose new or who choose old.

Another point: The difference between WZR and UWZ is so more apparent than other long serving systems because of the long hiatus. Theres people out there who choose to play say GW 40k version 2 with those versions of models, does it matter to them that there are 6 versions in total and a lot of new and different models.

If we also go back to GW in the time of WZ Ed 1 and 2 their models also looked a lot different (dreadnaught, necron, orks terminators, LR Rhinos for example) and when comparing WZR to older versions of WZ there are a lot more new stuff (GW flyers, tank variants, new units etc).

Things change, arguably they progress! I love some of the old models and have spent many hours painting them, I also love the new, but I personally am pleased to have new life in WZ and the new communities, models and rules it results in.

 

[rob_the_robgoblin]

What he said!

[Agis]

Agreed to all points!
 

BTW - Any news on the shipping dates?
The KS always said: "Estimated delivery: Jun 2013".

I doubt that all minis will be shipped within the next 2 weeks, or? 

So please give us an update - if possible via the KS!

[rob_the_robgoblin]

Don't worry, they're giving an update when they have a good feeling of times. 

[Jonas]

If we also go back to GW in the time of WZ Ed 1 and 2 their models also looked a lot different (dreadnaught, necron, orks terminators, LR Rhinos for example) and when comparing WZR to older versions of WZ there are a lot more new stuff (GW flyers, tank variants, new units etc).

I really think the point of comparing Warzone changes with GW changes is pretty invalid in this discussion though. Since it seems most people on this forum is sticking to Rogue Trader and the older genereations of 40K, before it changed too much.

 

Most of your other points are fine in my book though.

[Agis]

Don't worry, they're giving an update when they have a good feeling of times. 

I am afraid that this will not be enough for many who pledged!
 
The estimated delivery date is - of course - estimated, but as soon as it comes closer you have to give at least an update, or even better deliver something! 

[sundayhero]

Is there any french translation project planned for the rules (and future addons) ?

[Malebolgia]

The first Praetorian Renders were rendered badly by the sculptor and they had to be redone.

First renders:


New actual sculpts:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zr5Mi42GoME&feature=youtu.be

The difference is enormous!. I think the lovers of old Warzone will love these, they are so true to the old style