Star Wars VII Discussion Thread (was: Star Wars new trailer)

[supervike]

I think the critics have some good points, but ultimately, it was pretty fun to watch and 'felt' star warsy.

I also do not hate the Prequels (but freely admit they SHOULD have been much better and could have been so)  But they had some great elements.


All that being said, a few little tweaks I think would have helped make the story a bit better.

1.  Rey should have had an earlier scene (for instance in the crashed Destroyer) where she uses the 'force' instinctually.  Without any thought.   Maybe to save herself from a fall, or stop something from fallng on her.  It could have been done with her still not being sure what exactly happened.  This would have gone a long way to show why she got so powerful so quickly, once she learned the 'force' was a real thing, and not just myth.  She had it all along, just not aware of it.

2.  Kylo Ren should have not unmasked at all, until the scene with his Father.  That would have made that scene way more impactful, and shown that he, even if he is a evil sith wannabe, still is torn.  Dad says "take that thing off, you don't need it".  THAT should have been his first unmasking.  It would have also been cool to get that 'hey, he's just a angry kid' vibe right then as well.
 
BUt those are minor quibbles, I'm still excited that it was decently realized and enjoyed the heck out of it.

Bring on the Directors cut and Blu Rey(Ray)....


EDITTED TO ADD:  Oh, and I LOVED Fury Road.   Probably my favorite film of the year.

[Captain Blood]

This has nothing to do with the quality of the film and everything to do with your intestinal fortitude... ...Luckily I dont think he has seen blade runner so I might be able to get away with watching the directors cut of that GOOD sci fi film instead of this lump of poorly made crud we are discussing.

Just keep it civil please. You don't like the movie - we get it. You're entitled to your view - although your rage seems disproportionate. Say what you don't like about the film by all means. But personal comments and vitriol aimed at belittling other people's views aren't acceptable. So please cut it out.

[majorsmith]

I think you guys take this movie way too seriously, it's a 12 rated film in the uk, switch adult mode off and get back to when you first watched the other films, if you watched this back then you would love it. It's a fairytale in space.

[Inso]

After reading all the comments on here, I can only add one thing...

... I am SO glad that there wasn't a Jar-Jar Binks character in the film that I am able to look past some (if not all  ) of the obvious flaws.

OK... maybe two things...

I am also glad that BB-8 was such a cool little character that didn't become a robotic version of Jar-Jar.

I felt a little empty when I left the cinema... like I had seen a good film... but it did little for me.

I enjoyed it... the time flew... but... I was waiting for something new to happen and it hadn't. I can't say I was disappointed because it was entertaining and had all of the flavour of a Star Wars movie... but there was nothing new.

If you hadn't seen A New Hope, this film would be much better.

I'm looking forward to a semi-robotic Darth Maul turning up in Episode VIII 

[Gibby]

I think you guys take this movie way too seriously, it's a 12 rated film in the uk, switch adult mode off and get back to when you first watched the other films, if you watched this back then you would love it. It's a fairytale in space.

Well said. I reckon if IV, V and VI came out today, plenty online would be picking them to bits.

[nullBolt]

I always find it funny when I hear people argue stuff like, "It's just Star Wars, you shouldn't expect clever plot lines."

Star Wars has some great plotlines in the EU. Even more mainstream stuff like KotOR has an exploration of good and evil (well, 2 does) and shows that the Force, even in it's very black and white nature, may not hold the answers to moral quandaries.

I'm not expecting KotOR2, but I'm expecting something with an inventive and intriguing plotline. If you erased the EU then you have literally anything you want to work with. It's like being given godly powers and using them to just feed and clothe yourself. Meaningless.

[Vermis]

I always find it funny when I hear people argue stuff like, "It's just Star Wars, you shouldn't expect clever plot lines."

Yup! I'm partly in Scurv's frame of mind - I'd like to see more reasons why it was good, not scoldings to ignore that it was mediocre. I don't even want clever plot lines, just ones that aren't confused.

I'm about done, anyway. I'll just say I could overlook the inconsistencies and plot holes and enjoy it - as I did with the first three movies (I actually like ewoks, for the luvva Mike) - if there wasn't such a suspension-of-disbelief-breaking, push-you-out-of-the-story element in the form of guess who.

If she actually develops a character in the next movie, beyond the new 'chosen one', I'll be less of a Comic Book Guy about it.

[Captain Blood]

Yup! I'm partly in Scurv's frame of mind - I'd like to see more reasons why it was good, not scoldings to ignore that it was mediocre.

It's not incumbent on anyone here to argue why they like something.
There are lots of pieces of music I like. I'd find it quite hard to articulate why I like them. And I shouldn't have to. That's the nature of creative stuff - music, film, art. It works at an emotional level. I like it / you don't like it. Fair enough.

It's perfectly reasonable to not like something. It's okay to criticise. God knows, I do it all the time - models I don't like. TV programmes I don't like. Conventions I don't like. Say your piece by all means.
But a/ I try to keep it proportionate, friendly and avoid inflammatory language. And b/ I don't demand that people defend their opposing view. Express your dislike the movie as much as you like. But don't start getting on other people's backs because they don't happen to share your view or because they don't want to get into an argument about it.
That's all

[Westfalia Chris]

Well then,

following the locking by the good Captain, which I consider to have been necessary, I have decided to re-open this thread.

I would, however, strongly remind everybody that we will not tolerate ad hominem attacks of any kind. Still, in order to provide the discussion with proper momentum, both sides of the spectrum should provide some discussion points.

Back to topic, then!

I saw the film last weekend (2d, German dub) and will go to see the 3d English version on Sunday. Personally, I would have preferred a slightly revamped version of the Thrawn trilogy rather than what we have now, but IMHO, it does show some promise and has me thinking about an "alternate design Star Wars project", which is a good thing in my book.

Why did I like it? Very nice special effects, not too much VFX overkill, although some parts come close. Likeable characters with some potential if they don't mess it up too much. Good thing they got Kasdan for the script.

Foremost though, a lot of vehicles and scenes that lend themselves to 28mm. Planning for a First Order transport build as I type, although I also liked the ramshackle rebel resistance shuttle very much.

I wasn't too fond of the very "meta-heavy" parts, what with all the reference jokes - just a bit too thickly applied. Too much reliance on out-of-the-movie information - once I googled the stuff after the movie, it did make sense (e.g. Hosnian, demobilization), but the movie would have greatly benefitted from some strategically-placed expository dialogue without reverting to a wordfest.

Also, some very manifest stupidity on the Neo-Empire's side. Misallocation of resources if I ever saw it.

Finally, on the good side again, I quite liked the courage they had with regards to the survivability of established characters.

I hope that the next movie will be a bit "braver" and more stringent the way ESB was in regard to ANH.

And with that, feel free to discuss.

[Mark Plant]

The main disappointment, and let's be honest I'm on this board because of it, is the lack of new vehicles and races for us wargamers in the new film. If someone released a new set that works with the WotC prepaints I was prepared to be all over them. Thousands of dollars worth of all over them.

But the same characters repeated (Han, Leia, Chewbacca) -- no thank you -- and Ren is just another evil dude in black cloak with light sabre. That silly wee yellow female figure with the glasses isn't going to cut much swathe on the wargames table.

Stormtroopers that aren't the same won't merge with my current collection, and ones that are the same won't give me much extra variety. Where were the cool jet bike type things? Instead we get more Tie fighters and X-wings!

What new races did we get, or extra variety of old ones that will pad out our ranges -- where were the Twileks, the Rodians, the Trandoshans and I was really hoping for a Hutt.

So all told, very disappointed.    This was an excellent marketing opportunity to sell me stuff and instead I got a bunch of stormtroopers and rebel fighters wearing the same old kit.

[NurgleHH]

I saw the movie last monday (German version). J.J. Abrams suprised me with a good and fast story. It works well with old story going to new story. At the end you want to see the second part as fast as possible. No too long lasersword duels or battles. This movie works. So, for me it is very good. As wargamer it is nice, that I can use my old Westendgames miniatures for part seven. So, I am also as wargamer not dissapointed.

But it is my opinion, other ideas about the movie may be also ok. May the force be with all of us...

[Andym]

Ok the good points.
1. You could obviously see where they spent the money. The film looked amazing. From the sfx to the sets, all brilliant.

2. The new characters came across as very likeable. Finn, Rey, Rylo(when they eventually let his character show through) and the guy that played the Empire First Order General were ALL great.

3. The Millenium Falcon. Nuff said.

4. Harrison Ford. It's best thing he's been in for a long while and, for me, he makes the film.


Bad points.

1. The story was too much of a re-hash of the originals. I agree with Chris, the Admiral Thrawn book trilogy would have been a good way forward instead.

2. Rey's Jedi skills seemed to appear out of no where. One minute she didn't know how to do certain things, the next second she was a master at it.

3. The new Stormtroopers seemed to have awfully big heads for their bodies. I don't remember them being that bad in the originals!

.....and the most important one for me.....

4. I have to wait a year and a half for the next one!,

Overall, a good film....and for me, the good points outweigh the bad.

[nullBolt]

3. The new Stormtroopers seemed to have awfully big heads for their bodies. I don't remember them being that bad in the originals!

They were just as big but the old Stormtrooper head design was a lot better:




The old helmets had the "head" bit only be the upper half. The new ones have it be the whole thing which gives them a real bobblehead look. Not really intimidating.

[Mason]

Not so keen on the new Stormie look myself.
Those helmets keep making me think of an old fashioned and exaggerated moustache,  Poirot-style.
 

[wolfie907]

I liked it I would  rate it higher than rotj because no ewoks ( loved them as a kid but they are no good walking teddy bears come on now) was quite happy with bb8 even though he essentially  stole r2's part   Rey was alright even force powers up till she kicked the new Vader ass with no training at all  for me the best star wars is esb hands down so I was cool with them making it like a new hope but with better effects that movie is great and the special effects were awesome but we have better tech now I think the new one is prettier the little orange lady was not the greatest but definitely  better than the weirdos in Jabbas palace Han was great like what they did with the character lent some weight to the film it was telegraphed but good none the less Finn was good but I'll agree that he was way to convenient and his attitude doesn't fit the background I was most disappointed  by Leia Carrie Fischer was very stilted and her interaction with Han didn't feel right while they copied the death star I think they cleaned up the weak point much more convincingly what with having to take out shields on the ground  then open a hole  then fly into the guts and had to cause major damage instead of just hitting one spot